6 Sabres make NHL’s top 125 list

[dudacek]

Annual Athletic ranking is out.

They don’t specifically assign numbers, but instead group players within tiers: MVP, franchise, all-star and 1st-line

Dahlin is “franchise” in the 25-30 range with Hintz, Hischier, Marchand, Hedman and Karlsson

Tage is in the “all-star” tier in  the 30-40 range, ranking with group that includes Devon Toews, Slavin, Lindholm, Stone, Stutzle, Panarin, Nylander and Gaudreau.

The other 4 are 1st-liners:

Tuch in a grouping at 70-95

Power in the 95-112 group

Cozens and Skinner in the 112 to 125 group

Dahlin was the only Sabre on last year’s list, and made one of the biggest climbs according to the writers.

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by dudacek

[nfreeman]

Skinner is there too!

[dudacek]

2 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

Skinner is there too!

Not sure how I missed him.

Editing to the OP

[PASabreFan]

This seems... average?

[GASabresIUFAN]

They also did a NA u23 Team of 20 players from the US and Canada.  The Sabres had 3 players - Cozens, Power and Levi.  

NJ also has 3 - Mercer, J Hughes, and L Hughes

Det, Ott, & Minn with 2 each - Det - Raymond and Seider; Ott- Stuzle and Sanderson; MN - Boldy and Faber. 

https://theathletic.com/4853786/2023/09/15/chl-nhl-transfer-agreement/

[GASabresIUFAN]

2 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

If talent was "evenly" distributed each team would have about 4 players.  The Sabres have 6, after only Dahlin being listed a year ago.  

I read their take on Tage.  The say he doesn't compete hard enough in the D zone.  It's an interesting comment.  I think it has some validity, but was it a function of the player not being interested or the system DG had them running?

[dudacek]

3 minutes ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

Mathematically average would be a tad under 4.

Carolina and Edmonton had 7. Just did a quick look and might have missed somebody, but they appear to be the only teams with more.

[dudacek]

5 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

If talent was "evenly" distributed each team would have about 4 players.  The Sabres have 6, after only Dahlin being listed a year ago.  

I read their take on Tage.  The say he doesn't compete hard enough in the D zone.  It's an interesting comment.  I think it has some validity, but was it a function of the player not being interested or the system DG had them running?

The write-ups for both Tage and Ras had some pushback: basically 'don't trust they have the defence"

Cozens was a guy who didn't make the cut initially, but was added after the list (built in-house by Athletic analysts) was vetted by NHL professionals and adjusted using their feedback

[shrader]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

And let's be honest, average is something we all would have killed for over the last decade.  Just imagine if they had an average goalie last year.

[LGR4GM]

3 hours ago, dudacek said:

Annual Athletic ranking is out.

They don’t specifically assign numbers, but instead group players within tiers: MVP, franchise, all-star and 1st-line

Dahlin is “franchise” in the 25-30 range with Hintz, Hischier, Marchand, Hedman and Karlsson

Tage is in the “all-star” tier in  the 30-40 range, ranking with group that includes Devon Toews, Slavin, Lindholm, Stone, Stutzle, Panarin, Nylander and Gaudreau.

The other 4 are 1st-liners:

Tuch in a grouping at 70-95

Power in the 95-112 group

Cozens and Skinner in the 112 to 125 group

Dahlin was the only Sabre on last year’s list, and made one of the biggest climbs according to the writers.

 

That list is trash. I'm sorry but Rasmus Dahlin is as good or better than Fox and Makar at this point. There are what, 4 other defenders you could rank around Dahlin overall and their criteria is "The best player on almost any team in the league." and that is Dahlin. I can't wait for this season, he's not going to turn heads so much as break necks. 

[inkman]

2 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

As other have mentioned, it’s a little above average.  Considering where they came from, it feels nice to see our boys on this list. I’m sure we had a few guys during the Eichel heyday (was there such a thing), Kane, O’Reilly, Reinhart to name a few but we can all agree that they are much more of a team than individual performers like that bunch. 

[dudacek]

14 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

That list is trash. I'm sorry but Rasmus Dahlin is as good or better than Fox and Makar at this point. There are what, 4 other defenders you could rank around Dahlin overall and their criteria is "The best player on almost any team in the league." and that is Dahlin. I can't wait for this season, he's not going to turn heads so much as break necks. 

Agree with you 100% with Dahlin.

Thing is, there are plenty of players (Hintz, Robertson) that I don’t watch enough to fairly judge. But I’d bet that the same applies to their panel as well.

And I have seen plenty of Eichel and Point and Marner and Barkov and Hischier and I would take Dahlin over any of them.

They had the money quote: “I’ll believe it when I see him do it again.”

The doubt is largely a Buffalo tax he is paying for the Krueger era and for not making the playoffs. You’ve got observers simply not believing their own numbers or their own eyes.

Edited September 18, 2023 by dudacek

[GASabresIUFAN]

11 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Agree with you 100% with Dahlin.

Thing is, there are plenty of players (Hintz, Robertson) that I don’t watch enough to fairly judge. But I’d bet that the same applies to their panel as well.

And I have seen plenty of Eichel and Point and Marner and Barkov and Hischier and I would take Dahlin over any of them.

They had the money quote: “I’ll believe it when I see him do it again.”

The doubt is largely a Buffalo tax he is paying for the Krueger era and for not making the playoffs. You’ve got observers simply not believing their own numbers or their own eyes.

I agree that the Sabres aren't getting the benefit of the doubt to a certain extent.  The Dahlin defensive comments are kind of a joke.  He was clearly putting in the effort to play hard on both ends.  I don't know why someone would think he'd stop giving that effort for the coming season. 

What is clear is that, whether you like this list or you don't, it's a pretty good barometer that the league is recognizing the development of the young Sabres into a very good team. You don't go from 1 player listed in the NHL top 125 to 6 in one season by accident.  Wait til next year when Levi and possibly JJP, Quinn or Mitts make the list.  

Remember this list is backwards looking.  Yes, they try to project the player going forward, but it's really a case of what have you done for me lately.  It's why Fox and Makar are listed ahead of Dahlin.  I don't think either is a better all-around D than Dahlin, but Fox is the catalyst for a playoff team and Makar is a catalyst for a Cup winning team.  Until the Sabres are a consistent playoff team our players will be viewed with some scepticism.

 

Edited September 18, 2023 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

Also raises an interesting point, particular in the context of @PASabreFan’s recent post about the room questioning the franchise’s commitment to winning, and others questioning the lack of talent acquisition this off-season.

This piece should serve as a very good barometer of the current league-wide perception of the Sabres:

They have an all-star centre flanked by 2 1st-line wingers, a franchise defenceman, another 1st-pairing defenceman with upside, and a 1st-line centre anchoring their second line.

That comprises a core with high-end players in all the key slots (goalies weren’t included), a pattern not a lot of teams match.

What exactly do we have here?

Edited September 18, 2023 by dudacek

[GASabresIUFAN]

6 minutes ago, dudacek said:

What exactly do we have here?

Until we cut our goals against by at least 30 goals, we are a high-octane goal-scoring machine that can't make the playoffs because we don't stop the other teams from scoring.

[Doohickie]

4 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

Average would be 3.9

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Until we cut our goals against by at least 30 goals, we are a high-octane goal-scoring machine that can't make the playoffs because we don't stop the other teams from scoring.

I don't have the stats but in the end of the season playoff run the Sabres did play a tighter brand of two-way hockey. Even when Tage and Dahlin were impaired, the team played a playoff style of play. I don't expect this style of play for a full season but even if it is done to a lesser-extent it should have positive repercussions. 

[steveoath]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I don't have the stats but in the end of the season playoff run the Sabres did play a tighter brand of two-way hockey. Even when Tage and Dahlin were impaired, the team played a playoff style of play. I don't expect this style of play for a full season but even if it is done to a lesser-extent it should have positive repercussions. 

And shows that they should be able to play “playoff hockey” when the time comes. 

[...]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

Mathematically average would be a tad under 4.

Carolina and Edmonton had 7. Just did a quick look and might have missed somebody, but they appear to be the only teams with more.

Average would mean the list represented only 20.83 teams.

[PromoTheRobot]

8 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

This seems... average?

Is it? Let's do the math.

125 slots divided by 32 teams = 3.9.  So "average" would be having 4 players on the list. The Sabres have 6. Hence ABOVE average.

[PASabreFan]

9 hours ago, dudacek said:

Also raises an interesting point, particular in the context of @PASabreFan’s recent post about the room questioning the franchise’s commitment to winning, and others questioning the lack of talent acquisition this off-season.

This piece should serve as a very good barometer of the current league-wide perception of the Sabres:

They have an all-star centre flanked by 2 1st-line wingers, a franchise defenceman, another 1st-pairing defenceman with upside, and a 1st-line centre anchoring their second line.

That comprises a core with high-end players in all the key slots (goalies weren’t included), a pattern not a lot of teams match.

What exactly do we have here?

A ***** head coach? Only two teams have more top end talent and you miss the playoffs?

Wait. Is this The Athletic's list or the NHL's?

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

A ***** head coach? Only two teams have more top end talent and you miss the playoffs?

Wait. Is this The Athletic's list or the NHL's?

It’s developed and prepared by a panel of Athletic staffers, vetted through a large group of NHL coaches, scouts and executives, and adjusted based on their feedback.

So a cross section of hockey industry observers and professionals.

[Drag0nDan]

On 9/18/2023 at 11:01 AM, GASabresIUFAN said:

If talent was "evenly" distributed each team would have about 4 players.  The Sabres have 6, after only Dahlin being listed a year ago.  

I read their take on Tage.  The say he doesn't compete hard enough in the D zone.  It's an interesting comment.  I think it has some validity, but was it a function of the player not being interested or the system DG had them running?

I would say the backchecking up the middle needs to improve across the board.  Too many transition shots from the high slot without getting our stick or body in there.