How to Fix the D Both Short and Long-term?

[Crusader1969]

I was watching a bit of the Jets game today, the commentators made it seem a lock that Trouba is protected. Myers, even with his favourable contract is the big question. I'll assume they expose him and his injury troubles.

 

I think Garrison is a UFA? Could be wrong

[dudacek]

I was watching a bit of the Jets game today, the commentators made it seem a lock that Trouba is protected. Myers, even with his favourable contract is the big question. I'll assume they expose him and his injury troubles.

 

I think Garrison is a UFA? Could be wrong

 

Garrison has one more year. Like I said, I don't expect all these guys — certainly not guys like Trouba and Fowler — to be exposed. They are just on the list as guys who might be available at the right price because their team has more than three good* defencemen.

 

*For these purposes it means guys who are better than Bogo and significantly better than the guy that their current team will end up losing if they trade him.

Edited March 20, 2017 by dudacek

[WildCard]

Good list dudacek, but, no Ghost, Montour, or Theodore?

[dudacek]

Good list dudacek, but, no Ghost, Montour, or Theodore?

 

Flyers will have no trouble protecting Ghost and the other two are exempt from expansion.

Doesn't mean we can't chase them — both teams have great depth in young D and might be open to offers — but there is no special expansion pressure there for their current team to give them up.

[WildCard]

Flyers will have no trouble protecting Ghost and the other two are exempt from expansion.

Doesn't mean we can't chase them — both teams have great depth in young D and might be open to offers — but there is no special expansion pressure there for their current team to give them up.

Ah missed that part. Good points

[Guest]

Ellis/Ekholm are certainly on the list of those worth exploring.

 

Other teams that may be open to offers because of expansion:

Penguins: Maattaa/Schultz/Doumoulin/Pouliot

Ducks: Vatanen/Fowler/Manson/Bieksa

Sharks: Braun, Martin, Dilon, Schlemko

Caps: Orlov, Schmidt, Orpik

Wild: Scandella, Brodin, Dumba

Habs: Benn, Beaulieu, Davidson

Avalanche: Barrie, Weircoch, Zadorov

Rangers: Klein, Holden

Canucks: Gudbranson, Sbisa, Edler

Islanders: Hickey, DeHaan

Jackets: Johnson, Murray

Lightning: Garrison, Coburn, Koekkoek

Jets: Myers Trouba

Panthers: Pysyk, Petrovic

 

Not all of these guys are going to be available and a bunch of them will not be cheap.

But there will be opportunities to trade expansion exempt assets (picks and/or prospects) for someone we'd rather protect than Bogo, if that solves a protection problem for someone else.

 

 

Thanks for the list.  Who are the righties?  Strange as it may sound, but with McCabe, Guhle, Antipin, Gorges and Falk, we are now LD dominiate.  Risto and Bogo are the righties.  Vatanen is a RD, as is Brodin.  From your list who are the other righties that standout?

Edited March 20, 2017 by yse325

[Guest]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/sabres-gm-says-dmitry-kulikov-acquisition-didnt-work/

 

GMTM says Dmitry Kulikov acquisition didn't work out.  Really?  Says he thought he got a top 3 D.  I really question his judgement.  I'll say this, if he doesn't get a real top 3 D this off-season to spell Risto, we can start the clock on GMTM reign in Buffalo.  If I was a betting man I'd wager that GMTM knows this as well and he will acquire one regardless of cost.  

[thewookie1]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/sabres-gm-says-dmitry-kulikov-acquisition-didnt-work/

 

GMTM says Dmitry Kulikov acquisition didn't work out.  Really?  Says he thought he got a top 3 D.  I really question his judgement.  I'll say this, if he doesn't get a real top 3 D this off-season to spell Risto, we can start the clock on GMTM reign in Buffalo.  If I was a betting man I'd wager that GMTM knows this as well and he will acquire one regardless of cost.  

 

That's what worries me.

 

He'd better not trade Reinhart or I'll be absolutely livid

[Guest]

That's what worries me.

 

He'd better not trade Reinhart or I'll be absolutely livid

There are 7 players that even GMTM won't be trading away, Lehner, ROR, KO, Risto, McCabe, Jack and last Sam. Everyone else, including Kane is fair game.

[North Buffalo]

Oh I think Kane may have made the untradeable list with his goal scoring and finally with knocking out Cindy's chicklets as payback for his swat at OReilly's particulars.   Sorry, and can't believe I am saying this, but I want Kane on this team despite his baggage.

[ubkev]

There are 7 players that even GMTM won't be trading away, Lehner, ROR, KO, Risto, McCabe, Jack and last Sam. Everyone else, including Kane is fair game.

It just so happens that everyone else is worthless. Save for Nylander.

[Sabre fan]

Probably the biggest question is do we try to re-sign Kulilov, who I have no doubt is much better then we've seen. I agree with someone who posted that he will no doubt go somewhere and immediately become a strong 3-4 d-man on another team. That trade by the way allowed us to move up and draft Rasmus Asplund, who many thought to be a first round guy. That was a good trade at the time and looked like a steal for GMTM. who could have known Kulikov would no be healthy for nearly the whole year? Again injuries played a big part in this year's disappoointment

[TrueBlueGED]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/sabres-gm-says-dmitry-kulikov-acquisition-didnt-work/

 

GMTM says Dmitry Kulikov acquisition didn't work out. Really? Says he thought he got a top 3 D. I really question his judgement. I'll say this, if he doesn't get a real top 3 D this off-season to spell Risto, we can start the clock on GMTM reign in Buffalo. If I was a betting man I'd wager that GMTM knows this as well and he will acquire one regardless of cost.

The assessment of Kulikov as a top 3 is not going to inspire confidence in those of us who question Murray's evaluation of defensemen.

[WildCard]

The assessment of Kulikov as a top 3 is not going to inspire confidence in those of us who question Murray's evaluation of defensemen.

I think he could be if he wasn't in this crap, hail marry system. He was one under Gallant in Florida on a playoff team

[Sabre fan]

I think he could be if he wasn't in this crap, hail marry system. He was one under Gallant in Florida on a playoff team

agreed...I think he's fine if healthy, it's the "system" that is dragging the whole D (and team) down

[TrueBlueGED]

I think he could be if he wasn't in this crap, hail marry system. He was one under Gallant in Florida on a playoff team

As much as I enjoy blaming Bylsma for stuff, I just don't think Kulikov is his fault. Would he be better in a different system? Sure. But he was never great, save for 6 playoff games. Six. Yea he was getting top-3 minutes, but that's sort of like McCabe getting #2 minutes here and us insisting he's a #2. He really isn't.

 

I'm comfortable concluding Murray got fooled by a playoff series.

 

Edit: And if he wasn't fooled, then I circle back to him looking for the wrong thing in defensemen. Too much old school in his evaluation, methinks. Maybe he'll learn something from the whole fiasco this year.

Edited March 22, 2017 by TrueBlueGED

[Sabel79]

He's also been injured literally the entire time he's been here, minus the beginning of training camp.  I'm not sure how good an idea overlooking this is.  Is he Bobby Orr when healthy?  Nah.  But he's a better player, and would have been (again, if healthy) a positive on this this team this year, and will likely do well wherever he plays next year. 

[TrueBlueGED]

He's also been injured literally the entire time he's been here, minus the beginning of training camp. I'm not sure how good an idea overlooking this is. Is he Bobby Orr when healthy? Nah. But he's a better player, and would have been (again, if healthy) a positive on this this team this year, and will likely do well wherever he plays next year.

I see JJ has a lot of people around here drinking the Kul-aid...sorry, I had to :p

 

I think most would grant the injury and Bylsma mattered, and that Kulikov is better than he played this year. I take no issue with those things. But I have a big problem with Murray evaluating him as a top-3 defenseman. Every metric outside of that playoff series puts Kulikov as a lower-end top-4, and some would argue a #5 (I wouldn't, but I've seen the arguments). A #3 Dman has to be a guy who can anchor a pair with a lesser partner, and Kulikov isn't that guy. If Murray thinks he is, that's no bueno.

 

I think it's also worth noting the injury may be a career-long thing now. A couple weeks ago Murray said if Kulikov stayed in Buffalo and worked with the trainers all summer, they think he could get back to 90% of what he was. So there's a good chance he never gets back to what he was, even if we can't agree on what that was.

[dudacek]

As much as I enjoy blaming Bylsma for stuff, I just don't think Kulikov is his fault. Would he be better in a different system? Sure. But he was never great, save for 6 playoff games. Six. Yea he was getting top-3 minutes, but that's sort of like McCabe getting #2 minutes here and us insisting he's a #2. He really isn't.

I'm comfortable concluding Murray got fooled by a playoff series.

Edit: And if he wasn't fooled, then I circle back to him looking for the wrong thing in defensemen. Too much old school in his evaluation, methinks. Maybe he'll learn something from the whole fiasco this year.

I don't think he was fooled by the playoffs; there was too big a body of work leading up to that.

This year's McCabe is a good comparison to the player he should have thought he was getting, and truthfully Kulikov has been.

 

Your edit is closer to the truth, IMO.

[Guest]

Kulikov isn't returning so we are kind of beating a dead horse, but if he isn't, maybe ever going to be fully healthy and won't be even 90% after rehab all summer, why wasn't he just put on LTIR for the season months ago to free up cap space to get some real depth. GMTM is proving that he is out of his depth in this job with every statement.

 

One other note, one quick away to improving the D and PK is to fire Terry Murray and get a different coach. He is the coach of the 2 worst areas of the team. Bob Woods has done a fine job on the PP.

Edited March 22, 2017 by yse325

[DirtDart]

I think he could be if he wasn't in this crap, hail marry system. He was one under Gallant in Florida on a playoff team

you guys, and all your system talk drive me nuts. Please, do explain this hail marry system. Is it Dan that plays the "system", or the players not playing within the "system"? Either way, he is not responsible for the lack of communication on the ice, or the play. What should he do bench the players? We already play almost nightly with a short bench as it is.

[Drunkard]

you guys, and all your system talk drive me nuts. Please, do explain this hail marry system. Is it Dan that plays the "system", or the players not playing within the "system"? Either way, he is not responsible for the lack of communication on the ice, or the play. What should he do bench the players? We already play almost nightly with a short bench as it is.

 

Check out the posts by Flagg in the System thread. It's complete with examples and photos with arrows and MS paint scribbles. It shows a bunch of examples of how the stretch passes and lack of forward support are killing our puck possession numbers.

[WildCard]

you guys, and all your system talk drive me nuts. Please, do explain this hail marry system. Is it Dan that plays the "system", or the players not playing within the "system"? Either way, he is not responsible for the lack of communication on the ice, or the play. What should he do bench the players? We already play almost nightly with a short bench as it is.

You should go read the thread titled 'The System' and the 5 page post breaking it down.

[Guest]

Is anyone an ESPN insider? http://www.espn.com/blog/craig-custance/insider/post?id=8933

 

I'm curious what Constance has to say about our offseason game plan.

[MattPie]

you guys, and all your system talk drive me nuts. Please, do explain this hail marry system. Is it Dan that plays the "system", or the players not playing within the "system"? Either way, he is not responsible for the lack of communication on the ice, or the play. What should he do bench the players? We already play almost nightly with a short bench as it is.

 

Agree with the others about the Flagg posts on the The System thread. That's some great work.

 

In football terms, Dan's system is 5 of 6 plays is to throw 20-30 yard passes. They don't connect often, but at least when they don't you're not tackled for a loss. The other play is to hand off to your first-team all-star running back (Eichel), who rushes 11 yards per carry on average, but in Dan's mind no one else on the team can do that.