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Place Your Bets! (Vanek, Miller trade edition)

IKnowPhysics

By IKnowPhysics
in The Aud Club

Vanek/Miller Poll  

126 members have voted

  1. 1. Will Vanek be traded? When?

    • He won't be traded, he will be resigned by the Sabres.
      31
    • He'll be traded before the first round of the 2013 draft ends.
      15
    • He'll be traded after the first round of the 2013 draft ends but before the beginning of the 2013-14 regular season.
      10
    • He'll be traded after the beginning of the 2013-14 season but before the 2014 trade deadline.
      40
    • His rights will be traded after the 2014 trade deadline OR he won't be traded at all before he turns UFA.
      12

  2. 2. Will Miller be traded? When?

    • He won't be traded, he will be resigned by the Sabres.
      13
    • He'll be traded before the first round of the 2013 draft ends.
      40
    • He'll be traded after the first round of the 2013 draft ends but before the beginning of the 2013-14 regular season.
      20
    • He'll be traded after the beginning of the 2013-14 season but before the 2014 trade deadline.
      23
    • His rights will be traded after the 2014 trade deadline OR he won't be traded at all before he turns UFA.
      12

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Hoss Hall of Famer

Hoss

Posted
Posted

 

No he didn't, he won the Conn Smythe.

 

Miller won a Vezina in 2010. He is of less value than Quick but again it is the concept.

 

Also I would rather have Cody Hodgson than Jakub Voracek. Hard to say who will end up a better player.

 

I could easily argue Vanek is better than Carter and that evens out Quick being better than Miller. I could say right now Voracek could be argued as being better than Hodgson. SO no that comparison is actually fairly accurate.

 

My bad on the Vezina call. But he had a Vezina season and was equal to Henrik that year.

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LGR4GM Hall of Famer

LGR4GM

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My bad on the Vezina call. But he had a Vezina season and was equal to Henrik that year.

I would agree with that. The original point is that even with Vanek's age, salary, and 1yr contract he is still significantly more valuable to a team than Voracek. Will that change? Maybe if Voracek is good again next season and beyond but we also have to consider that if Vanek resigns and continues playing with Hodgson, his number could also be extremely good.

 

Remember the NHL is full of players who had a PPG year or even 2. It does not have a lot of consecutive 30goal scorers

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Hoss Hall of Famer

Hoss

Posted
Posted

 

I would agree with that. The original point is that even with Vanek's age, salary, and 1yr contract he is still significantly more valuable to a team than Voracek. Will that change? Maybe if Voracek is good again next season and beyond but we also have to consider that if Vanek resigns and continues playing with Hodgson, his number could also be extremely good.

 

Remember the NHL is full of players who had a PPG year or even 2. It does not have a lot of consecutive 30goal scorers

 

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

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LGR4GM Hall of Famer

LGR4GM

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I guess we'll have to agree to disagree.

Voracek's shooting percentage: .171 or .67 higher than his next closest. That suggests he is well above his average and will regress towards the mean rather than sustain that shooting percentage. Steven Stamkos maintains an average of .172 shooting percentage. I don't think Voracek is Stamkos.

 

Voracek's average: .104 over 5 seasons

Vanek's average: .152 over 8 seasons

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qwksndmonster All Star

qwksndmonster

Posted
Posted

Couturier and Laughton are the names I would like to see attached to this rumor.

 

So, this pretty much guarantees they both get traded.

Yes and yes and yes please.

 

Voracek is not going to be available. Liger said he's not familiar with him and it shows. Vorecek is a big body that can fly. He's young and on a much better contract than Vanek is/will be on. Cap space is extra valuable with Philly, so I definitely see us taking Meszaros in any deal.

 

So I guy who has 1 season of almost PPG pace is worth a 2 time 40 goal scorer 4 time 30 goal scorer and a goaltender who is widely touted around the league is one of the best. For that we get an unproven 23yr old with 1 season over 20 goals?

One half season with over 20 goals. Seriously, watch him the next time we play the Flyers.

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Hoss Hall of Famer

Hoss

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Not unreasonable.

 

I think, in the end, it'll come to a first and a prospect. If it's for a first next year it'll come down to a first and two prospects probably.

 

Also depends on where that first rounder is.

 

 

 

And then this jackass on WGR just said he doesn't want three first rounders in the same draft. Says "Do you want three guys on the same timeline?" Who gives a ###### what they're timeline is. Of course you want three picks in this deep draft.

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waldo Third Liner

waldo

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Voracek's shooting percentage: .171 or .67 higher than his next closest. That suggests he is well above his average and will regress towards the mean rather than sustain that shooting percentage. Steven Stamkos maintains an average of .172 shooting percentage. I don't think Voracek is Stamkos.

 

Voracek's average: .104 over 5 seasons

Vanek's average: .152 over 8 seasons

 

 

and his center and opposite wing on Philly were? and they would be ? here? ..a step up or down? The numbers are important but you have to look at who they played with to put them up too. He was playing with skill.

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JJFIVEOH All Star

JJFIVEOH

Posted
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Big difference between a 50 point year in a FULL season and a 50 point season in half a year... But good try.

 

 

 

 

I was being facetious, but since you mentioned it, it wasn't a full season Stafford only played 62 games. Not to mention 5th in the league in goals per game.

 

And Voracek only had his good year during a shortened season, he doesn't even have a full year to prove it wasn't a fluke.

 

Also... 4 "average" years by Voracek? His point totals in those four years: 38, 50, 46, 49. Stafford's point total in his "breakout" year? 52. Hardly much better than Voracek's last three "average" years.

 

Again, how many games did Stafford play that year? Each player had one breakout year, yet Stafford still averages more goal per game. Are you kidding me that he is worth more than Vanek or Miller??????? My god, I'm not the biggest Miller fan but even I wouldn't trade him for Voracek. You highly underrate the impoortance of Vanek.

 

For a team like Philly, Voracek is more valuable. They are tight against the cap. Voracek is 23 and just posted great numbers (top 20 in points this season). He's under control for three more years at just $4.25 mill which is just under $3 mill less than what Vanek will command. Vanek is only under control for one more season so there's clear risk there.

 

It's not JUST about the player's talent. There's a lot more that goes into it.

 

Yeah but in this case contract and $$ aren't an issue for BFLO so trading Vanek or Miller for Voracek is rediculous. Your point undermines your reasoning.

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Lorenzo Von Matterhorn Prospect

Lorenzo Von Matterhorn

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Philly loves Voracek they specifically let Jagr walk just so Voracek could take his place on the top line with Giroux, Voracek will be a great player in this league, but he is not at a level that Vanek is at obviously. So in that argument I agree with both of you at different points.

 

Either way, Philly won't trade Voracek unless the deal is insane because he has so much upside in this league and they are very high on him.

 

I don't agree with Miller for Read and pick #11, are we forgetting that we already have Ennis and Gerbe? Add Read to that and we'll get knocked around on a nightly basis having a fourth of our forwards under 5'10" are we just trying to make our lives more miserable from watching Sabres games? Lol I do not want Read

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TrueBlueGED Hall of Famer

TrueBlueGED

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Josh Rimer just said on WGR that the asking price for Miller is a 1st, a high prospect and a mid-level prospect.

 

So basically the Pominville deal (if we assume Larsson + 2nd = high prospect). I'm not convinced they get that much, unless as you said in another post, the 1st is for next year's draft. If we're talking Philly, then something like Laughton and a 1st?

 

Philly loves Voracek they specifically let Jagr walk just so Voracek could take his place on the top line with Giroux, Voracek will be a great player in this league, but he is not at a level that Vanek is at obviously. So in that argument I agree with both of you at different points.

 

Either way, Philly won't trade Voracek unless the deal is insane because he has so much upside in this league and they are very high on him.

 

I don't agree with Miller for Read and pick #11, are we forgetting that we already have Ennis and Gerbe? Add Read to that and we'll get knocked around on a nightly basis having a fourth of our forwards under 5'10" are we just trying to make our lives more miserable from watching Sabres games? Lol I do not want Read

 

Hopefully we only have one of them next season, with that one being Ennis.

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Sherman Prospect

Sherman

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What about Miller and $5million of his cap hit for one of 11/Couterier/Laughton, + Tye McGinn and a conditional pick next year. The condition being him resigning. The $5million could help seal the deal as Philly always wants to be aggressive in free agency.

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Hoss Hall of Famer

Hoss

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i would take a 11th and wayne simmonds (24) for miller. if they want to throw in an extra then great. but if couts is unavailable, i go for simmonds.

 

I'd do that in a heartbeat as well. Even though Simmonds can be a scumbag. Doubt that's an option, though.

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Hoss Hall of Famer

Hoss

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Sign me up, this team needs MORE scumbags. See the Boston Bruins.

 

Lucic and Marchand are two scumbags I would NEVER want on this team. I don't deny any of their talent or what they bring to the table, but that's a road I'm not willing to cross.

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