Off Season Game Plan

[Weave]

This is one of the reasons I keep pointing to 2019/20 as the real turnaround of this team. For example lets say that Asplund and Olofsson adjust quickly to the NA game and thrive in the AHL next season. Now add them to a base of Nylander, Mittelstadt, Sam, Jack, ROR, and a healthy KO. That us the makings of a very strong and talented top 9.

 

 

 

I just don't see how anyone here can get that excited over Asplund, Olofsson, Nylander, and, at this point KO as well.  Nylander is the highest rated of the bunch and he's a season away from busting.  I think you guys are fecking nuts.

[thewookie1]

I just don't see how anyone here can get that excited over Asplund, Olofsson, Nylander, and, at this point KO as well. Nylander is the highest rated of the bunch and he's a season away from busting. I think you guys are fecking nuts.

Go watch the Sunshine thread’s videos for three hours then come back. You’re so negative that you are making pi go nuts. Nylander is not a bust not close to one yet, he’s barely 20

[Weave]

Go watch the Sunshine thread’s videos for three hours then come back. You’re so negative that you are making pi go nuts. Nylander is not a bust not close to one yet, he’s barely 20

 

Pi was never not nuts.

[thewookie1]

Pi was never not nuts.

That is true....

[pi2000]

Nylander was a bust two seasons ago. And he's still a bust. The longer they wait to trade him, the less valuable he is. It's time to cut bait.

 

Why is everyone so enamored with him? If he was drafted in 5th round he be buried in the minors, which is where he belongs. He's done nothing to deserve a look over guys like Blackwell and Gill.

[dudacek]

Man, at least give ??? a chance before tossing him. He looked good in juniors this year.Separately, if Eichel plays with Okposo next year I will rip every strand of hair off of my head.

Your distaste for Okposo has been made abundantly clear, but wasn’t Kyles best hockey played in January, the only time he was playing with Jack?

 

Not sure exactly when they were partners, but Kyle put up 12 points in 12 games and Jack 14.

Seems a better option for Jack than most and the best option to maximize Kyle.

I just don't see how anyone here can get that excited over Asplund, Olofsson, Nylander, and, at this point KO as well.  Nylander is the highest rated of the bunch and he's a season away from busting.  I think you guys are fecking nuts.

  

Nylander was a bust two seasons ago. And he's still a bust. The longer they wait to trade him, the less valuable he is. It's time to cut bait.

Why is everyone so enamored with him? If he was drafted in 5th round he be buried in the minors, which is where he belongs. He's done nothing to deserve a look over guys like Blackwell and Gill.

Curious what you guys thought of Nylanders NHL performance this year.

[Randall Flagg]

Your distaste for Okposo has been made abundantly clear, but wasn’t Kyles best hockey played in January, the only time he was playing with Jack?

 

Not sure exactly when they were partners, but Kyle put up 12 points in 12 games and Jack 14.

Seems a better option for Jack than most and the best option to maximize Kyle.

  

Curious what you guys thought of Nylanders NHL performance this year.

This is Jack's fourth year. It's time to do better for him than what we got out of Kyle this season on one side, and worse on the other side. 

 

We need guys who can hang onto the ###### puck for more than 2 seconds. It's ludicrous how much potential and time we've wasted, and KO being there is part of the problem. 

 

I haven't fully formulated my take on this yet, but unless Mittelstadt comes in ready to be a star or we add a legitimate 3C, I'm very heavily leaning towards Jack, ROR, and Sam spending their season together 5v5.

Edited April 8, 2018 by Randall Flagg

[Taro T]

Your distaste for Okposo has been made abundantly clear, but wasn’t Kyles best hockey played in January, the only time he was playing with Jack?

Not sure exactly when they were partners, but Kyle put up 12 points in 12 games and Jack 14.

Seems a better option for Jack than most and the best option to maximize Kyle.  

 

Curious what you guys thought of Nylanders NHL performance this year.

To the 1st bolded, unless Sergachev or Zadina are brought in (or better yet, Tavares ;)) that is probably the best choice of RW for Eichel to maximize all 3 top lines potential. Unfortunately.

 

To the 2nd bolded, he didn't #### dead monkeys, which was some of our expectations, so there's that. :unsure:

 

He did last year in his call up. So, he's improved. :lol:

 

Waaay too small a sample to say any more than he's better than he was last year.

[sweetlou]

I think top 6 is something JBots will work with unless an unbelievable offer is made for Okposo, ROR, or Reinhart.

 

I would go with 

 

Mittelstadt, Eichel, Okposo

Nylander, ROR, Reinhart

 

I think Mittelstadt can be our version of Barzal or Marner. Play second fiddle to Eichel and has the speed and talent to keep up.  I really think he looked comfortable in his 6 game trial. Next year he should have the confidence to take even more chances offensively.

 

Besides the obvious of goaltending and finding another top three defenseman, the biggest issue to me the past three years has been the lack of scoring by our third and fourth lines. They don't need to be 20 goal scorers but they must have the ability to score 10 goals each and outscore the opponents third and fourth lines.

 

Off season additions

 

Sign UFA's

David Perron 3 years $4 million a year

Trade Larsson to Pittsburg for rights to Riley Sheehan and sign Riley Sheehan 4 years for $3 million a year.  He becomes our third line center. Good for face offs (54%,) and can get you between 10-15 goals. 

 

 

Line 3

 

Perron, Sheehan, Pommer.   (If they want Mittelstadt to play center, then you can move Perron to top line and have Sheehan move to LW)

 

Line 4

 

Baptiste, ERod, Bailey

 

I could live with this as the opening day offensive lines

 

Mittelstadt- Eichel- Okposo

Nylander- ROR- Reinhart

Perron- Sheehan- Pommer

Baptiste- ERod- Bailey

 

I give Fasching one more year in Rochester and in 2019 he moves into top line and slide Okposo to fill in Pommer on third line.

 

 

On defense

 

Draft Rasmus Dahlin

 

Three way trade with Arizona and Colorado-

 

We trade Guhle and Bogo to Arizona (Arizona gets vet and prospect for player who becomes an UFA after next season)

Arizona trades Oliver Ekman-Larson to Colorado (OEL and Barrie are very similar players)

Colorado trades Barrie to Buffalo (Buffalo gets a veteran top RD and can slide Risto to second pairing)

 

Sign Sustr from Tampa- 2 years $2 million or Luke Schenn for 2 years at $1.75 million or keep Casey Nelson 2 years at $1.5 million a year

Sign Falk to one year $700k

 

Buffalo defense

 

Scandella- Barrie

Dahlin- Risto

McCabe- Sustr/Schenn/Nelson

 

Extras-

Falk, Beaulieu

 

Goalies-

 

Sign Raanta for 2 years $4million

 

Raanta

Ullmark

Edited April 8, 2018 by sweetlou

[dudacek]

he didn't #### dead monkeys, which was some of our expectations, so there's that. :unsure:

He did last year in his call up. So, he's improved. :lol:

Waaay too small a sample to say any more than he's better than he was last year.

Im feeling the same about Nylander.

Very small sample size, but when you you remove the noise, he looked kinda like what I would expect from a talented kid who just turned 20. He was much smarter and more involved than in my previous viewings.

[CallawaySabres]

unprotected 1st, 2nd, top prospect and decent roster player.

 

St. Louis would be a perfect landing spot for O'Reilly and they would probably give a lot for him to Center Tarasenko

[nfreeman]

There is no "Pommer might return." 

 

Pommer is 100% certain to return.  He's not walking away from $5.6MM, and no one is going to take him off the Sabres' hands.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Im feeling the same about Nylander.

Very small sample size, but when you you remove the noise, he looked kinda like what I would expect from a talented kid who just turned 20. He was much smarter and more involved than in my previous viewings.

I wonder if people would feel different about Nylander if he was sent back to the OHL, dominated there and then had this past season in the AHL. I think everyone would chalk it up to the injury, but still say he was a top prospect.

 

Nylander is a talent prospect who improved this season after he returned from injury. He played ok in his Nhl games and will have a legit shot at making the Sabres in the fall. We need his talent.

[Randall Flagg]

There is no "Pommer might return." 

 

Pommer is 100% certain to return.  He's not walking away from $5.6MM, and no one is going to take him off the Sabres' hands.

But considering he was already our ~12th best forward this year, if not worse, it should be easy for our GM to make him press box material. 

 

The problem is that coaches rarely seem to have the stones to do that to a veteran for some reason. But it's so, so necessary if we want to be competing with other teams each and every shift rather than crossing our fingers and hoping we're okay until ROR catches his breath, the way we have been doing it for 3 years.

[GASabresIUFAN]

There is no "Pommer might return." 

 

Pommer is 100% certain to return.  He's not walking away from $5.6MM, and no one is going to take him off the Sabres' hands.

Why is that a huge problem. He had 34 pts this season which 6th for Sabres forwards (including Kane) and his 16 goals was 5th (including Kane). Not exactly 5.6 mill in value, but certainly better then the nothing we got for the over 10 mill imvested in Bogo and Moulson.

[WildCard]

I wonder if people would feel different about Nylander if he was sent back to the OHL, dominated there and then had this past season in the AHL. I think everyone would chalk it up to the injury, but still say he was a top prospect.

 

Nylander is a talent prospect who improved this season after he returned from injury. He played ok in his Nhl games and will have a legit shot at making the Sabres in the fall. We need his talent.

Robviously has been banging the OHL drum for awhile too. Think there's some merit to it

Why is that a huge problem. He had 34 pts this season which 6th for Sabres forwards (including Kane) and his 16 goals was 5th (including Kane). Not exactly 5.6 mill in value, but certainly better then the nothing we got for the over 10 mill imvested in Bogo and Moulson.

It's the 2015 Girgensons effect

[Randall Flagg]

Why is that a huge problem. He had 34 pts this season which 6th for Sabres forwards (including Kane) and his 16 goals was 5th (including Kane). Not exactly 5.6 mill in value, but certainly better then the nothing we got for the over 10 mill imvested in Bogo and Moulson.

Moulson had 34 points last year too, but like Pominville, it was obvious he was shot and we were severely hampering ourselves at even strength when he was in any role on the ice. His lack of speed made him a black hole and an easy entry/place to make a play. There is no way to quantify it, but it's 5 on 4.5 every time he's out there and when you not only let that happen for 82 games, but stick him in the top six for many of them, you get seasons like this. 

[GASabresIUFAN]

But considering he was already our ~12th best forward this year, if not worse, it should be easy for our GM to make him press box material.

 

The problem is that coaches rarely seem to have the stones to do that to a veteran for some reason. But it's so, so necessary if we want to be competing with other teams each and every shift rather than crossing our fingers and hoping we're okay until ROR catches his breath, the way we have been doing it for 3 years.

By no measure was he our 12th best forward this season. Nolan, Pouliot, Larsson, Josefson, and Girgensons were all worse. Edited April 8, 2018 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

In addition to what Freeman said, he put up very respectable numbers for a 3rd liner, coach loved his example and the GM is an old buddy.

 

Pominville coming back. ????

Edited April 8, 2018 by dudacek

[Randall Flagg]

By no measure was he our 12th best forward this season. Nolan, Pouliot, Larsson, Josefson, and Girgensonswere all worse.

Zemgus was less of a black hole, and Jack bouncing goals in off of Pominville despite Pominville's best efforts doesn't change that. 

 

Jack's line was far better with Zemgus on it. I'm not doing the math again, because I've done it three times, but when Zemgus goes on Jack's line, and the sample size is probably approaching 70 games together now, they each increase their scoring by at least 20-30%, and it's obvious that they play better and can function as unit more than Pominville chasing a puck that gets wrung around the boards and just missing it with a feeble reach.

[dudacek]

How would Sam Bennett look in Girgensons role?

[Randall Flagg]

Eichel

Reinhart

ROR

Kane

Okposo

Rodrigues

Girgensons

Baptiste

Mittelstadt

Nylander

Wilson

 

were all clearly better at the ins and outs of hockey, the stuff that happens between goals, the stuff that makes up 95% of the game, than Jason. If any one of these guys got Jason's time with Jack they'd produce too, and more importantly, they'd make a more cohesive unit with Jack and do a far, far better job of maximizing Jack's talent and limiting how much his line gets hindered. Kane is gone, but Pominville isonly getting older, and it should be EASY to make sure he isn't in the 12 man lineup. It needs to happen. 

It's only been 16 hours since the season ended, we cannot already be slipping into "well, it's okay to have Pominville in a prominent role, I mean he had 34 points". The season is too soon. He's useless, and giving meaningful ice time to players who are useless despite Jack's abilities is WHY we're here where we are right now. It's the kind of thing we need to break the cycle on this offseason, and not perpetuate. 

We did the same thing with Moulson last year, who had 34 points and was a zombie the entire year, and he gave us 0 points in 14 games, helping us to one of the worst starts in franchise history. 

Break the cycle Botterill. We are not tanking. replacement level players with NHL floors are not hard to come by. It is not acceptable to start this season with a healthy roster containing Pominville anywhere.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Zemgus was less of a black hole, and Jack bouncing goals in off of Pominville despite Pominville's best efforts doesn't change that. 

Jack's line was far better with Zemgus on it. I'm not doing the math again, because I've done it three times, but when Zemgus goes on Jack's line, and the sample size is probably approaching 70 games together now, they each increase their scoring by at least 20-30%, and it's obvious that they play better and can function as unit more than Pominville chasing a puck that gets wrung around the boards and just missing it with a feeble reach.

The goal is to have neither on Jack’s line next season. But Girgensons when not with Jack was basically useless. If Z comes back, it will be in a bottom six role, so we can expect more nothing from him in that role. Also Moulson has 32 pts last year, 18 on the PP. Pommers had 34 this season, but only 7 on the PP.

[nfreeman]

But considering he was already our ~12th best forward this year, if not worse, it should be easy for our GM to make him press box material. 

 

The problem is that coaches rarely seem to have the stones to do that to a veteran for some reason. But it's so, so necessary if we want to be competing with other teams each and every shift rather than crossing our fingers and hoping we're okay until ROR catches his breath, the way we have been doing it for 3 years.

 

Why is that a huge problem. He had 34 pts this season which 6th for Sabres forwards (including Kane) and his 16 goals was 5th (including Kane). Not exactly 5.6 mill in value, but certainly better then the nothing we got for the over 10 mill imvested in Bogo and Moulson.

 

By no measure was he our 12th best forward this season. Nolan, Pouliot, Larsson, Josefson, and Girgensons were all worse.

 

Zemgus was less of a black hole, and Jack bouncing goals in off of Pominville despite Pominville's best efforts doesn't change that. 

 

Jack's line was far better with Zemgus on it. I'm not doing the math again, because I've done it three times, but when Zemgus goes on Jack's line, and the sample size is probably approaching 70 games together now, they each increase their scoring by at least 20-30%, and it's obvious that they play better and can function as unit more than Pominville chasing a puck that gets wrung around the boards and just missing it with a feeble reach.

 

Good stuff here boys.

 

My bottom line is that:

 

- As I mentioned above, Pommer will definitely be back -- although that might just mean back on the Sabres' payroll -- not necessarily on their NHL roster.  I can certainly see him getting healthy-scratched regularly or sent down.

 

- He's much diminished, and I hate the idea of him on Eichel's line, but he's nowhere near as much of a basket case as Moulson was, and nowhere near the 12th forward on this roster.  Now, if the Sabres had a respectable roster?  Probably a different story, but not on this year's team.

 

- I don't see any urgent need to buy him out and take a future cap hit.  As duda pointed out he's a pro and he's not yet completely useless.

[Taro T]

Why is that a huge problem. He had 34 pts this season which 6th for Sabres forwards (including Kane) and his 16 goals was 5th (including Kane). Not exactly 5.6 mill in value, but certainly better then the nothing we got for the over 10 mill imvested in Bogo and Moulson.

He had 13 points in the 1st 15 games, so he had 21 points in the last 65+ games. That with an excessive # of minutes anchoring Eichel's RW. (Get it, anchoring? Crack me up. :p) Better than nothing, true, but given the usage he was getting not terribly much better.

 

At his age, it is extremely doubtful he'll get to 25 points next year minus the attachment (figuratively, he'd never go quick enough for it to be literally ;)) to Jack's hip & even then it'd be doubtful. He's my early candidate for 13th F status.