Was Lindy the problem?

[Chief Enabler]

hey guys,

 

Longtime lurker back in under the basement circumstances. Hello all new and old. Since my sabres

Space investment way back, we've been through plenty of dramatic scenarios. At the end of the day, was lindy the problem in hindsight? Perhaps. Has rolston answered any issues? Layup.

 

I know I have said it before here, Darcy perpetually living in the future has been a determent in the cycle of nhl standards of competitiveness.

 

Give the credit to Miller for being a world class Olympic goalie, in the aftermarket of hasek aftermath. Unfortunetlty miller is now wasted with teenagers and it's Enroths turn at prime time. We see we're it's going.

 

My question is, sign miller, pominville and vanek to retire sabres with the youth shuffles in contrast to shuffling them and bringing on the youth to fit the mold. Hindsight is who's the leader? When is a run gonna happen?

 

Part of this post mystery questions is what modern Sabre retired as a true Sabre? Turgeon? Peca? Mogilny? Vanek? Pominville? Hasek? Miller?

 

Moulson giggled as being one of the "veterans " on the team, pretty sad. Pegula/Black need to pull it in IMO.

 

I loved the recent article on all of Darcy's first rounder success stories, prefect example. Glad people are wasting their money this season on tickets. Open your eyes hockey heaven. Sad right now.

 

 

[HopefulFuture]

Was Lindy the problem?

He was a part of it to be sure. All management and staff along with the players themselves had a hand in what has gone on here in Buffalo.

 

Is Rolston the answer?

You know, I've yet to chime in on this, but, I'll throw my opinion in the ring, what the hell.

No, he sucks balls. Just calling it as I see it is all.

[dudacek]

In terms of developing the kids, the jury is still out.

Ennis is the only one who seems to have regressed.

And I guess player development is why Rolston got the job.

 

As a game manager, he absolutely sucks balls.

[...]

Is it me, or do other people require LSD to comprehend the OP?

[djp14150]

Was Lindy the problem---he was part of it, Hee wasnt good with younger players.

 

I honestly think they are intentionally trying to tank.

[kdyehs]

Hey guys, I am the bandwagonner who root for Flyers this season. Well, can't say it's looking good at this moment. So let me share the knowledge I got from looking at both sabers and flyers. So what exactly is the problem with a good looking team on paper who doesn't deliver on ice? Simple.

 

Sabers did not develop a dominant core of their own. It started with Briere leaving. When your own elements leave and mercenaries take their place, you can expect the worst will happen. Leino, Reghr, Brad Boyes, Hogson, Ott, Erhoff.. just to name those i can think of, and you see that Sabers try to buy a team instead of develop their own. Same problem with the Flyers this year. They try to buy what they need. Bottom line, you can't cheat at this game, you need to work hard and develop your core and only then you can add 1 or 2 good free agent to complete your work.

 

Regier is awful. He gave long contract to mercenaries who doesn't belong to this team. Look at all the great teams, Boston, Chicago... they ALL have their own dominant core.

 

So now you know.

[X. Benedict]

Lindy wasn't the problem. There is only so much you can do when you are coaching the JV and scrimmaging the varsity.

[carpandean]

Was Lindy the problem?

 

I've bolded the problem with your question. There wasn't just one "the problem" to fix.

 

 

When your own elements leave and mercenaries take their place, you can expect the worst will happen. Leino, Reghr, Brad Boyes, Hogson, Ott, Erhoff.. just to name those i can think of, and you see that Sabers try to buy a team instead of develop their own.

 

Hodgson doesn't fit the list. He wasn't a vetran "mercenary" when he was brought in. They swapped young rookies with Vancouver to develop with a new core. He was traded a week after his 22nd birthday during his first full season in the league (he played in just 8 NHL games before that season.)

[kishoph]

In terms of developing the kids, the jury is still out.

Ennis is the only one who seems to have regressed.

And I guess player development is why Rolston got the job.

 

As a game manager, he absolutely sucks balls.

 

Your dislike for Ennis is evident, but to think that he is the only player has regressed, on a team that has 2 wins (1 regulation) in 15 games is shortsighted, there's not a player on this team that hasn't regressed in some way, other than the Goalies and the rookies and that may just be a matter of time.

[wjag]

Lindy was not the problem. The Buffalo curse is the problem. Cleveland and Buffalo share this affliction.

[PASabreFan]

Lindy wasn't the problem. There is only so much you can do when you are coaching the JV and scrimmaging the varsity.

 

This is a load of crap and I think you know it.

 

Of course Lindy wasn't THE problem. Of course Lindy is a good coach and would mop the floor with Ran. Lindy's time was clearly up.

 

There's nothing to see here.

 

Is it me, or do other people require LSD to comprehend the OP?

 

Hey, it's an international sport. We have international posters whose first language isn't English. You be nice.

[sicknfla]

There have been two problems. Their names are Tom Galisano and Terry Pegula. Both of these guys could have come in and immediately changed the culture of the team. Instead, they kept it status quo. That status quo is why we are where we are today.

 

From day one you make it clear that you will not accept mediocrity and you will have a successful franchise. If the people you have running your organization are not getting the job done then you FIRE them and use your vast resources to bring in the people that will get the job done.

 

Quality hockey people replacing DR and RR will do far more for this hockey team than a couple top picks. If I am a billionaire owner who wants to win I spend whatever it takes to build my front office. The rest well take care of itself.

[PASabreFan]

There have been two problems. Their names are Tom Galisano and Terry Pegula. Both of these guys could have come in and immediately changed the culture of the team. Instead, they kept it status quo. That status quo is why we are where we are today.

 

From day one you make it clear that you will not accept mediocrity and you will have a successful franchise. If the people you have running your organization are not getting the job done then you FIRE them and use your vast resources to bring in the people that will get the job done.

 

Quality hockey people replacing DR and RR will do far more for this hockey team than a couple top picks. If I am a billionaire owner who wants to win I spend whatever it takes to build my front office. The rest well take care of itself.

 

Terry's not about using his money to bring in the best from anywhere in the hockey world. He's about his buddies, cronyism, the old boy network. Think about it. You have billions, you're supposed to be a fan who wants a Cup. You end up with Darcy, Ron, your friend Cliff Benson, Cliff's BFF Ted, Ted's old boss and Joe Battista in your inner hockey circle. Fantastic.

[Jsixspd]

Terry's not about using his money to bring in the best from anywhere in the hockey world. He's about his buddies, cronyism, the old boy network. Think about it. You have billions, you're supposed to be a fan who wants a Cup. You end up with Darcy, Ron, your friend Cliff Benson, Cliff's BFF Ted, Ted's old boss and Joe Battista in your inner hockey circle. Fantastic.

 

 

Yes, it was time for Ruff to go - just like it is, and has been, time for Regier to go. But the timing was very strange about Lindy's firing. It was as if there was a sudden concern about not making the playoffs in 2013, but then since that time there's been no demonstrated effort to make the playoffs. In fact, now there seems to be total acceptance of not making the playoffs, and no concern except for some intangible "years down the road" for any success for the team.

 

The effort by Sabres management so far seems inconsistent and incoherent, as if there was a sudden reversal in course. I bet there's more to Ruff's firing than we know at this point.

[Doohickie]

Is it me, or do other people require LSD to comprehend the OP?

 

it was tl;dr

[Eleven]

No. The problem is the cupboard was bare, especially at center. As we're seeing now and will continue to see for, I don't know, forever, maybe, no coach is doing anything with this AHL team.

[nfreeman]

This is a load of crap and I think you know it.

 

Of course Lindy wasn't THE problem. Of course Lindy is a good coach and would mop the floor with Ran. Lindy's time was clearly up.

 

There's nothing to see here.

 

Well, you were beating the "fire Lindy" drum for about 5 years -- and what were the results? The team is shockingly bad -- and Vanek, whom you thought was in the same class as Crosby and Ovechkin but was being held back by Lindy, didn't improve a whit under a new coach (and actually got less ice time under RR than under Lindy). Or do you think someone other than RR would have done better than both RR and Lindy? How many times do we need to test this theory?

 

Maybe Lindy couldn't make chicken salad out of the chicken poopie that DR gave him, but that doesn't mean that anyone else could have, or that his time here was up. Maybe it just means that the chicken poopie was in fact chicken poopie and that the chicken that pooped out the poopie should have been canned long ago.

 

Yes, it was time for Ruff to go - just like it is, and has been, time for Regier to go. But the timing was very strange about Lindy's firing. It was as if there was a sudden concern about not making the playoffs in 2013, but then since that time there's been no demonstrated effort to make the playoffs. In fact, now there seems to be total acceptance of not making the playoffs, and no concern except for some intangible "years down the road" for any success for the team.

 

The effort by Sabres management so far seems inconsistent and incoherent, as if there was a sudden reversal in course. I bet there's more to Ruff's firing than we know at this point.

 

I've been thinking this way as well.

[nucci]

Hey guys, I am the bandwagonner who root for Flyers this season. Well, can't say it's looking good at this moment. So let me share the knowledge I got from looking at both sabers and flyers. So what exactly is the problem with a good looking team on paper who doesn't deliver on ice? Simple.

 

Sabers did not develop a dominant core of their own. It started with Briere leaving. When your own elements leave and mercenaries take their place, you can expect the worst will happen. Leino, Reghr, Brad Boyes, Hogson, Ott, Erhoff.. just to name those i can think of, and you see that Sabers try to buy a team instead of develop their own. Same problem with the Flyers this year. They try to buy what they need. Bottom line, you can't cheat at this game, you need to work hard and develop your core and only then you can add 1 or 2 good free agent to complete your work.

 

Regier is awful. He gave long contract to mercenaries who doesn't belong to this team. Look at all the great teams, Boston, Chicago... they ALL have their own dominant core.

 

So now you know.

SABRES

[dudacek]

 

 

Your dislike for Ennis is evident, but to think that he is the only player has regressed, on a team that has 2 wins (1 regulation) in 15 games is shortsighted, there's not a player on this team that hasn't regressed in some way, other than the Goalies and the rookies and that may just be a matter of time.

 

I was speaking about just the young veterans, but even then I was wrong.

Of that group, Weber's decline has been just as bad as Ennis'

Hodgson looks better some games and worse others.

I think Foligno and Myers are better than last year. Neither is as good as he could, or should be.

Enroth is clearly better than under Lindy.

 

Of the vets, I can't think of a single one who is better under Rolston.

Miller maybe, but I think most would agree that has little to do with Ron.

[bunomatic]

Yes, it was time for Ruff to go - just like it is, and has been, time for Regier to go. But the timing was very strange about Lindy's firing. It was as if there was a sudden concern about not making the playoffs in 2013, but then since that time there's been no demonstrated effort to make the playoffs. In fact, now there seems to be total acceptance of not making the playoffs, and no concern except for some intangible "years down the road" for any success for the team.

 

The effort by Sabres management so far seems inconsistent and incoherent, as if there was a sudden reversal in course. I bet there's more to Ruff's firing than we know at this point.

 

There's more to Ruffs firing all right. Management had decided that by bringing in a newbie that had never coached in the league before as opposed to a decadian :blush: that we would lose more which is part of the plan.

[Jsixspd]

Bun, I was thinking more along the lines that he said or did something that didn't toe the Pegula Corporate Line. But I guess if the goal is to lose even more games, a total novice coach would undoubtedly help that in the long run. LOL

[darksabre]

Bun, I was thinking more along the lines that he said or did something that didn't toe the Pegula Corporate Line. But I guess if the goal is to lose even more games, a total novice coach would undoubtedly help that in the long run. LOL

 

I don't think it really goes as deep as that. Regier sacrificed Lindy to save his own job. He had to say "Look, the team is bad, I've eliminated a variable." Because the next variable is Darcy.

 

Lindy Ruff's legacy could go two ways. Maybe we'll find out years from now that he disagreed with Darcy but reluctantly stayed on as coach out of dedication, or that he was in total cahoots with Darcy and Darcy stabbed him in the back.

[nfreeman]

I was speaking about just the young veterans, but even then I was wrong.

Of that group, Weber's decline has been just as bad as Ennis'

Hodgson looks better some games and worse others.

I think Foligno and Myers are better than last year. Neither is as good as he could, or should be.

Enroth is clearly better than under Lindy.

 

Of the vets, I can't think of a single one who is better under Rolston.

Miller maybe, but I think most would agree that has little to do with Ron.

 

I think Hodgson looks worse overall.

 

Ehrhoff is probably about the same -- certainly not better.

 

RR is out of his depth.

 

I really hope the board's grasping at straws a couple of days ago in the Battista thread proves out. If DR and RR are back next year, we are in for an extended nuclear winter.

[Ghost of Dwight Drane]

 

 

I don't think it really goes as deep as that. Regier sacrificed Lindy to save his own job. He had to say "Look, the team is bad, I've eliminated a variable." Because the next variable is Darcy.

 

Lindy Ruff's legacy could go two ways. Maybe we'll find out years from now that he disagreed with Darcy but reluctantly stayed on as coach out of dedication, or that he was in total cahoots with Darcy and Darcy stabbed him in the back.

 

It will be interesting to find out.

 

I for one think it was a Groupthink effort that cemented a culture of soft, gritless players that was synergized by a coach who emphasized positional responsibility first and foremost over instinct and physical forward pressure. I mean, you had Lindy hand out the letters...not the players...and one year he starts with Hecht as C, and 2 years ago he didn't want to offend anyone and hands out 5 letters, the C to the nicest guy in the world, but the furthest thing you would want as a leader to snap a bunch of already soft guys into shape.

 

Because the GM, Coach, and players all had been tainted by the same culture. They ALL had to go. Remember when Pegula bought the team and I compared it to the SPCA coming in and rescuing a puppy mill? You don't just open the cages and say "be free little ones!", and all of a sudden you have a bunch of socially adjusted, confident animals. Many of them never can be rehabilitated, and those who do many times take years to forget the conditions. Pegula kept the same system in place. Lindy went, and some of the puppies (Ott,Weber,Gerbe,Kaleta)....were free, and actually appreciated the freedom. The team played fairly well under Rolston last year all things considered. But Regier is still here, as are some of the puppies who should be humanely put down, (Stafford, Myers ). At least Vanek and Miller have been able to detach emotionally and Millsie will soon have his new adopted home.

 

I always have said Ruff is a good coach with a few tragic flaws. He would never have won a Cup here going forward, the damage and culture is too deep. If Lindy stays mentally fresh and lets his leaders lead and limits his top goalie from whittling away....maybe someday he will get a Cup, and that will be nice.

 

Lindy wasn't THEEEE problem. He was just the faulty AC/Heating unit in a clunker of a car that had a faulty transmission of a core, and an 88 year old in a diabetic coma of a GM driving it down the highway. Us fans are just the unsuspecting pedestrians in the opposite lane. It's been nice sharing a hospital room with y'all.

[nfreeman]

It will be interesting to find out.

 

I for one think it was a Groupthink effort that cemented a culture of soft, gritless players that was synergized by a coach who emphasized positional responsibility first and foremost over instinct and physical forward pressure. I mean, you had Lindy hand out the letters...not the players...and one year he starts with Hecht as C, and 2 years ago he didn't want to offend anyone and hands out 5 letters, the C to the nicest guy in the world, but the furthest thing you would want as a leader to snap a bunch of already soft guys into shape.

 

Because the GM, Coach, and players all had been tainted by the same culture. They ALL had to go. Remember when Pegula bought the team and I compared it to the SPCA coming in and rescuing a puppy mill? You don't just open the cages and say "be free little ones!", and all of a sudden you have a bunch of socially adjusted, confident animals. Many of them never can be rehabilitated, and those who do many times take years to forget the conditions. Pegula kept the same system in place. Lindy went, and some of the puppies (Ott,Weber,Gerbe,Kaleta)....were free, and actually appreciated the freedom. The team played fairly well under Rolston last year all things considered. But Regier is still here, as are some of the puppies who should be humanely put down, (Stafford, Myers ). At least Vanek and Miller have been able to detach emotionally and Millsie will soon have his new adopted home.

 

I always have said Ruff is a good coach with a few tragic flaws. He would never have won a Cup here going forward, the damage and culture is too deep. If Lindy stays mentally fresh and lets his leaders lead and limits his top goalie from whittling away....maybe someday he will get a Cup, and that will be nice.

 

Lindy wasn't THEEEE problem. He was just the faulty AC/Heating unit in a clunker of a car that had a faulty transmission of a core, and an 88 year old in a diabetic coma of a GM driving it down the highway. Us fans are just the unsuspecting pedestrians in the opposite lane. It's been nice sharing a hospital room with y'all.

 

Of course, Kassian hasn't exactly proven your theory...