TrueBlueGED Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 I think you're over-simplifying the proposition. Which is a weird thing for you to do. There are reasons that that part of the WR route tree has worked elsewhere. Those reasons may or may not be present here, in sufficient measure. +++ @Wildcard: Bills are going to make the playoffs, lose by 30 in a wildcard game, and Rex will be fired. Okay, why wouldn't it work here? Tyrod is at his best 1) throwing outside the hashes and 2) when throwing to clearly defined reads. Sammy was arguably the best bubble screen WR in college history (this is NOT hyperbole). We have offensive guards who are adept at pulling. Robert Woods is a very good blocking receiver. What is missing to stop this from being part of the offense? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 I think you're over-simplifying the proposition. Which is a weird thing for you to do. There are reasons that that part of the WR route tree has worked elsewhere. Those reasons may or may not be present here, in sufficient measure. +++ @Wildcard: Bills are going to make the playoffs, lose by 30 in a wildcard game, and Rex will be fired. I mean, sign me right the hell up for that. That's like a dream come true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Okay, why wouldn't it work here? Tyrod is at his best 1) throwing outside the hashes and 2) when throwing to clearly defined reads. Sammy was arguably the best bubble screen WR in college history (this is NOT hyperbole). We have offensive guards who are adept at pulling. Robert Woods is a very good blocking receiver. What is missing to stop this from being part of the offense? I'm not a big X's and O's guy, but my mind harkens back to how Gailey & Fitz got a bit unmasked (by Rex, for one) when teams realized how flat and horizontal the approach was. My thought (theory?) is that Taylor can't do everything that Matt Ryan does and Peyton Manning did -- or, at least, he can't do them consistently and credibly -- such that those bubble screens that looked so useful in the hands of other offences might not be nearly as useful in this one. Just a thought. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Chan and Fitz failed because Fitz couldn't throw deep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Chan and Fitz failed because Fitz couldn't throw deep Sure. And Tyrod can't exploit the middle of the field, etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Sure. And Tyrod can't exploit the middle of the field, etc. He can't, but he can throw deep, so safeties and corner s have to respect it and can't just crowd in, thereby eliminating the screen Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 He can't, but he can throw deep, so safeties and corner s have to respect it and can't just crowd in, thereby eliminating the screen He can't throw deep. Yes, the receivers have been hurt, but each week there's footage of Goodwin streaking wide open and TT has thrown it to him on that route maybe once or twice all season. He threw a handful of nice deep balls over a year ago, but hasn't since. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 21, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 He can't, but he can throw deep, so safeties and corner s have to respect it and can't just crowd in, thereby eliminating the screen He's capable of throwing a nice deep ball, sure. Flagg's points below are valid in that regard. My larger point remains: The things that make this type of play effective for Peyton Manning or Matt Ryan may not all be in place for the Bills and Taylor. I'm not smart enough to know whether that's the case, but, if it were as simple as incorporating these kinds of plays into the playbook, don't you think the Bills would have done so by now? He can't throw deep. Yes, the receivers have been hurt, but each week there's footage of Goodwin streaking wide open and TT has thrown it to him on that route maybe once or twice all season. He threw a handful of nice deep balls over a year ago, but hasn't since. He throws a lovely deep ball. A bit more air under it than maybe you'd like, but it's pretty darn accurate. The question, maybe, is whether he sees things quickly and clearly enough to make those throws when he should. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 He's capable of throwing a nice deep ball, sure. Flagg's points below are valid in that regard. My larger point remains: The things that make this type of play effective for Peyton Manning or Matt Ryan may not all be in place for the Bills and Taylor. I'm not smart enough to know whether that's the case, but, if it were as simple as incorporating these kinds of plays into the playbook, don't you think the Bills would have done so by now? He throws a lovely deep ball. A bit more air under it than maybe you'd like, but it's pretty darn accurate. The question, maybe, is whether he sees things quickly and clearly enough to make those throws when he should. I view that as being just as much a part of being able to throw deep as actually getting the ball to the point. I agree that the ball looks pretty and generally is put where a receiver can make a play, the two times this season it's happened. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted December 21, 2016 Report Share Posted December 21, 2016 Chan and Fitz failed because Fitz couldn't throw deepChan & Fitz failed because Fitz couldn't throw after messing up his ribs in the ONLY game the Bills won in TO. (So, even though they won, they STILL lost there. :angry:) Thanks again Russ for dreaming up the Toronto series. :censored: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkard Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 (edited) He can't throw deep. Yes, the receivers have been hurt, but each week there's footage of Goodwin streaking wide open and TT has thrown it to him on that route maybe once or twice all season. He threw a handful of nice deep balls over a year ago, but hasn't since. We this is a flat out lie. You can hate Taylor all you want but try using facts instead of nonsense. He threw a handful of nice deep balls over a year ago? So not a single one this season? I remember 2 or 3 great deep balls against the Jets alone this season that went for touchdowns including at least one of them to Goodwin. I'd argue that he throws a great deep ball, he just doesn't do it nearly enough and his biggest problems are avoiding the middle of the field and missing open receivers. To say he can't throw it deep is either disingenuous, lazy, or just plain old lying. Edited December 22, 2016 by Drunkard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 WGR hearing rumors the Pegula have been talking to Coughlin and are ready to move on from Tyrod Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 WGR hearing rumors the Pegula have been talking to Coughlin and are ready to move on from Tyrod There were also rumors of the talking last offseason,FWIW. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drunkard Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 (edited) WGR hearing rumors the Pegula have been talking to Coughlin and are ready to move on from Tyrod They better move on from Rex too. If we're going to start from scratch with a new QB we need to bring in an offensive minded head coach that knows how to develop a QB. Edited December 22, 2016 by Drunkard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 They better move on from Rex too. If we're going to start from scratch with a new QB we need to bring in an offensive minded head coach that knows how to develop a QB. I don't think they want Coughlin to play QB :UNSURE: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 I don't think they want Coughlin to play QB :UNSURE:Might as well at this point Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 The Coughlin thing certainly seems to refuse to die. There must be some truth to it. I like Coughlin. I don't know if he does anything for us. But I like him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samson's Flow Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 The Coughlin thing certainly seems to refuse to die. There must be some truth to it. I like Coughlin. I don't know if he does anything for us. But I like him. To me Coughlin is just the new Cowher or Parcells. Names from the past that desperate backward-looking teams cling to but never materializes. How about a new forward-looking hire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 To me Coughlin is just the new Cowher or Parcells. Names from the past that desperate backward-looking teams cling to but never materializes. How about a new forward-looking hire? That d coordinator down in Tampa Bengals coach Lindy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 I would love to see Coughlin here. Just not as the coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 Tom Coughlin would be the quintessential Pegula pick. It'd be the Sabres game presentation of head coaches. I honestly don't think it would produce a single emotional reaction from me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 We this is a flat out lie. You can hate Taylor all you want but try using facts instead of nonsense. He threw a handful of nice deep balls over a year ago? So not a single one this season? I remember 2 or 3 great deep balls against the Jets alone this season that went for touchdowns including at least one of them to Goodwin. I'd argue that he throws a great deep ball, he just doesn't do it nearly enough and his biggest problems are avoiding the middle of the field and missing open receivers. To say he can't throw it deep is either disingenuous, lazy, or just plain old lying. Well, you missed my point. I view finding the receiver and making the decision to throw as an equal part of "throwing the deep ball" compared to the actual mechanics of his throw. It did look pretty that one time he threw it 4 weeks ago. In the last 10 games or so, I can remember exactly one completed deep ball, to Sammy. There may have been another Goodwin TD in there that I'm forgetting, but two deep ball completions since the Jets game that I remember (I'm looking for stats that show how many there are, can't find any) does not indicate that this throw is a "weapon" of his. If he's not making the throws, I can't put it in the "pro" side of TT's "pros and cons" list. He can't throw a deep ball because he can't find receivers. He threw way more deep balls a season ago than he did this year, and it's not because of injuries. There were 2-3 times a game where replays showed receivers that would have been gone if he wasn't already scrambling for no reason or dumping the ball off to Shady after getting nervous in the pocket. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 22, 2016 Author Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 ^ I don't think there's any debating that he throws a really nice deep ball - maybe one of the best in the league (like, top 5 even). But his pocket composure and ability to see and read the field are below average among NFL quarterbacks. My larger concern with Taylor has always been the limitations he has with some of the mid-range throws (the ~15 yard in's or digs (?) that Watkins runs, for example). Not only does he not see those well, but he doesn't throw them well either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JujuFish Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 I would dispute it. He had terrible accuracy from what I've seen on long balls. Manuel throws a better deep ball. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CallawaySabres Posted December 22, 2016 Report Share Posted December 22, 2016 If anyone thinks coaching is what is holding this team back, they are delusional. Keep Rex one more year and see what happens with someone else at QB. I would be fine keeping everything the same for one more year but Tyrod is gone with that contract. If I was Pegula, I keep Rex one more year and throw Cordale Jones in for 2017. You either pull a Cleveland (or close) and get your QB in the following draft......OR Jones shows he has the stuff and your question is answered. If the Bills sink next year, you clear out everybody. This team has ZERO chance of being better than this year with a new coach, system and QB. Unless they can land Romo or Cousins, this team would be doing nothing but spinning their wheels if they changed coaches again. Hit pause for another year as the QB position is nowhere close to being fixed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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