Two or less Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 #1 picks don't guarantee anything. Just ask Edmonton. Bad example. Edmonton is a case that their "tank" period when the team was awful, came at a time where the drafts were offensive strong, but defensively weak. They didn't draft the wrong guys and miss out on studs that are making them look like fools now. Sabres on the other hand, have a very solid mix of youth as is and are extremely well build on defense. They are very weak in top-6 forwards category and Connor McDavid would be the biggest addition they could ever get for top-6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 22+28 in like 60 games as a rookie? Yeah I'd say so. People are getting so hyped on McDavid they forgot how much MacKinnon was hyped, too. For sure. For as hyped as MacKinnon was, though, he's still not on the same level as MacKinnon. My guess is this is a good place to emphasize the difference between star and superstar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Too early to tell in 2013, but MacKinnon looks like a star. Should be a Sabre. Buffalo was by far the worst team in the league but efforted their way out of the top pick. Had that not happened, everything would be different. Sigh... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Should be a Sabre. Buffalo was by far the worst team in the league but efforted their way out of the top pick. Had that not happened, everything would be different. Sigh... Certainly. While I've stated that I think, and most everybody thinks this, that McDavid will be even better than MacKinnon, I would've been plenty satisfied with MacKinnon and competing now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 MacKinnon did not get as much hype as McDavid. No he didn't, but he was still drawing Sidney Crosby comparisons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Amerk Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 No he didn't, but he was still drawing Sidney Crosby comparisons. People have drawn comparisons of Crosby to Butt-Head and Andy Samberg. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Bottom line for me is this: The Red Wings have been a mark of consistency and elite play for a very long time in the NHL (not so much lately but they are still good) I don't recall them having high draft picks to build with to build the team they had, and as well use FA to their advantage when need be. Tim Murray needs to draft well, regardless of where he picks, and Pegula needs to spend the right way when needed. #1 picks don't guarantee anything. Just ask Edmonton. Really Detroit? They got Zetterberg and Datsyuk in the 6th and 7th rounds and had Nick Lidstrom on their blue line for 20 years. As to the rest I agree, we need to draft well no matter where, just like detroit. Edmonton has no defense and no goaltending. We have the deepest defensive prospect pool of any NHL team. Something to keep in mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Should be a Sabre. Buffalo was by far the worst team in the league but efforted their way out of the top pick. Had that not happened, everything would be different. Sigh... Yep. With MacKinnon and a top two pick this year suddenly we're not all so focused on 2015 tank. But those meaningless wins sure built some character with the kids. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Yep. With MacKinnon and a top two pick this year suddenly we're not all so focused on 2015 tank. But those meaningless wins sure built some character with the kids. I like your point. But we wouldn't be this bad with MacKinnon. Probably would be picking somewhere between 7-12 with him on the team we had to start the season. Would've changed things with Vanek, possibly. Not that he would've stayed but a trade would've taken longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Really Detroit? They got Zetterberg and Datsyuk in the 6th and 7th rounds and had Nick Lidstrom on their blue line for 20 years. As to the rest I agree, we need to draft well no matter where, just like detroit. Edmonton has no defense and no goaltending. We have the deepest defensive prospect pool of any NHL team. Something to keep in mind. Especially if the Islanders do not defer and the Sabres end up with the top two picks Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 And how old was McDavid at the WJHC ? Hey.. he's that good right? That's all I am saying. I'll assume he'll be playing in the WJHC next year. We shall see. 2004: Alexander Ovechkin, Evgeni Malkin, Cam Barker 2005: Sydney Crosby, Bobby Ryan, Jack Johnson 2006: Erik Johnson, Jordan Staal, Jonathan Toews 2007: Patrick Kane, James van Riemsdyk, Kyle Turris 2008: Steven Stamkos, Drew Doughty, Zach Bogosian 2009: John Tavares, Victor Hedman, Matt Duchene 2010: Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin, Erik Gudbranson 2011: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, Gabriel Landeskog, Jonathan Huberdeau 2012: Nail Yakupov, Ryan Murray, Alex Galchenyuk 2013: Nathan MacKinnon, Aleksander Barkov, Jonathan Druin Too early to tell in 2013, but MacKinnon looks like a star. The ones that two and three are better than just one: 2012, 2011, 2006. That's it. 2004 - Malkin and Barker over Ovechkin? Malkin has 64 points and is +12, Ovechkin has 67 points and is -25. Barker is in the KHL, so no benefit there, but I still take Malkin over Ovechkin. 2007 - Kane - 66 pts, +6 / JVR - 52pts, -2 , Turris - 51 points, +17 - tough call. I love Kane but that's an incredible point differential there. 2009 - Tavares 66 pts, -6 / Duchene - 59pts, +4, Hedman 41pts, +3 - I know Tavares is injured and he's great, but look at the F/D you get there and hte points. 2010 - Hall - 61 pts -12 / Seguin - 66 pts +13, Gudbranson - throw him in... Seguin is outperforming Hall right now. 2013 - too early to tell. It think that a team will do fine having the next two the majority of the time. One player can only play so much.. two slightly lesser players has to provide more benefit. I don't recall the Penguins going into suck mode the year they did not have Crosby and the Capitals have done a fine job of not being great a few times with Ovechkin on the roster. Bottom line.. it would be a good problem to have right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brawndo Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 I think it's an interesting question though. Truthfully I was completely unimpressed with McDavid at the WJHC. He didn't look anywhere near like the best player on the ice. Sure, he's dominating juniors but that's an overall lesser group of talent to go against. I seem to recall him sulking a bit when things weren't going his way, etc. Perhaps I missed a few things in that tournament but I was just not impressed. It seems that a team might benefit even more from have picks #2 and #3 over #1 even with the top talent on display. Just for fun the draft picks from 2004-2013 in order 2004: Alexander Ovechkin, Evgeni Malkin, Cam Barker 2005: Sydney Crosby, Bobby Ryan, Jack Johnson 2006: Erik Johnson, Jordan Staal, Jonathan Toews 2007: Patrick Kane, James van Riemsdyk, Kyle Turris 2008: Steven Stamkos, Drew Doughty, Zach Bogosian 2009: John Tavares, Victor Hedman, Matt Duchene 2010: Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin, Erik Gudbranson 2011: Ryan Nugent-Hopkins, Gabriel Landeskog, Jonathan Huberdeau 2012: Nail Yakupov, Ryan Murray, Alex Galchenyuk 2013: Nathan MacKinnon, Aleksander Barkov, Jonathan Druin It seems to me that in many cases, having the next two would be almost better than having the #1. Do you think the Oilers would have preferred next two in 2011 or 2012? I suppose that with Crosby's draft you could say that he's better than having Ryan and Johnson and that might be right, but what we don't know is how good Pittsburgh would be if Malkin was not there as well. That is on the Oilers Scouting Department and MacTavish. The advantage of having the number one pick is that team gets to pick whomever they want. In 2007 Central Scouting Services had Kane ranked as the 3rd overall prospect, Chicago felt differently and it has worked out pretty well from them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Yep. With MacKinnon and a top two pick this year suddenly we're not all so focused on 2015 tank. But those meaningless wins sure built some character with the kids. Exactly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 That is on the Oilers Scouting Department and MacTavish. The advantage of having the number one pick is that team gets to pick whomever they want. In 2007 Central Scouting Services had Kane ranked as the 3rd overall prospect, Chicago felt differently and it has worked out pretty well from them. Of course. But at the same time, take this year. If Edmonton gets the top pick by chance do you think they are going to draft a F? You think they've learned? No one knows. But they'd be insane if they did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
26CornerBlitz Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 @JeffMarek 11 points in 3 games, Erie's Connor McDavid named CHL's player of the week. 2015 looks like a nice daft #Eichel #Hanifin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 And with the first pick in 2015 the Seatle Seals pick Connor McDavid :P Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 And with the first pick in 2015 the Seatle Seals pick Connor McDavid :P They do not have enough time to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 They do not have enough time to do it. They certainly do, and I think they will. But they don't give expansion teams the first pick. And they'd likely be called the Mets again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 They certainly do, and I think they will. But they don't give expansion teams the first pick. And they'd likely be called the Mets again. You keep saying this but over the history of the league this policy has changed. It is not automatic that an expansion team doesn't get the first pick. We don't know what the league would do until they announce their intentions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 You keep saying this but over the history of the league this policy has changed. It is not automatic that an expansion team doesn't get the first pick. We don't know what the league would do until they announce their intentions. "I keep saying this." I've said it twice and provided the proof that it doesn't happen. They have been giving expansion teams the second pick or later... Sure, we don't know. But know that there would be an absolute shitstorm if they went against every precedent. Especially in the McDavid draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 "I keep saying this." I've said it twice and provided the proof that it doesn't happen. They have been giving expansion teams the second pick or later... Sure, we don't know. But know that there would be an absolute shitstorm if they went against every precedent. Especially in the McDavid draft. I can think of one expansion team we all root for that got the 1st pick overall in their 1st draft. ;) It has happened. Nothing is given. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) I can think of one expansion team we all root for that got the 1st pick overall in their 1st draft. ;) It has happened. Nothing is given. In 1970. Repost from earlier expanded: In the 1991 NHL entry draft the San Jose Sharks got the 2nd pick. In the 1992 NHL entry draft the Senators and Lightning were awarded the first two picks (DANGER DANGER AH!!) In the 1993 NHL entry draft the Ducks and Panthers got the 4th and 5th picks. In the 1998 NHL entry draft the Nashville Predators selected 2nd overall. In the 1999 NHL entry draft the Atlanta Thrashers got the 2nd pick of each round (they ended up picking first overall after trades). In the 2000 NHL entry draft the Columbus Blue Jackets and Minnesota Wild selected 3rd and 4th. Obviously there's the danger of the Senators/Lightning draft happening, but I still think there would be a shitstorm. I'd think that they would put them in the lottery with somewhere between the second and fifth best chances of winning. Edited March 12, 2014 by Tankalicious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 In 1970. Repost from earlier expanded: ... redundancy ... Yeah. I read all that earlier. You said "never" and seemed to want to dig your heels in with "never". Obviously, expansion teams getting the 1st pick has happened. "Never" is just plain inaccurate. That is the only point I am trying to make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabresBillsFan Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) Really Detroit? They got Zetterberg and Datsyuk in the 6th and 7th rounds and had Nick Lidstrom on their blue line for 20 years. As to the rest I agree, we need to draft well no matter where, just like detroit. Edmonton has no defense and no goaltending. We have the deepest defensive prospect pool of any NHL team. Something to keep in mind. The Detroit Red Wings will and I repeat will not get players like that in the 6th and 7th rounds ever again. The scouts didn't even see Datsyuk and if they had he would have been long gone. Those Days of missing two guys like that won't happen. They do not have enough time to do it. I don't think league expansion anytime soon. And please rule out Las Vegas I live here and there is no way this town could support an nhl team. Maybe Basketball and that's it. Edited March 12, 2014 by SabresBillsFan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 (edited) Yeah. I read all that earlier. You said "never" and seemed to want to dig your heels in with "never". Obviously, expansion teams getting the 1st pick has happened. "Never" is just plain inaccurate. That is the only point I am trying to make. Never said never. I said that they don't give the first pick to expansion teams which was a reference to my earlier post that they haven't in a while. It'll be interested when/if it happens, but I don't think they'll go against the last six teams. I'd like to know why Tampa and Florida got the first two picks, but every other team in relevant history hasn't. Edited March 12, 2014 by Tankalicious Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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