Darcy the scouting staff and the Draft

[SabresBillsFan]

I don't usually stick up for Darcy but I don't believe he should be feeling the heat for all these picks. I think the scouting staff had numerous guys they targeted and they wanted those players they had on their board. Yes we passed on some quality offensive players but remember people they said be prepared for suffering. None of these players they picked yesterday are going to step in next year anyways except for a possibilty of Ristolainen. And to me Ristolainen seems like a solid pick plus you throw in a 6'5" Zadorov who can skate and hit. Wow all of a sudden we just got meanier on the back end. Plus 6 forwards taken 3 in the second round. Plus you throw in the 4th ranked goaltender. And the rebuild is underway. Yes we all know Darcy probably messed up when Carolina had targeted Sekera and Buffalo could have moved from 8 to 5. But I think Darcy, Kevin Devine and the rest of the scouts had targeted Ristolainen so they were comfortable on just sitting at 8. Then you can say that Kevin and the scouts really wanted TJ Compher that's why the Sekera trade went down. Plus you look at the draft for next year right now we have 1 1st rounder and 4 2nd rounders. Plus Vanek and Miller will be gone I'm guessing by trade deadline. So they will probably have more picks in 2014 and 2015. What are everyone's thoughts on the draft yesterday?

[Taro T]

I'm fine w/ the draft (on paper, which is the only way to evaluate it today).

 

I fully expect to not be fine with what happens over the next couple of weeks.

[That Aud Smell]

This may belong somewhere else (in an existing thread), and I'm fine if a mod wants to move it, but I will respond to it here: I follow the team's fortunes closely and consider myself a big fan, but I know next to nothing (or, in most cases, nothing) about anyone who was drafted yesterday. By all accounts, the team followed its board and got the best value it could where it was picking. Now, we get to wait several years before anyone from this draft class makes a measurable impact on the big club (I'm not buying the hype about the Finn at #8 being ready for the NHL this year).

 

I saw one scouting house project the Finn as a Kronwall type player, and the Rooskie as a bit of a project who could end up as a defensively minded top-4 crease-cleaner who strikes fear in opposing players. Yes and yes, please. No guarantees, obviously, but nothing wrong with those 2 picks at this point in time.

[etiennep99]

Lots of young Americans. I can't help but wonder how much Ron Rolston and Chad Cassiday

had a say in the draft. Still it makes sense because the Sabres are happy to wait for

them to go to college. Will all of those draft picks, if they all came to the NHL at

the same time, then they could end up in a situation like the Wild were in this year

where they felt like it was better to trade some of their surplus of prospects. The

Sabres still need superstar players, not a bunch of joes, so it makes sense also to

continue the pain this year to hope for a superstar next year.

 

I am disappointed that they didn't draft Monahan, but quite happy that they passed

on KHL's Nichuskin.

 

As was stated elsewhere, having Meyers, Ristolainen, Zadorov, & McNabb will help

them against the superstar centers in the Adams division (Stamkos, Barkov) and

in the rest of the Prince of Wales (Malkin, Crosby, Staals) conference. Just look at how Boston was able to

stifle Pittsburgh this year.

[Taro T]

This may belong somewhere else (in an existing thread), and I'm fine if a mod wants to move it, but I will respond to it here: I follow the team's fortunes closely and consider myself a big fan, but I know next to nothing (or, in most cases, nothing) about anyone who was drafted yesterday. By all accounts, the team followed its board and got the best value it could where it was picking. Now, we get to wait several years before anyone from this draft class makes a measurable impact on the big club (I'm not buying the hype about the Finn at #8 being ready for the NHL this year).

 

I saw one scouting house project the Finn as a Kronwall type player, and the Rooskie as a bit of a project who could end up as a defensively minded top-4 crease-cleaner who strikes fear in opposing players. Yes and yes, please. No guarantees, obviously, but nothing wrong with those 2 picks at this point in time.

And if only 1 of them pans out, they're still ahead. The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of drafting 2 of something (D's or C's) pretty highly to increase the odds of hitting on at least 1.

 

My concern is that I don't expect them to do anything substantial in the FA market and I don't see them being active in the trade market until there's 1 week or less left before the trade deadline.

[That Aud Smell]

And if only 1 of them pans out, they're still ahead. The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of drafting 2 of something (D's or C's) pretty highly to increase the odds of hitting on at least 1.

 

My concern is that I don't expect them to do anything substantial in the FA market and I don't see them being active in the trade market until there's 1 week or less left before the trade deadline.

 

Agreed and agreed. I am holding out hope that DR manages to move 1 of the 2 pending UFA's before the season begins. My fear is that the supply of UFA talent following buy-outs may dampen the market to a point where DR will feel he can't get sufficient value.

[PASabreFan]

Thanks, Aud, for a rare bit of draft modesty on here. I'm all over Rasmus though. My draft research shows he doesn't get enough fiber in his diet and has suffered from rabbit stools of late.

 

My question about the top of the draft is whether this signals that the Sabres are going to continue to "build from the goalie out" and whether this is something small-market teams do (offensive players are more expensive, keeping the puck out of the net is cheaper and so on). Again, just questions.

[TrueBlueGED]

Thanks, Aud, for a rare bit of draft modesty on here. I'm all over Rasmus though. My draft research shows he doesn't get enough fiber in his diet and has suffered from rabbit stools of late.

 

My question about the top of the draft is whether this signals that the Sabres are going to continue to "build from the goalie out" and whether this is something small-market teams do (offensive players are more expensive, keeping the puck out of the net is cheaper and so on). Again, just questions.

 

Somebody hasn't been paying attention to the Dman and goaltending contracts handed out recently.

[Trettioåtta]

My only gripe is that they have only drafted 4 wingers in the last 3 years, all RW. Otherwise i think our scouts have done alright, especially in the first round. Hopefully we will get some sleeper hits - we haven't got that lucky recently with late rounders

[PASabreFan]

Somebody hasn't been paying attention to the Dman and goaltending contracts handed out recently.

 

That's why I posed questions. No need for snark. Educate me, Doc.

[etiennep99]

My only gripe is that they have only drafted 4 wingers in the last 3 years, all RW. Otherwise i think our scouts have done alright, especially in the first round. Hopefully we will get some sleeper hits - we haven't got that lucky recently with late rounders

 

There are two reasons for drafting few left-wingers. 1. It's harder to find right-hand shots, so drafting right-handed right-wingers takes priority.2. The Sabres shift a lot of centres, for the same reason, over to the left wing.But, you're right, we seem to be overdue for some more luck with the long-shots. We had 11picks in a very deep draft. Only Florida has had more in the 7 round draft era (13 in 2010);they've already seen 4 of them play NHL games. We should hope for at least that many!Especially considering that Ristolainen and Zadarov seem like sure things.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

The issue I have isn't the players themselves. In all honesty, they are built well...better than Jones and Nurse in fact, and seem to enjoy using their bodies a bit, at least against teenagers (no Cliff joke here).....but if there is one thing Darcy has done well over the years, it is finding decent, usable defensemen in the 2nd round and on. Where he has been horrible is finding gritty, character forwards who can contribute on offense. I don't think we have seen one homegrown forward in his entire 16 years here. This draft was loaded with them, and we had the chance to grab 2 of them with the skill level to be in the NHL in short order.....the type of guys who win in the playoffs. That's what I fear. If you get a $1,000 voucher for a handyman service, and you are pretty good at fixing electrical issues on your own but have no clue about plumbing, why would you use that gift to have the guy wire in a generator to your house when you have a leaky sink and your toilets backup into your bathtub?

[TrueBlueGED]

The issue I have isn't the players themselves. In all honesty, they are built well...better than Jones and Nurse in fact, and seem to enjoy using their bodies a bit, at least against teenagers (no Cliff joke here).....but if there is one thing Darcy has done well over the years, it is finding decent, usable defensemen in the 2nd round and on. Where he has been horrible is finding gritty, character forwards who can contribute on offense. I don't think we have seen one homegrown forward in his entire 16 years here. This draft was loaded with them, and we had the chance to grab 2 of them with the skill level to be in the NHL in short order.....the type of guys who win in the playoffs. That's what I fear. If you get a $1,000 voucher for a handyman service, and you are pretty good at fixing electrical issues on your own but have no clue about plumbing, why would you use that gift to have the guy wire in a generator to your house when you have a leaky sink and your toilets backup into your bathtub?

 

Point of order: Ristolainen has been playing against men as a teenager for two years.

[tom webster]

I don't usually stick up for Darcy but I don't believe he should be feeling the heat for all these picks. I think the scouting staff had numerous guys they targeted and they wanted those players they had on their board. Yes we passed on some quality offensive players but remember people they said be prepared for suffering. None of these players they picked yesterday are going to step in next year anyways except for a possibilty of Ristolainen. And to me Ristolainen seems like a solid pick plus you throw in a 6'5" Zadorov who can skate and hit. Wow all of a sudden we just got meanier on the back end. Plus 6 forwards taken 3 in the second round. Plus you throw in the 4th ranked goaltender. And the rebuild is underway. Yes we all know Darcy probably messed up when Carolina had targeted Sekera and Buffalo could have moved from 8 to 5. But I think Darcy, Kevin Devine and the rest of the scouts had targeted Ristolainen so they were comfortable on just sitting at 8. Then you can say that Kevin and the scouts really wanted TJ Compher that's why the Sekera trade went down. Plus you look at the draft for next year right now we have 1 1st rounder and 4 2nd rounders. Plus Vanek and Miller will be gone I'm guessing by trade deadline. So they will probably have more picks in 2014 and 2015. What are everyone's thoughts on the draft yesterday?

 

I agree with most of this and therein lies the rub for me. You can pick several of Darcy's moves, put them in a vacuum, and come to the same conclusion. The problem is the results don't indicate success. Building a team is about putting the right pieces together so that the whole is greater then the sum of the parts. My guess is that never having a clear direction, constantly trailing the market and never being held accountable all contributes to this lack of success. What my 53 years have told me, however, is that I am not sure about anything. Maybe he will stumble into success and I will be extremely happy about being wrong, but will I have been? Who knows.

[That Aud Smell]

Thanks, Aud, for a rare bit of draft modesty on here. I'm all over Rasmus though. My draft research shows he doesn't get enough fiber in his diet and has suffered from rabbit stools of late.

 

You're most welcome. And thank you for the tidbit on Rasmus's B.M.'s.

 

My question about the top of the draft is whether this signals that the Sabres are going to continue to "build from the goalie out" and whether this is something small-market teams do (offensive players are more expensive, keeping the puck out of the net is cheaper and so on). Again, just questions.

 

Not sure whether that is something that small-market teams do. It is, according to some, what (some of the) good hockey clubs do.

 

but if there is one thing Darcy has done well over the years, it is finding decent, usable defensemen in the 2nd round and on. Where he has been horrible is finding gritty, character forwards who can contribute on offense. I don't think we have seen one homegrown forward in his entire 16 years here. This draft was loaded with them, and we had the chance to grab 2 of them with the skill level to be in the NHL in short order.....the type of guys who win in the playoffs. That's what I fear. If you get a $1,000 voucher for a handyman service, and you are pretty good at fixing electrical issues on your own but have no clue about plumbing, why would you use that gift to have the guy wire in a generator to your house when you have a leaky sink and your toilets backup into your bathtub?

 

A more than fair concern.

[LTS]

For what it's worth... ESPN gives the Sabres an A+ draft.

 

Buffalo Sabres: A+ -- “Rasmus Ristolainen and Nikita Zadorov gives Buffalo two elite-sized, gritty D-men with picks No. 8 and No. 16 and, over time, will have a major impact on the back end. The blue line was a big need for the Buffalo system, and they addressed it as well as they could with their first two selections. In the second round, the Sabres add skilled, blue-collar forward J.T. Compher, and two big hard working forwards in Connor Hurley from Edina High School and Justin Bailey from Kitchener of the OHL -- both give added size. This was a really strong draft for the Sabres.

 

One has to think that their ability to add these D-men to the system perhaps allows for a move later on should they develop as projected? It's not impossible to think that someone might come calling for Ehrhoff at some point even though his contract is long it's not expensive. Myers? Well, who knows.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

Point of order: Ristolainen has been playing against men as a teenager for two years.

True....he doesn't come across as a bruiser. He will handle himself though. The Russian will be interesting. I like his jib that he came over to Canada and had no English to him but took to it in short order. He wants to hit he says....hope so.

[That Aud Smell]

My guess is that never having a clear direction, constantly trailing the market and never being held accountable all contributes to this lack of success.

 

I very much agree that he is furiously playing catch-up with how the game is currently being played and in what direction(s) it appears headed. I heard several quotes from DR this weekend about how bigger/rougher/nastier is the way the game's headed now. My concern: By the time these players are ready to contribute, the game's direction could have shifted again.

 

One thing I will grant DR: He foresaw and properly planned for the game's direction in 2003-2004.

[X. Benedict]

Thanks, Aud, for a rare bit of draft modesty on here. I'm all over Rasmus though. My draft research shows he doesn't get enough fiber in his diet and has suffered from rabbit stools of late.

 

My question about the top of the draft is whether this signals that the Sabres are going to continue to "build from the goalie out" and whether this is something small-market teams do (offensive players are more expensive, keeping the puck out of the net is cheaper and so on). Again, just questions.

 

I think they had to address center last year. If anything, not picking a center was a vote of confidence in Grigo.

Going big on the blueline.....I think it is a reaction to where they think the division is going.

[IKnowPhysics]

Nice to see everyone chilling the ###### out a little.

 

We had another good draft and it will, like always, be very interesting to these kids develop.

 

The opening day roster could be a little bit of a cringer on paper, but as long as John Scott continues to photobomb rookie interviews, this team will be fun to watch.

[Johnny DangerFace]

This will be a great draft if these players turn out to be great players. This will be a bad draft if these players turn out to be bad players. We have no idea how anyone will turn out so there is not a reason not to be excited at potential, and the fact we get to watch some highly rated prospects hopefully make it to the NHL and succeed.

[repster]

For what it's worth... ESPN gives the Sabres an A+ draft.

 

Buffalo Sabres: A+ -- “Rasmus Ristolainen and Nikita Zadorov gives Buffalo two elite-sized, gritty D-men with picks No. 8 and No. 16 and, over time, will have a major impact on the back end. The blue line was a big need for the Buffalo system, and they addressed it as well as they could with their first two selections. In the second round, the Sabres add skilled, blue-collar forward J.T. Compher, and two big hard working forwards in Connor Hurley from Edina High School and Justin Bailey from Kitchener of the OHL -- both give added size. This was a really strong draft for the Sabres.

 

One has to think that their ability to add these D-men to the system perhaps allows for a move later on should they develop as projected? It's not impossible to think that someone might come calling for Ehrhoff at some point even though his contract is long it's not expensive. Myers? Well, who knows.

 

If you Google nhl draft grades 2013 and look at the various outlets giving their opinions, the Sabres were given either A+, A or A- by every single one of them - for what it's worth.

[That Aud Smell]

a reaction to where they think the division is going.

 

I get the sense that the franchise has been doing a lot of reacting of late. It's a little bit like when teams were drafting in order to deal with Belicheck's [sic] 2 TE sets (and believe me, with the recent developments, he's already moved onto something else). Remember when no one could keep up with us in 2006? Remember the K-Gun? I look forward to the day when our teams are ahead of the curve again. For the time being, I would be plenty satisfied with the Sabres hitting it big on a few of these prospects.

 

The opening day roster could be a little bit of a cringer on paper

 

There's something liberating in that.

[Sabre Dance]

The issue I have isn't the players themselves. In all honesty, they are built well...better than Jones and Nurse in fact, and seem to enjoy using their bodies a bit, at least against teenagers (no Cliff joke here).....but if there is one thing Darcy has done well over the years, it is finding decent, usable defensemen in the 2nd round and on. Where he has been horrible is finding gritty, character forwards who can contribute on offense. I don't think we have seen one homegrown forward in his entire 16 years here. This draft was loaded with them, and we had the chance to grab 2 of them with the skill level to be in the NHL in short order.....the type of guys who win in the playoffs. That's what I fear. If you get a $1,000 voucher for a handyman service, and you are pretty good at fixing electrical issues on your own but have no clue about plumbing, why would you use that gift to have the guy wire in a generator to your house when you have a leaky sink and your toilets backup into your bathtub?

I agree with most of this and therein lies the rub for me. You can pick several of Darcy's moves, put them in a vacuum, and come to the same conclusion. The problem is the results don't indicate success. Building a team is about putting the right pieces together so that the whole is greater then the sum of the parts. My guess is that never having a clear direction, constantly trailing the market and never being held accountable all contributes to this lack of success. What my 53 years have told me, however, is that I am not sure about anything. Maybe he will stumble into success and I will be extremely happy about being wrong, but will I have been? Who knows.

 

Thanks - you stated exactly what I was thinking. Saved me a lot of typing....

 

This will be a great draft if these players turn out to be great players. This will be a bad draft if these players turn out to be bad players. We have no idea how anyone will turn out so there is not a reason not to be excited at potential, and the fact we get to watch some highly rated prospects hopefully make it to the NHL and succeed.

 

That's fine if you find watching prospects mature entertaining. I prefer watching a team full of confident, hard working players win a Stanley Cup. Shall I leave a wake-up call for 2017?

[shrader]

This will be a great draft if these players turn out to be great players. This will be a bad draft if these players turn out to be bad players. We have no idea how anyone will turn out so there is not a reason not to be excited at potential, and the fact we get to watch some highly rated prospects hopefully make it to the NHL and succeed.

 

What if half of them turn out to be great and the other half turn out to be bad?