LastPommerFan Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 We'll never know the answer to that and mechanics can be coached. It's not a simple throwing motion or footwork. It's literally everything. His instincts with his body positioning are off. You can't coach that. The ball shoulder going downfield on a scramble is the best example. What's natural for him is bad football. I think there is too much to coach out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 It's not a simple throwing motion or footwork. It's literally everything. His instincts with his body positioning are off. You can't coach that. The ball shoulder going downfield on a scramble is the best example. What's natural for him is bad football. I think there is too much to coach out. then what to make of the fact that he was a (significantly) more accurate passer in college when he was forced out of the pocket? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 It's not a simple throwing motion or footwork. It's literally everything. His instincts with his body positioning are off. You can't coach that. The ball shoulder going downfield on a scramble is the best example. What's natural for him is bad football. I think there is too much to coach out. I'd be happy if they just corrected him throwing off of his back foot. I think that alone would correct a lot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 then what to make of the fact that he was a (significantly) more accurate passer in college when he was forced out of the pocket? ACC Defensive ends are sloths compared to NFL. He had time to turn. QB movement instincts don't matter as much in the ACC as they do in the NFL, way more time to recover. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 No, the mention of hypocrisy is the impression you got from my post. Hence the reason I used it as the basis of you looking at me as an ######. The fact that you didn't comment on my reasoning of it being a joke just proves............. Nevermind, I'm wasting my time. This place has changed a lot lately; from the unprovoked snide comments to the personal attacks to the holier than thou attitudes..... might be time to take a break. If you have similar problems with many different posters, maybe the problem isn't the many different posters? Why not give him a look? A lot of what happened yesterday was on the OLINE, but Manuel owns it too. His scrambles (supposedly his strength) were horrendous. His throws, even with time, terrible. His elusiveness, non-existent. This is a throw-away year by all accounts. Why not give Tuel a look? Heck Cleveland threw their 3rd string in this weekend, on the road, after THE TRADE, and he looked pretty good. How do you know Tuel might not be better? Anyway, it is only a matter of time before Tuel gets in there. Apparently no one taught EJ how to slide. EJ Manuel has never been elusive in the pocket. He tends to get happy feet when pressured. He made lots of rookie mistakes and took a lot of sacks he thought he could run his way out of. This screams that EJ is not fully adjusted to the NFL speed yet. Our offense got shut down hard by a good defense, and our defensive backfield is currently held together by scotch tape and shoelaces. Good teams win despite injuries, and the Bills aren't there yet. But considering this young team and new staff, I'm not too worried about this loss. There are a lot of overreactions in this thread. All the rookies in the organizations will have to learn from their mistakes and adapt. Calling Nate Hackett a failure and calling for Jeff Tuel is so absurdly premature. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kishoph Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 (edited) Manuel's errors yesterday were not all based on the poor team around him or rookie mistakes. He made bad throws. He made terrible pre-snap reads, which can be corrected, but shouldn't need to be in a top-10 pick. The bad throws, though... I can't pin any hopes to this guy. We should be scouting QBs for next April. I love the idea of a fast paced offense, but there are times when it needs to be slowed down, yesterday, you could see EJ was having trouble, he's a rookie QB facing a Rex Ryan defense that is doing nothing but pinning their ears back and going after the QB, yet EJ is trying to maintain this breakneck pace. Hackett should of had him slow down, take his time and get his reads right and get his head clear. Manuel was running for his life, yet Hackett did nothing to slow the rush, was there a screen pass or hitch thrown all game ? Why after 2 weeks of having success with short quick routes is every pass a fade 20-30 yards down field, Tampa was killing the Jets with quick slants and short passes. Did Hackett give into the "fans" that were crying for a downfield passing attack ? The running game wasn't having success, but you can't totally abandon it. As far as the running game goes, get rid of that read option, I really think that may be the biggest problem with Spiller right now is trying to run out of that or running behind Colin Brown. The read option was a fluke last season and it seems the results are not so good with the teams that are running it this season. I'm willing to give Hackett a chance, but to me, it seems that the play calling has been poor this season and things are going to have to change, beginning with slowing it down enough to where your QB is comfortable and can look over the defense. Edited September 23, 2013 by kishoph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 I'd be happy if they just corrected him throwing off of his back foot. I think that alone would correct a lot. Yeah, but he has a very square delivery. Most good QBs will angle into the direction to help themselves out. He just seems to plant stationary and use pure arm touch on most of his throws. Now we may always luck into the next Favre....but he needs work to give himself a chance to be good longterm. And the wrist flicks on the longballs......he is delivering them like you lob a grenade. Not to get all advanced statty here.....but when you arc your delivery that much, you limit the timing of the receiver and area where a completion can take place. It's great for passes under 15 yards where great touch can be efficient, and which is starting to look why he likes to go to those routes so much. But you need to hit guys in stride long or else you are just begging for poor results. He's smart enough to know he puts up those grenades, which is why he probably tends towards out of bounds so there aren't as many INT's. Just won't get many completions either. He's got the tools though.....we shall see. Wonder if people who wanted McKelvin run out of town at any cost feel a bit foolish today? He's not a world beater by any stretch, but at least he's a legitimate NFL cornerback. He has always been able to stick with guys. I give credit to the new coaching staff. I think they drilled into his head not to try making big plays and being perfect, but use his quickness to close on guys and don't overcommit. He has looked like a volleyball player out there in trying to bat passes down this year, and I love it. He's a good kid....not the sharpest, so I'd rather have him play this way and end up with 2 INTs over the season than return 3 of 6 picks for TDs, but get smoked on a regular basis because he's trying too hard. His simple improvement has been the most pleasant addition this year so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 Because your reasoning was the joke. You got caught, and tried to find a backdoor out of it. In case you missed it, I wasn't the only one who read the initial post as you being a dick. Say what you want, I caught you contradicting yourself when you're so hellbent on convincing people how consistent you are. I'm not going to stoop to your level, I'll be the bigger man. But take some constructive criticism, your ###### does stink and you are no better than everybody else. Stop pretending like it doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kruse Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 We should be 3-0. Who knew Steveie takin a taunting penalty would make that guy rage. That was awesome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 (edited) 1) He was the 16th overall pick :P 2) Seriously? ...Joe Flacco was also a mid-1st round pick... Yep. I'll say it again, Eli Manning (picked 1st overall, traded for a 4th overall, a 65th overall, and what ends up being a 12th overall) sucked a fat dick for a good bit of his first years. Don't bother starting to drink the Hatorade until there's at least something in the cup. "OMG he isn't progressing faster than every other QB in history. Shank him." Heh, stop that. We should be 3-0. Who knew Steveie takin a taunting penalty would make that guy rage. That was awesome. Ha, yeah. They won, but Jets fans will still be happy to find a way to be pissy with their team. http://www.rantsport...ork-jets-a-win/ Edited September 23, 2013 by IKnowPhysics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 Well it can't get any worse than yesterday. Let's see who is next on the schedule. Oh, it's the Ravens. Nice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted September 23, 2013 Report Share Posted September 23, 2013 Say what you want, I caught you contradicting yourself when you're so hellbent on convincing people how consistent you are. I'm not going to stoop to your level, I'll be the bigger man. But take some constructive criticism, your ###### does stink and you are no better than everybody else. Stop pretending like it doesn't. You should read your series of posts in this thread. First you try to catch me contradicting myself, then when I call you on the BS you try to play it off as a joke and me being overly sensitive. Now you're asserting that you did catch me in a contradiction, which shows your initial backtrack was just that, a backtrack. So now, either you genuinely think you caught me in a contradiction, in which case you're not too good at reading. Or, you know I didn't contradict myself and you deliberately tried to make it look that way, in which case you're just a slime ball. Well done. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kruse Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 He called you a slimeball bro he meanz serious business. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 You got cabbage in yo muff. MUFF CABBAGE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 You got cabbage in yo muff. MUFF CABBAGE. :lol: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 You should read your series of posts in this thread. First you try to catch me contradicting myself, then when I call you on the BS you try to play it off as a joke and me being overly sensitive. Now you're asserting that you did catch me in a contradiction, which shows your initial backtrack was just that, a backtrack. So now, either you genuinely think you caught me in a contradiction, in which case you're not too good at reading. Or, you know I didn't contradict myself and you deliberately tried to make it look that way, in which case you're just a slime ball. Well done. It wasn't a backtrack, my point was I wasn't being as ###### serious about it as you took it, hence a JOKINGLY NON-SERIOUS JAB at you. It's not my fault you get offended so easily. Both your posts contradict each other, you've got a PhD it shouldn't be difficult for you to figure out. Although it does explain why you continually think you're better than everybody else. Have somebody wash that sand out of your vag and suck it up like a man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 It wasn't a backtrack, my point was I wasn't being as ###### serious about it as you took it, hence a JOKINGLY NON-SERIOUS JAB at you. It's not my fault you get offended so easily. Both your posts contradict each other, you've got a PhD it shouldn't be difficult for you to figure out. Although it does explain why you continually think you're better than everybody else. Have somebody wash that sand out of your vag and suck it up like a man. So you do think I contradicted myself? Your problem is reading comprehension then, got it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 So you do think I contradicted myself? Your problem is reading comprehension then, got it. Is this not sarcasm? 2) Oh that locker room cancer bum Jairus Byrd, how DARE he be complimentary of the coaching staff!?!?! He's just setting it up to tear it all down, trade him now before he executes his nefarious plot!!!! :rolleyes: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 Is this not sarcasm? And your point is what? I sarcastically said he's a cancer, which obviously means I don't think he is. In the earlier post you selectively quoted, I was mocking that you simultaneously believed Byrd is a cancer who has to go while Kolb could be good and needs a chance. Combine this with an earlier post I made explaining why I don't think Byrd is a cancer, and you have absolutely no contradictions. So I have no idea where you're getting this from outside of ripping a half sentence totally out of context. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 And your point is what? I sarcastically said he's a cancer, which obviously means I don't think he is. In the earlier post you selectively quoted, I was mocking that you simultaneously believed Byrd is a cancer who has to go while Kolb could be good and needs a chance. Combine this with an earlier post I made explaining why I don't think Byrd is a cancer, and you have absolutely no contradictions. So I have no idea where you're getting this from outside of ripping a half sentence totally out of context. You need to get down off your high horse, that ladder continues to get taller and taller. I suggest you ignore my posts from now on if you don't like it. I enjoy coming on here and BS'ing with everybody, enough that you and d4rksabre are merely nuisances. It's a shame, as condescending as I think you are I rather enjoyed getting into discussions with you. Apparently that didn't last as civility couldn't keep your ego in check. You need to grow up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 MUFF CABBAGE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 MUFF CABBAGE. bahaha one of the best south park episodes ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul Kruse Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 He callin out d4rksabre uh oh. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 You need to get down off your high horse, that ladder continues to get taller and taller. I suggest you ignore my posts from now on if you don't like it. I enjoy coming on here and BS'ing with everybody, enough that you and d4rksabre are merely nuisances. It's a shame, as condescending as I think you are I rather enjoyed getting into discussions with you. Apparently that didn't last as civility couldn't keep your ego in check. You need to grow up. You're funny. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted September 24, 2013 Report Share Posted September 24, 2013 You're funny. I literally rolled my eyes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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