I’m Sorry for Being So Negative!

[Sabres Fan in NS]

14 hours ago, Slack_in_MA said:

Is a Sabres-Bills GM comparison fair given Pegula’s “efficient and economical” edict (or whatever the exact words were)?

Seems the Pegulas approach the two teams quite differently, no?

A Super Bowl is more lusted after by TP.  It kind of makes sense, I suppose.

 

[Weave]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I read your well reasoned and written post. However, from an overview perspective you essentially conclude that the Sabres are in a good situation for the not-too-distant future. I agree with assessment! To a great extent, the roster has been rebuilt and the system is well stocked. (As you point out.) Most NHL analysts also agree with that take. 

There is no question that this season has been a disappointment. A season that many of us had high expectations has been squandered. Are there any positive takeaways from this exasperating season? Absolutely! If UPL ends up demonstrating that he can be a legitimate #1 goalie, then that in itself would be a major positive. And there is a good chance that Levi with more grooming can also be a legitimate NHLgoalie. That in itself resolves a critical deficiency. Our defense with the addition of Eric Johnson, Clifton and the surprising Ryan Johnson have upgraded the blueline unit. The team defense, the greatest area of need has been upgraded. I know you are an advocate for adding another top pair defenseman, but I have a different take. I would rather use the money for that caliber of defenseman and direct it to re-signing Mitts. Instead, I would then go out and get a Clifton type player to add to the unit. Without question, he had some adjustment problems but now he is playing solidly. 

Go back and review most of our losses. What you will find is that the difference between winning and losing is very small. Again, this season has been a major disappointment. But I don't believe that we are that far away. There is nothing wrong with taking a break when it becomes too stressful and frustrating to follow. Those same exasperating sensations apply to most of us. Stand back a little farther and hang in there. 

Next year, the roster will have some changes. I doubt that Okposo and possibly Girgs won't be on the roster. 

Wait….. Am I correctly reading that you are OK with mostly rolling this back next season?

[mjd1001]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I read your well reasoned and written post. However, from an overview perspective you essentially conclude that the Sabres are in a good situation for the not-too-distant future. I agree with assessment! To a great extent, the roster has been rebuilt and the system is well stocked. (As you point out.) Most NHL analysts also agree with that take. 

Go back and review most of our losses. What you will find is that the difference between winning and losing is very small. Again, this season has been a major disappointment. But I don't believe that we are that far away. There is nothing wrong with taking a break when it becomes too stressful and frustrating to follow. Those same exasperating sensations apply to most of us. Stand back a little farther and hang in there. 

Next year, the roster will have some changes. I doubt that Okposo and possibly Girgs won't be on the roster. 

I agree with a lot of what you said.

As mentioned earlier, some fans are just at the end of the rope with wanting this team to make the playoffs. I get that. I am there at some times. But I have found out that I am happier as a fan, happier as a person when I view the team as entertainment for 2 hours a night and not get too caught up on when are they going to win the cup.

I don't think this team needs wholesale changes. I for sure don't think it needs to be blown up.  The single biggest issue I think this team has is how the forwards play in their own zone, my target has been Cozens. And in the past month or two, they have gotten drastically better.  Its a small sample size, but to me that is 40% of the problem with this team. I'm hopeful it has been fixed.  Even in their losses lately, you can't watch the games with your own eyes and not notice the forwards are making a LOT less mistakes than they were for the first part of the season.

  The majority of the other issue is scoring.  Again, mostly Tage and Cozens, but I really think this roster is not as good scoring as they were last year, but they are better than they have been this year.

I believe in UPL as a legit NHL starter.  I don't get myself tied up in a knot over the performance of the 4th line...and I think Okposo is done after this year anyway..and I like Girgensons play as a 4th liner.  This is the youngest D-corp in the league and D-men take time to learn the game, they are going to get better with games played and I don't think they have been awful this year (Despite the Johnson and Johnson game yesterday which may have been the worst game by a D-pair I have ever seen)

So what changes would I make?  Get a top 2-3 level D-man. That is the hard part, but that would be my #1 priority.  Change how the Power play executes...how I'm not sure..but what I am sure is that it isn't working so do something different (different assistant coach?) Bring in one more forward who you think can get you 20 goals a year AND is a full speed ahead, pest, maybe drops the gloves without having his face messed up guy.    That and the top 2-3 d-man are hard to find, have to trade some prospects to get it, go ahead.  But Blow it up? Change the coach and GM?  For me to think that it is nothing more than an emotional reaction.  Do the above and I'm 100% happy going into next season.

I like this thread because I sometimes personally have a hard time with the level of vitriol on this forum for heads to roll.  Based on this teams history over the past decade it might be the right amount of hate, but for me its just too much at times.  I sometimes get criticized for 'not seeing what is really going on with this team' because I tend to support some players and coaches more than others want, but that is jut some of us trying to find some positiive things.

Edited February 21 by mjd1001

[bunomatic]

3 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

I agree with a lot of what you said.

As mentioned earlier, some fans are just at the end of the rope with wanting this team to make the playoffs. I get that. I am there at some times. But I have found out that I am happier as a fan, happier as a person when I view the team as entertainment for 2 hours a night and not get too caught up on when are they going to win the cup.

I don't think this team needs wholesale changes. I for sure don't think it needs to be blown up.  The single biggest issue I think this team has is how the forwards play in their own zone, my target has been Cozens. And in the past month or two, they have gotten drastically better.  Its a small sample size, but to me that is 40% of the problem with this team. I'm hopeful it has been fixed.  Even in their losses lately, you can't watch the games with your own eyes and not notice the forwards are making a LOT less mistakes than they were for the first part of the season.

  The majority of the other issue is scoring.  Again, mostly Tage and Cozens, but I really think this roster is not as good scoring as they were last year, but they are better than they have been this year.

So what changes would I make?  Get a top 2-3 level D-man. That is the hard part, but that would be my #1 priority.  Change how the Power play executes...how I'm not sure..but what I am sure is that it isn't working so do something different (different assistant coach?) Bring in one more forward who you think can get you 20 goals a year AND is a full speed ahead, pest, maybe drops the gloves without having his face messed up guy.    That and the top 2-3 d-man are hard to find, have to trade some prospects to get it, go ahead.  But Blow it up? Change the coach and GM?  For me to think that it is nothing more than an emotional reaction.  Do the above and I'm 100% happy going into next season.

I try not to get too caught up on when they’ll make the playoffs. Cup ? Wtf lol. Making the playoffs is a low bar for me. It should be the expectation for this team going forward but imo KA has other plans. He seems to think its too early to make the playoffs. Content to sit on his hands while Rome burns. But I do enjoy watching the odd win. Its the mounting losses and more importantly how they lose that grates me. But what can ya do? Its out of our control.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

I read your well reasoned and written post. However, from an overview perspective you essentially conclude that the Sabres are in a good situation for the not-too-distant future. I agree with assessment! To a great extent, the roster has been rebuilt and the system is well stocked. (As you point out.) Most NHL analysts also agree with that take. 

There is no question that this season has been a disappointment. A season that many of us had high expectations has been squandered. Are there any positive takeaways from this exasperating season? Absolutely! If UPL ends up demonstrating that he can be a legitimate #1 goalie, then that in itself would be a major positive. And there is a good chance that Levi with more grooming can also be a legitimate NHLgoalie. That in itself resolves a critical deficiency. Our defense with the addition of Eric Johnson, Clifton and the surprising Ryan Johnson have upgraded the blueline unit. The team defense, the greatest area of need has been upgraded. I know you are an advocate for adding another top pair defenseman, but I have a different take. I would rather use the money for that caliber of defenseman and direct it to re-signing Mitts. Instead, I would then go out and get a Clifton type player to add to the unit. Without question, he had some adjustment problems but now he is playing solidly. 

Go back and review most of our losses. What you will find is that the difference between winning and losing is very small. Again, this season has been a major disappointment. But I don't believe that we are that far away. There is nothing wrong with taking a break when it becomes too stressful and frustrating to follow. Those same exasperating sensations apply to most of us. Stand back a little farther and hang in there. 

Next year, the roster will have some changes. I doubt that Okposo and possibly Girgs won't be on the roster. 

John, my comments on your review of the defense: 

• We have Dahlin and the rest are all question marks. Everyone after Dahlin is tradeable with the exception of Power who needs a longer look and who's contract makes him almost impossible to move
• Mule had a rough year.   Hopefully he gets better next year.  We desperately need more physical presence from a guy with his size.  His ability to play a tougher game, to clear out the front of the net, and to be rugged and durable is still a major question mark.  He has big potential still.  
• Power had a sophomore slump.  Not gonna comment further, just leave it at that.   He is going to be very highly paid next year and he needs to grow up faster than the average defenseman because of it.  He has a ton of work to do this off season.  Not sure Adams did him any favors  - this kid will be making $8.35M and wont be 22 until November.    😞  
• We lack the big, strong, steady stay at home RHD that would help Power immensely.  This is a major need.   We don't need another Clifton - we need a top 4 veteran in his prime years to steady this group and take minutes away from Power.  We should be able to add this player and keep Mitts.  
• The addition of Clifton is fine for the 3rd pair.  He hits, he is a tough middle weight player, he shows ability to clear the net and to be rugged.  He has periods of being error prone but as a 5/6/7 that is normal.  
• The addition of EJ will end this after this.  He was a one year addition, a 3rd line guy now in the twilight of an excellent career.   I am not sure he got through to the youngsters, I hope he did.   I would love to pick his brain after the season and get his real thoughts on this group and the entire organization.  
• Joker - he is playing well most of the time.  He does not fill the bill as a top 4.   His game is similar to Dahlin, Power, and R Johnson - a puck mover and not a heavy hitter or a defense first guy.   His presence "blocks" adding the big tough defensive defenseman that we still need.  More of a 5/6 that can move up to top 4 in a pinch.  Very tradeable IMO.  
• Ryan Johnson - he has played well in sheltered minutes.  He looks to be smart, good skater, good passer, his head is up and he is usually composed.   He lacks ideal size and strength, but still very young and will get stronger, will rely on mobility, passing and breakout skill to become a solid NHL player.  Due to injuries on the team his minutes have gone up lately and he is looking much more like a rookie now.  In fact, I thought he was targeted by the Ducks.  Despite not having the last line change the Ducks had their best line out there against RJ for all three 2nd period goals.  We hardly saw RJ in the 3rd period.   Coincidence?   This speaks more about the terrible game day coaching that we continually get from Don Granato and his staff.  I will be watching Ryan closely tonight as I expect Montreal will try to take advantage.  
• Bryson - an AHL/NHL tweener and a 8/9 guy on the roster.  

In summary - the defense is better than last year, improving on that was not a high bar either.  Some of it is the better goaltending (UPL).  Some of it is the better players at 5/6/7.  Some of it is the system changes that focus more on defense (and consequently stifles our ability to score).  

There need to be changes next year.  This still not a playoff caliber group but just a few moves away from it.  

[mjd1001]

8 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

John, my comments on your review of the defense: 

• We have Dahlin and the rest are all question marks. Everyone after Dahlin is tradeable with the exception of Power who needs a longer look and who's contract makes him almost impossible to move
• Mule had a rough year.   Hopefully he gets better next year.  We desperately need more physical presence from a guy with his size.  His ability to play a tougher game, to clear out the front of the net, and to be rugged and durable is still a major question mark.  He has big potential still.  
• Power had a sophomore slump.  Not gonna comment further, just leave it at that.   He is going to be very highly paid next year and he needs to grow up faster than the average defenseman because of it.  He has a ton of work to do this off season.  Not sure Adams did him any favors  - this kid will be making $8.35M and wont be 22 until November.    😞  
• We lack the big, strong, steady stay at home RHD that would help Power immensely.  This is a major need.   We don't need another Clifton - we need a top 4 veteran in his prime years to steady this group and take minutes away from Power.  We should be able to add this player and keep Mitts.  
• The addition of Clifton is fine for the 3rd pair.  He hits, he is a tough middle weight player, he shows ability to clear the net and to be rugged.  He has periods of being error prone but as a 5/6/7 that is normal.  
• The addition of EJ will end this after this.  He was a one year addition, a 3rd line guy now in the twilight of an excellent career.   I am not sure he got through to the youngsters, I hope he did.   I would love to pick his brain after the season and get his real thoughts on this group and the entire organization.  
• Joker - he is playing well most of the time.  He does not fill the bill as a top 4.   His game is similar to Dahlin, Power, and R Johnson - a puck mover and not a heavy hitter or a defense first guy.   His presence "blocks" adding the big tough defensive defenseman that we still need.  More of a 5/6 that can move up to top 4 in a pinch.  Very tradeable IMO.  
• Ryan Johnson - he has played well in sheltered minutes.  He looks to be smart, good skater, good passer, his head is up and he is usually composed.   He lacks ideal size and strength, but still very young and will get stronger, will rely on mobility, passing and breakout skill to become a solid NHL player.  Due to injuries on the team his minutes have gone up lately and he is looking much more like a rookie now.  In fact, I thought he was targeted by the Ducks.  Despite not having the last line change the Ducks had their best line out there against RJ for all three 2nd period goals.  We hardly saw RJ in the 3rd period.   Coincidence?   This speaks more about the terrible game day coaching that we continually get from Don Granato and his staff.  I will be watching Ryan closely tonight as I expect Montreal will try to take advantage.  
• Bryson - an AHL/NHL tweener and a 8/9 guy on the roster.  

In summary - the defense is better than last year, improving on that was not a high bar either.  Some of it is the better goaltending (UPL).  Some of it is the better players at 5/6/7.  Some of it is the system changes that focus more on defense (and consequently stifles our ability to score).  

There need to be changes next year.  This still not a playoff caliber group but just a few moves away from it.  

I'm in 95+% agreement with you.  Johnson is young, we saw last game what CAN happen when a young guy has a bad game. Its probably good they are bringing him on slowly. Power? He SHOULD be very good/great in the long run, but most got a little too high on him last year, he needs time, he needs experience.  The rest of the group is at least NHL level. Maybe they are on a 2nd pair when they should be 3rd pair guys....but that is better than in the past when we had borderline AHL/NHL guys playing major minutes.   One more legit top 4 addition to this team (even if trading top prospects for him are needed) along with more experience for everyone (yes, even Dahlin is young), and this squad could be very good in the near future.

[Believer]

26 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

John, my comments on your review of the defense: 

• We have Dahlin and the rest are all question marks. Everyone after Dahlin is tradeable with the exception of Power who needs a longer look and who's contract makes him almost impossible to move
• Mule had a rough year.   Hopefully he gets better next year.  We desperately need more physical presence from a guy with his size.  His ability to play a tougher game, to clear out the front of the net, and to be rugged and durable is still a major question mark.  He has big potential still.  
• Power had a sophomore slump.  Not gonna comment further, just leave it at that.   He is going to be very highly paid next year and he needs to grow up faster than the average defenseman because of it.  He has a ton of work to do this off season.  Not sure Adams did him any favors  - this kid will be making $8.35M and wont be 22 until November.    😞  
• We lack the big, strong, steady stay at home RHD that would help Power immensely.  This is a major need.   We don't need another Clifton - we need a top 4 veteran in his prime years to steady this group and take minutes away from Power.  We should be able to add this player and keep Mitts.  
• The addition of Clifton is fine for the 3rd pair.  He hits, he is a tough middle weight player, he shows ability to clear the net and to be rugged.  He has periods of being error prone but as a 5/6/7 that is normal.  
• The addition of EJ will end this after this.  He was a one year addition, a 3rd line guy now in the twilight of an excellent career.   I am not sure he got through to the youngsters, I hope he did.   I would love to pick his brain after the season and get his real thoughts on this group and the entire organization.  
• Joker - he is playing well most of the time.  He does not fill the bill as a top 4.   His game is similar to Dahlin, Power, and R Johnson - a puck mover and not a heavy hitter or a defense first guy.   His presence "blocks" adding the big tough defensive defenseman that we still need.  More of a 5/6 that can move up to top 4 in a pinch.  Very tradeable IMO.  
• Ryan Johnson - he has played well in sheltered minutes.  He looks to be smart, good skater, good passer, his head is up and he is usually composed.   He lacks ideal size and strength, but still very young and will get stronger, will rely on mobility, passing and breakout skill to become a solid NHL player.  Due to injuries on the team his minutes have gone up lately and he is looking much more like a rookie now.  In fact, I thought he was targeted by the Ducks.  Despite not having the last line change the Ducks had their best line out there against RJ for all three 2nd period goals.  We hardly saw RJ in the 3rd period.   Coincidence?   This speaks more about the terrible game day coaching that we continually get from Don Granato and his staff.  I will be watching Ryan closely tonight as I expect Montreal will try to take advantage.  
• Bryson - an AHL/NHL tweener and a 8/9 guy on the roster.  

In summary - the defense is better than last year, improving on that was not a high bar either.  Some of it is the better goaltending (UPL).  Some of it is the better players at 5/6/7.  Some of it is the system changes that focus more on defense (and consequently stifles our ability to score).  

There need to be changes next year.  This still not a playoff caliber group but just a few moves away from it.  

Very good analysis @Pimlach…

Think you are generous in your assessment and value of Power and Samuelson… Power is soft and you can’t train tough… Samuelson is injury prone… Would trade both for the right pieces…

Agree with your trade ideas… Would say we need a gritty no nonsense vet over 25 with  SC experience… either a top 4 D or power forward… with a good shot and puck handling skills, and strong PP leadership who can takeover QB of our top PP… Move Dahlin to the 2nd Unit.

 

Edited February 21 by Believer

[North Buffalo]

Hard with young defenseman to guage toughness... Dahlin got tougher after a few years, Bryson too though still a 5-6 but really good skater, Joker's shot one of the few really good from the point and his D is much better... Im ok with bringing in a tough big youngish vet but has to be able to skate... not a lot out there.. check Calgary... maybe Tanev?

[Doohickie]

19 hours ago, Doohickie said:

No, you don't get off that easy.  You and @Thorny have dragged me into the depths of negativity.  You can't just apologize and make me feel better about things.  😉

You don't agree with that mention, @Thorny?  The way I see it, I've been looking at the team through rose colored glasses for some time.  I didn't mean my post to be a knock against you.  I was recognize that you and @GASabresIUFAN have been realistic about the team, and I'm finally recognizing and embracing the view that this team needs fixing.  I included you because more and more lately, I tend to agree with you.

[GASabresIUFAN]

17 hours ago, Thorny said:

You follow baseball: how hilarious is it that the Jays literally just did the Kevyn Adams offseason haha 

I’m not a Jays fan.  I’m a Braves fan and have been one since Hank Aaron’s quest for 715.  The Braves stadium is literally across the street from my office.  

The Braves also have crappy ownership (Liberty Media), but Liberty at least stays out of the way, mostly.  Somehow the Braves continue to win.
 

 

[mjd1001]

51 minutes ago, North Buffalo said:

Hard with young defenseman to guage toughness... Dahlin got tougher after a few years, Bryson too though still a 5-6 but really good skater, Joker's shot one of the few really good from the point and his D is much better... Im ok with bringing in a tough big youngish vet but has to be able to skate... not a lot out there.. check Calgary... maybe Tanev?

Isn't Tanev in his mid 30's, older than Johnson?  Not sure I'll have to look it up.  I'd be ok with bringing in an older vet on a 1 year deal.  Ideally, a 27-29 year old, REAL top 4 guy with 400-500+ games NHL experience would be perfect, but no-one wants to give up those guys.  But if you can find an older Vet willing to take 1-2 years, I'll all for having one on the roster.  Johnson hasn't been great, but I don't think he has been as bad as many say.

Edited February 21 by mjd1001

[JohnC]

2 hours ago, Pimlach said:

John, my comments on your review of the defense: 

• We have Dahlin and the rest are all question marks. Everyone after Dahlin is tradeable with the exception of Power who needs a longer look and who's contract makes him almost impossible to move
• Mule had a rough year.   Hopefully he gets better next year.  We desperately need more physical presence from a guy with his size.  His ability to play a tougher game, to clear out the front of the net, and to be rugged and durable is still a major question mark.  He has big potential still.  
• Power had a sophomore slump.  Not gonna comment further, just leave it at that.   He is going to be very highly paid next year and he needs to grow up faster than the average defenseman because of it.  He has a ton of work to do this off season.  Not sure Adams did him any favors  - this kid will be making $8.35M and wont be 22 until November.    😞  
• We lack the big, strong, steady stay at home RHD that would help Power immensely.  This is a major need.   We don't need another Clifton - we need a top 4 veteran in his prime years to steady this group and take minutes away from Power.  We should be able to add this player and keep Mitts.  
• The addition of Clifton is fine for the 3rd pair.  He hits, he is a tough middle weight player, he shows ability to clear the net and to be rugged.  He has periods of being error prone but as a 5/6/7 that is normal.  
• The addition of EJ will end this after this.  He was a one year addition, a 3rd line guy now in the twilight of an excellent career.   I am not sure he got through to the youngsters, I hope he did.   I would love to pick his brain after the season and get his real thoughts on this group and the entire organization.  
• Joker - he is playing well most of the time.  He does not fill the bill as a top 4.   His game is similar to Dahlin, Power, and R Johnson - a puck mover and not a heavy hitter or a defense first guy.   His presence "blocks" adding the big tough defensive defenseman that we still need.  More of a 5/6 that can move up to top 4 in a pinch.  Very tradeable IMO.  
• Ryan Johnson - he has played well in sheltered minutes.  He looks to be smart, good skater, good passer, his head is up and he is usually composed.   He lacks ideal size and strength, but still very young and will get stronger, will rely on mobility, passing and breakout skill to become a solid NHL player.  Due to injuries on the team his minutes have gone up lately and he is looking much more like a rookie now.  In fact, I thought he was targeted by the Ducks.  Despite not having the last line change the Ducks had their best line out there against RJ for all three 2nd period goals.  We hardly saw RJ in the 3rd period.   Coincidence?   This speaks more about the terrible game day coaching that we continually get from Don Granato and his staff.  I will be watching Ryan closely tonight as I expect Montreal will try to take advantage.  
• Bryson - an AHL/NHL tweener and a 8/9 guy on the roster.  

In summary - the defense is better than last year, improving on that was not a high bar either.  Some of it is the better goaltending (UPL).  Some of it is the better players at 5/6/7.  Some of it is the system changes that focus more on defense (and consequently stifles our ability to score).  

There need to be changes next year.  This still not a playoff caliber group but just a few moves away from it.  

The main point of my post is reflected by your last sentence. With internal improvement and a few judicious moves this should become a playoff team next year. 

With respect to the defensive unit, I have a general/philosophical disagreement with how you and others(  @GASabresIUFAN )view the blueline unit. If I had the choice of adding a top two pair player defender at the cost of losing MItts, I say no. I would rather add another Clifton type defender and go with Joki, Ryan Johnson to the upper pairings as support players for Dahlin, Power and Samuelsson. I see a lot of value in Mitts's versatility as a center and winger who could move up to the higher lines when needed. 

I'm not arguing for standing pat. That is certainly not what I am advocating here. This franchise has prospect assets and draft assets to parlay. There will be roster spots available for new additions to vie for.  With a few judicious moves this should be a better squad. There are those who strenuously and emotionally argue to blow up the roster. In my opinion, they are misguided. 

[JohnC]

3 hours ago, Weave said:

Wait….. Am I correctly reading that you are OK with mostly rolling this back next season?

As far as mostly bringing back this roster next year, I say yes. That doesn't mean that the GM should choose to pursue the status quo. That's not what I'm advocating here. There should be at least 3-4, if not more roster spots open next season. (Okposo, maybe Girgs, Olof, possibly Eric Johnson, and maybe more.) The GM has a surplus number of prospects and a full list of draft picks. If he judiciously uses them to bring in some bigger and tougher players to have a better mix of players, then we will have a more well-rounded roster. In general, most of the improvement will come from within with players such as Peterka/Quinn/Power/Ryan Johnson/UPL/Levi etc. improving as they gain more experience. 

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, mjd1001 said:

Isn't Tanev in his mid 30's, older than Johnson?  Not sure I'll have to look it up.  I'd be ok with bringing in an older vet on a 1 year deal.  Ideally, a 27-29 year old, REAL top 4 guy with 400-500+ games NHL experience would be perfect, but no-one wants to give up those guys.  But if you can find an older Vet willing to take 1-2 years, I'll all for having one on the roster.  Johnson hasn't been great, but I don't think he has been as bad as many say.

Tanev does not meet the veteran in prime requirements.  

[Weave]

7 minutes ago, JohnC said:

As far as mostly bringing back this roster next year, I say yes. That doesn't mean that the GM should choose to pursue the status quo. That's not what I'm advocating here. There should be at least 3-4, if not more roster spots open next season. (Okposo, maybe Girgs, Olof, possibly Eric Johnson, and maybe more.) The GM has a surplus number of prospects and a full list of draft picks. If he judiciously uses them to bring in some bigger and tougher players to have a better mix of players, then we will have a more well-rounded roster. In general, most of the improvement will come from within with players such as Peterka/Quinn/Power/Ryan Johnson/UPL/Levi etc. improving as they gain more experience. 

Got it.

My floor for turnover from the outside is 4 players.  I won’t quibble at 3, but I think 3 isn’t quite going to do this.

Emphasis on players coming from outside the organization.  

[JohnC]

1 minute ago, Weave said:

Got it.

My floor for turnover from the outside is 4 players.  I won’t quibble at 3, but I think 3 isn’t quite going to do this.

Emphasis on players coming from outside the organization.  

My money would be 4 or more rather than 3. To start off, Olof, Okposo, Girgs?? , Eric Johnson and a lower line player will probably be gone or sent down. The organization has assets to maneuver with. Will our GM be willing to parlay them? I think so because this roster needs a jolt. There has to be a better mix to this roster. A few bigger and tougher additions will make a qualitative difference, at least that is what I believe to be the case. 

[mjd1001]

34 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The main point of my post is reflected by your last sentence. With internal improvement and a few judicious moves this should become a playoff team next year. 

With respect to the defensive unit, I have a general/philosophical disagreement with how you and others(  @GASabresIUFAN )view the blueline unit. If I had the choice of adding a top two pair player defender at the cost of losing MItts, I say no. I would rather add another Clifton type defender and go with Joki, Ryan Johnson to the upper pairings as support players for Dahlin, Power and Samuelsson. I see a lot of value in Mitts's versatility as a center and winger who could move up to the higher lines when needed. 

I'm not arguing for standing pat. That is certainly not what I am advocating here. This franchise has prospect assets and draft assets to parlay. There will be roster spots available for new additions to vie for.  With a few judicious moves this should be a better squad. There are those who strenuously and emotionally argue to blow up the roster. In my opinion, they are misguided. 

I see where you are coming from at least.   Dahlin, Power (whether we want it or not) and Samuelson are going to get their huge minutes. Jokiharju usually gets above average minutes. The top 4 (at least the top 3) on this team WILL get those minutes because of what they invested in them, and they are still young so they need experience. That leaves less minutes for the bottom 3 (or bottom 2, depending on Jokiharju).  So, all things being equal, I'd LOVE a good, veterain, top minute (and likely top dollar) guy. But when balancing budget and ice time, the balance between how much use you will get out of a good forward (Mitts) or a good D-man....well, spending $6-$7m on each, you might get more value out of that forward with the way the minutes are split up on this blueline.

I think the going-rate for Mitts will be at last $6m per season, more than likely even higher...and as 'good' as he is, I don't see him as a difference maker. But if he is an important part of the team...yeah, those decisions have to be made.

Edited February 21 by mjd1001

[JohnC]

18 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

I see where you are coming from at least.   Dahlin, Power (whether we want it or not) and Samuelson are going to get their huge minutes. Jokiharju usually gets above average minutes. The top 4 (at least the top 3) on this team WILL get those minutes because of what they invested in them, and they are still young so they need experience. That leaves less minutes for the bottom 3 (or bottom 2, depending on Jokiharju).  So, all things being equal, I'd LOVE a good, veterain, top minute (and likely top dollar) guy. But when balancing budget and ice time, the balance between how much use you will get out of a good forward (Mitts) or a good D-man....well, spending $6-$7m on each, you might get more value out of that forward with the way the minutes are split up on this blueline.

I think the going-rate for Mitts will be at last $6m per season, more than likely even higher...and as 'good' as he is, I don't see him as a difference maker. But if he is an important part of the team...yeah, those decisions have to be made.

Injuries are part of the game. They can't be avoided. As I have said on a number of occasions, his value is increased because of his versatility as a winger and center. And he is talented enough where he can be moved up to the top line and still keep it functioning as a top line. That was keenly demonstrated when Tage was hurt last year and Mitts was moved up to his spot. That line didn't kept playing at a high level with him centering it. 

[RochesterExpat]

On 2/20/2024 at 12:42 PM, GASabresIUFAN said:

There are positives that bode well for the future.

1. UPL - This is the biggest shock.  I honestly thought he was going to play himself out of the NHL and back to Europe.  Outside of yesterday, he has looked like a completely different goalie.  If Adams says he saw this coming he’s not telling the truth.  If Marty Biron, a good NHL goalie and a very good analyst, didn’t see this coming, no way Adams did.

 The UPL development has allowed Levi to develop properly in Rochester and turned goaltending from a weakness to a strength.

I don't want to rain on the parade, but UPL was the bottom of three goalies on the depth chart at the start of the season. He came in unprepared from the offseason. He was not ready. This isn't revisionist view or some kind of "hot take" on what transpired. Marty himself noted that UPL looked unprepared during camp and preseason. He did not play well until a third of the way through this season.

What's to say this isn't the same situation next season? I don't question UPL's talent. I question whether he has a professional mindset.

[ExWNYer]

17 hours ago, French Collection said:

It really is tough being positive this year. I’ve stayed away from discussions because I had nothing good to say and was not wanting to pile on.

The forum has had a more negative vibe than usual and I have fallen into that rut more often than I like. This team has just frustrated me to no end. The Jekyll and Hyde performances have driven me nuts, how can a team hovering near .500 not be able to win 3 in a row?

I am sure that the expectations I had for this season are what makes this hurt. By this point I would usually know they’re not going anywhere and start focusing on the draft but I have no desire to do that this season. I’ve been there and done that for 13 years, this was going to be the year where they make the playoffs and pick in the teens for a change.

Oh well, I guess I am the fool for believing the hype and putting my heart on the line. It’s part of being a fan but it hurts.

 

[Believer]

1 hour ago, RochesterExpat said:

I don't want to rain on the parade, but UPL was the bottom of three goalies on the depth chart at the start of the season. He came in unprepared from the offseason. He was not ready. This isn't revisionist view or some kind of "hot take" on what transpired. Marty himself noted that UPL looked unprepared during camp and preseason. He did not play well until a third of the way through this season.

What's to say this isn't the same situation next season? I don't question UPL's talent. I question whether he has a professional mindset.

Hmm… Was under the impression UPL has a rigorous off season program… Seem to recall reading or hearing it earlier this season.

[RochesterExpat]

31 minutes ago, Believer said:

Hmm… Was under the impression UPL has a rigorous off season program… Seem to recall reading or hearing it earlier this season.

You may be thinking of last season. Going back to the 2022-23 offseason, UPL trained in Finland with KHL coaches and that was considered rigorous, but it was also his first off-season in like 3 years where he wasn't recovering from an injury.

This season he did not enter camp prepared. That was an observation made by numerous people including Marty.

[mjd1001]

On 2/20/2024 at 12:35 PM, GASabresIUFAN said:

My friend @Taro T once pointed out to me that I was once one of the most positive voices on the board and that over the last few years, I’ve become quite negative.  For that, I apologize.  I am not, in general, a negative person.  I am quite the opposite.  

However I looked at my posts recently and I have let my frustration and anger with Adams and the Sabres grow to the point that it’s ruined my enjoyment of watching the team.  Not that the frustration is misplaced.  However, it’s ruined the game for me, so it’s time to take a step back.  Time to concentrate on the Braves and fantasy baseball.

All that said, the Sabres have a ton of assets to work with, but it’s time for Adams to step up and learn from Beane.  This will be the 13th season without playoffs in a league where 50% of the teams make the playoffs every year.  If there is a 14th year, Adams will be gone.  

 

 

People are frustrated I get it. I am too, although I don't take the team, or sports, as seriously as I used to.  But I wanted to re-read your original post.  I'm finding out lately that its not so much being a fan of the team that is frustrating the most lately, it is the art of talking about the team.  In most of my posts, I will try to not be emotional....I might disagree with someone and I'll point out where I do (at least in my original post) but I am finding more and more emotional responses, getting attacked when you disagree with someone.  Worse yet, I noticed in the gameday threads...it is getting really bad. Yeah, the team is not making the playoffs this year, but since January 1, this team has been playing much better, and even most of the losses are close.  Yet, play the best team in the league, lose by one goal, and there is just hatred, venom all over the boards, (I won't even mention twitter).  Attacking people you don't agree with. Hatred, resentment, outright hostility in more and more posts.  

Yeah, this message board is here for people to give their opinion. To vent, I get that, but things are getting over the top (at least to me)

[sabrefanday1]

28 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

People are frustrated I get it. I am too, although I don't take the team, or sports, as seriously as I used to.  But I wanted to re-read your original post.  I'm finding out lately that its not so much being a fan of the team that is frustrating the most lately, it is the art of talking about the team.  In most of my posts, I will try to not be emotional....I might disagree with someone and I'll point out where I do (at least in my original post) but I am finding more and more emotional responses, getting attacked when you disagree with someone.  Worse yet, I noticed in the gameday threads...it is getting really bad. Yeah, the team is not making the playoffs this year, but since January 1, this team has been playing much better, and even most of the losses are close.  Yet, play the best team in the league, lose by one goal, and there is just hatred, venom all over the boards, (I won't even mention twitter).  Attacking people you don't agree with. Hatred, resentment, outright hostility in more and more posts.  

Yeah, this message board is here for people to give their opinion. To vent, I get that, but things are getting over the top (at least to me)

Totally agree...it is so predictable that the moment the team loses in a hard fought game where they played excellent and the refs basically gave this game away, the haters are on cue with thei rnegative remarks about every player. People tend to forget that no opinion is a wrong opinion...it is their own opinion, and for someone else to answer sarcastically or put down another becuase they do not agree with another's opinion is in itself wrong. I too love this team from the first day they entered the NHL, and have so many great memories (Pominville's OT winner against Otttawa was insane among other highlights). I too get down and I have lost much interest this year but truth is that the team seems to be headed in the right direction...a few changes are needed yes but we sure have a lot of good young talent that pother teams would die for.

  I do wonder however if Meatballs is the right coach long-term moving forward? Stil cannot see them firing him anytime soon

[Porous Five Hole]

On 2/21/2024 at 9:39 AM, Sabres Fan in NS said:

A Super Bowl is more lusted after by TP.  It kind of makes sense, I suppose.

 

What makes you say that? Is it his recency bias because the Bills hit on Josh Allen and they’re very good? Or because the Bills are the shinier and newer toy?

Pegula gets a ton of shade thrown his way in the Sabrehood and I’m not going to devolve into what is fair and what isn’t. But maybe you’re thinking it’s because he gets so much Sabres related hate he cares less today?

Tell me everything…

Edited February 29 by Porous Five Hole