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2019 Stanley Cup Playoffs First Round

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3 hours ago, Doohickie said:

The Vegas penalty and the Saints call are simply not comparable injustices.  Just stop with that stuff.

How are they not comparable?  Both are related 100% to actions of officials blowing a call that lead to an extremely favorable outcome for the opposing team.

2 hours ago, Doohickie said:

In addition to what Swede said, there is also the fact that the Saints call was a total miss of a call that should have been made, versus the Vegas call was incorrect in the matter of degree (a penalty should have been called and they called it, but it should have only been a minor penalty).  Also, there was no reasonable excuse for the Saints call; it was at the primary focus point of the play with no players between the official and the infraction.  In last night's game, the ref *thought* he saw a cross-check to the face (that's what they told Gallant).  You can see in the replay that wasn't the case, but in real time that's what they thought happened.

And if the call were a minor penalty there would have been 1 PP goal scored and that would be that.

There's no reasonable excuse for the refs call last night except that someone was thinking "Jesus christ, the captain is bleeding from the head on the ice and we missed something so we better call something."  They didn't think there was a cross-check at all (let alone one to the face) as was indicated by no referee signalling a penalty. It stinks to high hell of 100% immediate revisionist history once the OUTCOME of the play was realized. 

Regardless of all of that. It's a blown call by an official that leads to an extremely favorable outcome for the opposing team. They are comparable.

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

Do you still coach soccer?  If there were a sudden and overwhelming momentum shift and you had the ability to take a timeout (I know there are no timeouts in soccer), wouldn't you?  You see it in college basketball all the time in that situation.

I've coached hockey.  I've called timeout before and watched as nothing changed whatsoever.

Keep in mind, you call the timeout and you've given the other team carte blanche to squeeze that blue line or interfere with the goaltender. One missed call by an official and a goal is scored and there's no chance for Vegas to review it.  It's not like there wasn't some precedent for these officials to screw up a call, right?  😉

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1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

This doesn't wash, though, with regard to the ref on that side of the ice who had a clear view of the draw. If he thought he saw a cross check to the chops - why did his hand not go up?

Because it's the playoffs? Then when he "realized" (erroneously) the cross check caused an injury, he had to make the call, or lobby for the call with the other ref. Just a theory.

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5 hours ago, LTS said:

The bad calls usually don't result in an ejection and a 5 minute power play.  You have to PK, sure, but you there's no way you should be PK'ing a 5 minute call.  Would you tell the Saints to suck it up because the refs screwed up pass interference?

Rule 59 – Cross-checking

  • 59.1 Cross-checking - The action of using the shaft of the stick between the two hands to forcefully check an opponent.
  • 59.2 Minor Penalty - A minor penalty, at the discretion of the Referee based on the severity of the contact, shall be imposed on a player who “cross checks” an opponent.
  • 59.3 Major Penalty - A major penalty, at the discretion of the Referee based on the severity of the contact, shall be imposed on a player who “cross checks” an opponent (see 59.5).
  • 59.4 Match Penalty – The Referee, at his discretion, may assess a match penalty if, in his judgment, the player attempted to or deliberately injured his opponent by cross-checking.
  • 59.5 Game Misconduct Penalty - When a major penalty is assessed for cross-checking, an automatic game misconduct penalty shall be imposed on the offending player.
  • 59.6 Fines and Suspensions - When a major penalty is imposed under this rule, an automatic fine of one hundred dollars ($100) shall also be imposed. If deemed appropriate, supplementary discipline can be applied by the Commissioner at his discretion (refer to Rule 28).

In order for the referees to be justified in calling a major penalty the penalty has to be a deliberate attempt to injure. (see: Kadri, Nazim).  In this case, the cross-check is not to the head.

Re: the bolded, are you getting major and match mixed up?

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So going back to "the call" for a minute--I've read a couple of things elsewhere that have expanded my view.

What happens if the refs don't give 5 + game to Eakin?  You have a situation where a team is down 3-0, with ten minutes left, their captain is out and bleeding from his helmet, in a series where there had been plenty of nastiness on both sides.  The refs would have completely lost control.  I think you're looking at a Buffalo vs. Ottawa situation there.  Since everything I've read indicates that 2 + 10 would not have been allowed, the refs might have saved a few players some headaches (not metaphorically) with that call.

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30 minutes ago, Eleven said:

So going back to "the call" for a minute--I've read a couple of things elsewhere that have expanded my view.

What happens if the refs don't give 5 + game to Eakin?  You have a situation where a team is down 3-0, with ten minutes left, their captain is out and bleeding from his helmet, in a series where there had been plenty of nastiness on both sides.  The refs would have completely lost control.  I think you're looking at a Buffalo vs. Ottawa situation there.  Since everything I've read indicates that 2 + 10 would not have been allowed, the refs might have saved a few players some headaches (not metaphorically) with that call.

I agree that the game probably would of gotten out of control. The players on the ice barely reacted to the hit and when they did they had words with a different player. You shouldn’t call a 5 plus game bc your worried that the game will get out of hand. If it does that’s when you start handing out 5 and 10 minute misconducts.

We will truly know what the NHL thinks maybe hides behind if DOPS gets involved. 

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1 hour ago, PASabreFan said:

Because it's the playoffs? Then when he "realized" (erroneously) the cross check caused an injury, he had to make the call, or lobby for the call with the other ref. Just a theory.

I think that's about how it played out. And, if so, it's a total shemozzle.

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

So going back to "the call" for a minute--I've read a couple of things elsewhere that have expanded my view.

What happens if the refs don't give 5 + game to Eakin?  You have a situation where a team is down 3-0, with ten minutes left, their captain is out and bleeding from his helmet, in a series where there had been plenty of nastiness on both sides.  The refs would have completely lost control.  I think you're looking at a Buffalo vs. Ottawa situation there.  Since everything I've read indicates that 2 + 10 would not have been allowed, the refs might have saved a few players some headaches (not metaphorically) with that call.

This is a logical thought process. I still don't think it can justify the decision that was made.

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No matter what, the game will move on, the referees will have no reprocussions and the better team will still be watching from the couch. 

That's a foreable offense if not one that suspends that official from the rest of the playoffs, but we all know, that isn't gonna happen. 

I wish I could do my job poorly and still have one

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The officials blowning calls is an interesting debate but just another footnote in all the bad or blown calls that I’ve seen since watching the four major sports.   I chalk this up to the Knights choking more than anything else.  Biggest choke in a playoff game that I can recall.   

Apparently the refs did not look at replays.  I guess that is not part of the NHL format yet, even though goals are looked at and offsides can be called minutes after it occurred.  

A replay assessment would have yielded a cross check minor, maybe a double minor if Pavelski was bleeding.  There was no intent to injure so there would have been no game misconduct.   Four minutes versus five means that SJ would have scored 2 and then back to even strength and no telling if Vegas still finds a way to choke.   They would have had Eakin so maybe they could have held it together.

Welcome to the big leagues Vegas.  

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I'll note that the arena is silent, SILENT, @PASabreFan in a game 7 with the home team up.  It's DC, which I've explained before is not a hockey city, but it is SILENT.

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1 minute ago, Eleven said:

I'll note that the arena is silent, SILENT, @PASabreFan in a game 7 with the home team up.  It's DC, which I've explained before is not a hockey city, but it is SILENT.

It’s that nervous, “Uh oh, we’re about to blow this” silence.

If Carolina wins, the Bruins would be the highest remaining seed left. Yikes.

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10 minutes ago, Buffalo Wings said:

How is Carolina doing this?

Holtby letting in a couple of brutal goals is helping, a lot.

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20 minutes ago, Buffalo Wings said:

It’s that nervous, “Uh oh, we’re about to blow this” silence.

If Carolina wins, the Bruins would be the highest remaining seed left. Yikes.

Aren't they (the Bruins) already?

In any event, I'm out after regular time.  I have too much going on tomorrow.  Goodnight all!

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