game discussion thread GDT: Sabres vs. Capitals 11/26/11 - 7 PM

[Sabres Fan in NS]

I also think it showed what the Sabres are trying to build. Guys like Kassian and McNabb have been in the system for a while and the master plan was (from what I could tell) to build a bigger, nastier team from within. We added Kassian and McNabb in the last two games and the Sabres were throwing a lot more hits. And Foligno is still right down the road in Rochester (probably hoping for one more injury to a Sabres forward). He's not as scary as Kassian, but he's just as big and equally into getting physical.

 

And Myers and Weber are on their way back.

 

If this works, the Sabres won't be a small, wimpy team anymore. Keep your fingers crossed. I can't remember the last time we had this much size and strength in the pipeline.

 

[SwampD]

Two things that stood out most to me in this game-

 

-Wow, the Capitals are a really selfish team. I can't count the number of times they had a guy on the backside and just needed a pass to beat Enroth across. Every time they took the shot, and they didn'teven shoot to the far side for a more favorable rebound.

 

-Ovechkin had an absolutely horrible game. He couldn't have looked more bored on Adam's second goal. He just stood there with one hand on his stick. Kinda disappointing.

[bunomatic]

Two things that stood out most to me in this game-

 

-Wow, the Capitals are a really selfish team. I can't count the number of times they had a guy on the backside and just needed a pass to beat Enroth across. Every time they took the shot, and they didn'teven shoot to the far side for a more favorable rebound.

 

-Ovechkin had an absolutely horrible game. He couldn't have looked more bored on Adam's second goal. He just stood there with one hand on his stick. Kinda disappointing.

Ovis mailed it in and can now be considered a coach killer. Its obvious he didn't take kindly to that benching earlier in the season. I have to say it's hard to have any respect for the guy anymore.

[DR HOLLIDAY]

I also think it showed what the Sabres are trying to build. Guys like Kassian and McNabb have been in the system for a while and the master plan was (from what I could tell) to build a bigger, nastier team from within. We added Kassian and McNabb in the last two games and the Sabres were throwing a lot more hits. And Foligno is still right down the road in Rochester (probably hoping for one more injury to a Sabres forward). He's not as scary as Kassian, but he's just as big and equally into getting physical.

 

And Myers and Weber are on their way back.

 

If this works, the Sabres won't be a small, wimpy team anymore. Keep your fingers crossed. I can't remember the last time we had this much size and strength in the pipeline.

 

The waiting is the hardest part, but you are right....... :beer:

[HopefulFuture]

Has anyone run Enroth's numbers since Miller went down?

Hopeful Future?

Sorry, holidays and hunting season are my priorities this time of year.

 

But, are you suggesting that Miller's injury has adversely affected Enroth's statistics?

If so, I'd like to see the data that directly ties the two together.

 

Whoops, to late, the goalie just had another game with 2 goals or less :thumbsup:

So, let's compare the two now, shall we?

 

Miller: 11 games played, 2.86 GAA, .909 S%, 28 goals against

Enroth: 14 games played, 2.29 GAA, .925 S%, 29 goals against

 

I'm going to guess, since you targeted my name specifically, that you still hold on to the dream of Miller as our starter.

Merely a guess though.

As these numbers dictate, Enroth as the starter can do no worse than Miller, therefore, Miller is expendable in my opinion.

[Cereal]

Ovis mailed it in and can now be considered a coach killer. Its obvious he didn't take kindly to that benching earlier in the season. I have to say it's hard to have any respect for the guy anymore.

Boudreau out, Dale Hunter in! http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/7289699/washington-capitals-replace-bruce-boudreau-ohl-coach-dale-hunter

[nfreeman]

Ovis mailed it in and can now be considered a coach killer. Its obvious he didn't take kindly to that benching earlier in the season. I have to say it's hard to have any respect for the guy anymore.

I'm pretty close to this view as well. He's the team captain, they are paying him $124MM and that's what he delivers? Ridiculous. This is why NHL teams (like NBA teams) need to be able to suspend players without pay for mailing it in.

[nfreeman]

Boudreau out, Dale Hunter in! http://espn.go.com/nhl/story/_/id/7289699/washington-capitals-replace-bruce-boudreau-ohl-coach-dale-hunter

Interesting. It looks like Hunter has done well as a coach in the AHL. For those of us Sabres fans of a certain age, Hunter was one of the all-time most detested opposition players -- a Chris Neil/Milan Lucic type, to be sure.

[Cereal]

Interesting. It looks like Hunter has done well as a coach in the AHL. For those of us Sabres fans of a certain age, Hunter was one of the all-time most detested opposition players -- a Chris Neil/Milan Lucic type, to be sure.

Certainly a fan favorite in Washington. Will be interesting to see any response from the team.

[SDS]

 

4. Boudreau's days are numbered.

 

 

you could say that...

[carpandean]

Has anyone run Enroth's numbers since Miller went down?

Hopeful Future?

Sorry, holidays and hunting season are my priorities this time of year.

 

But, are you suggesting that Miller's injury has adversely affected Enroth's statistics?

If so, I'd like to see the data that directly ties the two together.

 

Whoops, to late, the goalie just had another game with 2 goals or less :thumbsup:

So, let's compare the two now, shall we?

 

Miller: 11 games played, 2.86 GAA, .909 S%, 28 goals against

Enroth: 14 games played, 2.29 GAA, .925 S%, 29 goals against

 

I'm going to guess, since you targeted my name specifically, that you still hold on to the dream of Miller as our starter.

Merely a guess though.

As these numbers dictate, Enroth as the starter can do no worse than Miller, therefore, Miller is expendable in my opinion.

I believe his point was this:

 

Enroth Stats:

Before Boston game: 6 GP, 1.34 GAA, 0.955 S%

Since Boston game: 7 GP, 2.82 GAA, 0.906 S%

(Wasn't sure where to put Boston game relief)

 

So, basically, since Miller went down, Enroth has turned into Miller.

[donteatyellowsnow]

I believe his point was this:

 

Enroth Stats:

Before Boston game: 6 GP, 1.34 GAA, 0.955 S%

Since Boston game: 7 GP, 2.82 GAA, 0.906 S%

(Wasn't sure where to put Boston game relief)

 

So, basically, since Miller went down, Enroth has turned into Miller.

 

 

And how many injuries have there been? Enroth is playing with half an AHL roster.

[korab rules]

Uhm...Ruff needs to learn from this game. The entire organization can learn from this game. I think they need to see what happens with the roster they had playing tonight over the next few games. If they can play "the system" successfully, and keep up with the grit, and everyone continues to look like they're having fun (hugely important and often overlooked, IMHO), then they need to take note of it. They would need to act on this revelation.

 

Usually, when a player is finished convalescing, they rush that player back onto the roster, and ship the call-up back down, regardless of how well the call-up played, and how the roster-regular had played prior to being injured. I don't know if that's wise.

 

Lindy needs to figure out how he gets the team to play well like they did tonight, and get them to do it more consistently despite what the roster looks like. There's no excuses for injuries this season - we've all seen it now with our own eyes. If a healthy roster can't do it, then he needs to sit people and call up people who will "bring it".

 

TPegs, Black and DR need to take this game and realize that they have players ready to jump in, and that, as someone already said, it's time to get rid of the rust.

 

If none of this happens, then we're back to square one as fans.

It would also really help if we could play a team that was mailing it in and trying to get its coach fired 82 times a season, and then 16 more times in the post-season.

[korab rules]

And how many injuries have there been? Enroth is playing with half an AHL roster.

Isn't there a trade Miller thread you can rant about him in? The shine has come off Enroth a bit. He is a quality backup at present, with maybe more upside. You trade Miller if you are looking for success years down the road. You trade Enroth and keep your proven starter if you are looking to win now.

[HopefulFuture]

I believe his point was this:

 

Enroth Stats:

Before Boston game: 6 GP, 1.34 GAA, 0.955 S%

Since Boston game: 7 GP, 2.82 GAA, 0.906 S%

(Wasn't sure where to put Boston game relief)

 

So, basically, since Miller went down, Enroth has turned into Miller.

And thats fine. If Enroth has turned into Miller, then there should be no gripes from any of the fan base when Enroth takes over.

[HopefulFuture]

Isn't there a trade Miller thread you can rant about him in? The shine has come off Enroth a bit. He is a quality backup at present, with maybe more upside. You trade Miller if you are looking for success years down the road. You trade Enroth and keep your proven starter if you are looking to win now.

I don't completely disagree about Enroth's shine.

I do disagree about a Miller trade though.

If you want to win now, you trade Miller now, Enroth is just as capable as Miller is, but Miller gives you the better return in my opinion.

[That Aud Smell]

Interesting. It looks like Hunter has done well as a coach in the AHL. For those of us Sabres fans of a certain age, Hunter was one of the all-time most detested opposition players -- a Chris Neil/Milan Lucic type, to be sure.

i shall never forget how he removed mike ramsey's front teeth (what remained of them, anyway) with a short, sharp, completely intentional slash to #5's mouth; as i recall, they were both getting up following a (clean) check that ramsey laid on him near the blue line.

[korab rules]

I don't completely disagree about Enroth's shine.

I do disagree about a Miller trade though.

If you want to win now, you trade Miller now, Enroth is just as capable as Miller is, but Miller gives you the better return in my opinion.

Trade a proven starter and Vezina winner and rest the future of your franchise on an undersized swede who has started ~20 games in the NHL. :thumbdown:

[dEnnis the Menace]

1) The AHL excuse doesn't work. The team mailed it in against Columbus, and then ratcheted it up against Washington. 1 and 1 with a mostly AHL lineup. Boston was just a tough game against a Hot team.

 

2) Trading Miller now does not say, "hey we want to win now" in any sense of the theory. It says we are putting all of our eggs in an unproven goalie who has played the equivalent of 1/4 of a season for his CAREER!

 

3) If we trade Miller, then you'll be griping on Ruff for overplaying Enroth because we now have sh!t for a backup...

 

:thumbsup: carry on

[nfreeman]

I don't completely disagree about Enroth's shine.

I do disagree about a Miller trade though.

If you want to win now, you trade Miller now, Enroth is just as capable as Miller is, but Miller gives you the better return in my opinion.

Please propose a specific trade involving Miller -- ie other team involved plus expected return for Miller, as well as why said return would make the Sabres a better team.

 

 

i shall never forget how he removed mike ramsey's front teeth (what remained of them, anyway) with a short, sharp, completely intentional slash to #5's mouth; as i recall, they were both getting up following a (clean) check that ramsey laid on him near the blue line.

I remember that play as well. I'm also pretty sure that Hunter was the guy who wiped out a Sabre (maybe Turgeon), resulting in a separated shoulder or similar injury, seconds after the Sabre scored a playoff-series-clinching goal.

 

If I were a Caps fan, I'd be disgusted with the players, but happy about Hunter being the new coach.

[HopefulFuture]

Please propose a specific trade involving Miller -- ie other team involved plus expected return for Miller, as well as why said return would make the Sabres a better team.

Why should I do this? It would be mere speculation on my part.

[HopefulFuture]

Trade a proven starter and Vezina winner and rest the future of your franchise on an undersized swede who has started ~20 games in the NHL. :thumbdown:

I understand this line of thought, and I can't say I blame you either, it is very risky.

But then again, keep Miller and bring a new, more determined meaning to the definition of futility. :oops:

 

Remember....you say tomatoe, I say tomatoe..... :rolleyes:

[dEnnis the Menace]

Why should I do this? It would be mere speculation on my part.

 

Because you're the one that keeps saying he will bring a better return. Well, what is said return?

[Weave]

Interesting. It looks like Hunter has done well as a coach in the AHL. For those of us Sabres fans of a certain age, Hunter was one of the all-time most detested opposition players -- a Chris Neil/Milan Lucic type, to be sure.

 

He's high on my alltime hate list. Gives me a reason to boo Washington now.

 

I remember that play as well. I'm also pretty sure that Hunter was the guy who wiped out a Sabre (maybe Turgeon), resulting in a separated shoulder or similar injury, seconds after the Sabre scored a playoff-series-clinching goal.

 

If I were a Caps fan, I'd be disgusted with the players, but happy about Hunter being the new coach.

 

Hunter did crosscheck Turgeon after a big playoff goal and injure him badly, but Pierre was playing for NYI at the time.

[HopefulFuture]

Because you're the one that keeps saying he will bring a better return. Well, what is said return?

I do believe he would bring a better return than Enroth would in a trade. I also believe that Enroth gives the same results as Miller.

 

What would that return be? Hopefully a decent 1A/1B center, that's what that return would be.

Does that mean Miller can garner that type of return in a 1 v 1 trade? No, but then again, if you've looked at my posts over the past on this subject, you'd have seen that Miller + what ever winger or dman or prospect or combination thereof to get us that type of player is what should be done, if it's necessary.

 

In short, if you put Enroth in that scenario, you would pay more on the "other components" side.