Buffalo Bills 2018-2019

[...]

I do not get all of the "hating" on Allen.  I know very little about football other than the games I catch on TV, but last night Allen looked like he has the stuff to be something the Bills haven't had in a looooooonnnng time.  The book on him at the draft, if memory serves, was that he has the tools but is a project: "inconsistent accuracy and decision making".  If last night is the level of inconsistency they're dealing with in Allen, this guy very well could turn into a stud. I think McDermott is absolutely the right guy for Allen to develop under.

Edited August 10, 2018 by ...

[WildCard]

I want to see him with the ones so he can have a clean pocket; I need to know he's not going to panic and abandon it

[erickompositör72]

24 minutes ago, WildCard said:

I want to see him with the ones so he can have a clean pocket; I need to know he's not going to panic and abandon it

He didn't panic and stepped up in not-so-clean pockets, so I didn't come away with that concern...

 

With that said, there is a lot that still needs to be seen. I hope he gets a chance w/ the 1st offense sooner than later.

[stuuuuuuuuu]

Rosen has his preseason debut tonight.  I preferred Allen at the draft but will be interested in seeing what Rosen can do.

[JujuFish]

Allen has the strongest arm I've seen on a Bills QB. Multiple 60+ yard passes through the air, and he made it look effortless.

[...]

12 minutes ago, erickompositör72 said:

He didn't panic and stepped up in not-so-clean pockets, so I didn't come away with that concern...

 

With that said, there is a lot that still needs to be seen. I hope he gets a chance w/ the 1st offense sooner than later.

Agreed that there is still a lot to be seen, but given what he had to work with and it was his FIRST "realz" NFL experience, I was left wondering what all of the so-called experts were talking about.

[WildCard]

14 minutes ago, erickompositör72 said:

He didn't panic and stepped up in not-so-clean pockets, so I didn't come away with that concern...

 

With that said, there is a lot that still needs to be seen. I hope he gets a chance w/ the 1st offense sooner than later.

I saw him run a good bit there, as well as back paddling and getting himself into dangerous, long sack situations

[stuuuuuuuuu]

1 minute ago, WildCard said:

I saw him run a good bit there, as well as back paddling and getting himself into dangerous, long sack situations

Big Ben used to take those hits early in his career too.  The key is for Josh to keep those positive runs and eliminate the stupid ones.  Time will tell

[Mustache of God]

Those highlights are the first time I've ever seen Allen throw a football and I'm impressed. The kid has a cannon and throws with some zip I haven't seen since...I don't even know (don't follow football much). It should be fun to see once he's ready to take the reigns. Curious to see him line up against a non 3rd string defense and with better players to throw to.

I know the plan is to let him marinate and learn, but man, imagine having a QB who can throw with speed paired up with the threat of Shady in the backfield? The past few seasons the Bills have gotten burned by teams stacking the box to crush the run and make Tyrod "be a QB". Looks like we have someone who can throw now, which will ensure defenses won't be able to cheat on Shady.

 

[Hoss]

 

5 hours ago, WildCard said:

I saw him run a good bit there, as well as back paddling and getting himself into dangerous, long sack situations

There was a total of one “long-sack” situation and it was on a 4th down play where the running back forgot to block so he had someone on him the second he turned. I’m not overly concerned about that one play even though a bunch of people on twitter are cherry picking it. He’s used to being stronger and more athletic than some edge rushers he played so he probably thought he could get the edge. Panicked when he didn’t. Easy to coach and learn from.

[WildCard]

2 hours ago, Hoss said:

 

There was a total of one “long-sack” situation and it was on a 4th down play where the running back forgot to block so he had someone on him the second he turned. I’m not overly concerned about that one play even though a bunch of people on twitter are cherry picking it. He’s used to being stronger and more athletic than some edge rushers he played so he probably thought he could get the edge. Panicked when he didn’t. Easy to coach and learn from.

I saw three times but maybe that's just me I guess

Darnold looked very, very good tonight

[Hoss]

15 minutes ago, WildCard said:

I saw three times but maybe that's just me I guess

Darnold looked very, very good tonight

Didn’t watch Darnold but luckily I won’t waste any time comparing him to Allen from a Bills standpoint since he wasn’t attainable for them. I see from a stats perspective he was very Tyrod (which isn’t a knock for a rookie in his first NFL game time).

[Brawndo]

As Hoss said they did not have a chance to draft Darnold, however per Jeremy White he was their first choice 

 

 

[JujuFish]

9 hours ago, Hoss said:

Didn’t watch Darnold but luckily I won’t waste any time comparing him to Allen from a Bills standpoint since he wasn’t attainable for them. I see from a stats perspective he was very Tyrod (which isn’t a knock for a rookie in his first NFL game time).

#3 was originally the Colts pick, so you could argue that he was attainable.

[Hoss]

1 minute ago, JujuFish said:

#3 was originally the Colts pick, so you could argue that he was attainable.

The Colts said after the deal they made it because they didn’t want to drop too far so they got value while still staying in the range they wanted. The Giants were said to be firmly at 2. I was always of the mind they should trade whatever it took to get as high as they could. Beane said once the clock got to number four they knew they had more to give than anyone else and waited it out until a second first was off the board.

[JujuFish]

1 hour ago, Hoss said:

The Colts said after the deal they made it because they didn’t want to drop too far so they got value while still staying in the range they wanted. The Giants were said to be firmly at 2. I was always of the mind they should trade whatever it took to get as high as they could. Beane said once the clock got to number four they knew they had more to give than anyone else and waited it out until a second first was off the board.

The Colts showed they were willing to deal, so it's possible to make them an offer they wouldn't refuse.

Now, it may be true that the offer would have to have been completely disastrous for the franchise (especially since the Jets gave up three second rounders to move up three spots), but I'm sure it was possible.

[TrueBlueGED]

21 hours ago, ... said:

I do not get all of the "hating" on Allen.  I know very little about football other than the games I catch on TV, but last night Allen looked like he has the stuff to be something the Bills haven't had in a looooooonnnng time.  The book on him at the draft, if memory serves, was that he has the tools but is a project: "inconsistent accuracy and decision making".  If last night is the level of inconsistency they're dealing with in Allen, this guy very well could turn into a stud. I think McDermott is absolutely the right guy for Allen to develop under.

The hate is because he looked kinda like hot smoldering garbage in most of his college games, particularly when he had to move through his progressions and faced pressure. He has absolutely scintillating physical tools, as evidenced by his TD throw (I still can't believe he threaded that needle). There's a reason scouts love him, and he'll have his share of "wow" moments as a result. But the NFL QBs routinely making deep playoff runs do so on their reads, anticipation, and timing...if they have an otherworldly arm that's definitely a bonus, but it's not what drives the success. Allen didn't display many of the Brady/Manning/Brees qualities in college with any consistency. 

History may show that it really was due to some combination of his teammates, system, and being raw. But the pre-draft critiques weren't without merit, and there aren't many QBs in history who have overcome his particular flaws. As such, skepticism isn't unwarranted.

That said, plenty of his critics won't give him any credit until they have no other choice because they were so hard on him pre-draft. I hope I don't end up in that group, but I don't think it's unreasonable to withhold praise at this point. He had a couple great throws, and I don't want to take that away from him. But those throws we already knew he could make. He also had a few moments where he showed the same flaws as in college: he only completed 47% of his passes and showed panic under pressure. And it was in preseason game #1 with/against 3rd stringers where not a single soul does an ounce of game planning.

Some good, some bad, giant meh. If he shows me he has conquered his flaws in regular season action, sign me the hell up and I might even spring for my first jersey since Fred Jackson was in his prime. But I just don't put any stock in preseason. None whatsoever. If I did, I might be signing the praises of Nathan Peterman. 

[tom webster]

What history shows is that while there are trends and guides as to what makes a great NFL quarterback, nobody has an ironclad formula. 

I have no problem with well thought out analysis explaining someone’s view point. It’s the absolutes that are laughable.

[erickompositör72]

all I know is this: Josh Allen has a "wow factor" that none of the other 1st rounders have. I hope it translates into wins.

[Hoss]

3 minutes ago, tom webster said:

What history shows is that while there are trends and guides as to what makes a great NFL quarterback, nobody has an ironclad formula. 

I have no problem with well thought out analysis explaining someone’s view point. It’s the absolutes that are laughable.

I absolutely agree that this post is absolutely correct in absolutely every way.

[TrueBlueGED]

37 minutes ago, erickompositör72 said:

all I know is this: Josh Allen has a "wow factor" that none of the other 1st rounders have. I hope it translates into wins.

That's really only true if the only thing you are wowed by is arm strength. 

[TrueBlueGED]

41 minutes ago, tom webster said:

What history shows is that while there are trends and guides as to what makes a great NFL quarterback, nobody has an ironclad formula. 

I have no problem with well thought out analysis explaining someone’s view point. It’s the absolutes that are laughable.

Totally fair. Saying Allen was undraftable were obviously over the top takes. On the other hand, "every flaw is coachable" is a pretty bad take too. But generally, yea, I've said in the past everyone is an idiot when it comes to projecting QBs. Still pretty true. 

[WildCard]

1 hour ago, erickompositör72 said:

all I know is this: Josh Allen has a "wow factor" that none of the other 1st rounders have. I hope it translates into wins.

The only two QBs with a 'wow' factor that have won anything in recent memory are Rodgers and Big Ben. Rivers, Brees, Brady, Peyton...they never wow'ed anybody with their athleticism 

1 hour ago, TrueBlueGED said:

That's really only true if the only thing you are wowed by is arm strength. 

Eh he can break tackles and is a good runner. He really is just Can Newton

[bg17]

2 hours ago, TrueBlueGED said:

... and showed panic under pressure. 

I just watched the video of all his throws and runs and saw a lot more poise than panic. He left the pocket when he was forced to or when he saw an easy run. Eye of the beholder. 

[MakeSabresGrr8Again]

3 hours ago, TrueBlueGED said:

The hate is because he looked kinda like hot smoldering garbage in most of his college games, particularly when he had to move through his progressions and faced pressure. He has absolutely scintillating physical tools, as evidenced by his TD throw (I still can't believe he threaded that needle). There's a reason scouts love him, and he'll have his share of "wow" moments as a result. But the NFL QBs routinely making deep playoff runs do so on their reads, anticipation, and timing...if they have an otherworldly arm that's definitely a bonus, but it's not what drives the success. Allen didn't display many of the Brady/Manning/Brees qualities in college with any consistency. 

History may show that it really was due to some combination of his teammates, system, and being raw. But the pre-draft critiques weren't without merit, and there aren't many QBs in history who have overcome his particular flaws. As such, skepticism isn't unwarranted.

That said, plenty of his critics won't give him any credit until they have no other choice because they were so hard on him pre-draft. I hope I don't end up in that group, but I don't think it's unreasonable to withhold praise at this point. He had a couple great throws, and I don't want to take that away from him. But those throws we already knew he could make. He also had a few moments where he showed the same flaws as in college: he only completed 47% of his passes and showed panic under pressure. And it was in preseason game #1 with/against 3rd stringers where not a single soul does an ounce of game planning.

Some good, some bad, giant meh. If he shows me he has conquered his flaws in regular season action, sign me the hell up and I might even spring for my first jersey since Fred Jackson was in his prime. But I just don't put any stock in preseason. None whatsoever. If I did, I might be signing the praises of Nathan Peterman. 

But he'll need to show something quickly or he still won't get any credit......credit will go to "coaching".