X. Benedict Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 To put it another way, if we had the number one pick would you give it up for #2? Hellz no. This x1000. Tim Murray would get run out of town if he traded the #1 pick. He'd have to leave North America too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 This x1000. Tim Murray would get run out of town if he traded the #1 pick. He'd have to leave North America too. But he G Z F. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Lindros.Note that the team that ended up with the Cups was not the one that got Lindros, it was the one that got the bevy of players. Yeah but Lindros forced that deal otherwise it never happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Completely different situation. McDavid isn't going to pull a Lindros. What was the story on that again? Did he say he wouldn't sign with the team that was going to draft him? If it was said upthread, I missed it and don't really remember the whole story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 What was the story on that again? Did he say he wouldn't sign with the team that was going to draft him? If it was said upthread, I missed it and don't really remember the whole story. Yes. He and his dad said that he would not play for Quebec. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 What was the story on that again? Did he say he wouldn't sign with the team that was going to draft him? If it was said upthread, I missed it and don't really remember the whole story. He was drafted by Quebec but played in junior and the Olympics instead and said he would eventually re-enter the draft rather than play for the Nordick. The Nordick traded his rights on draft day 2002 to both the Rangers and the Flyers, and it went to arbitration. The Flyer trade was the winner. Weird stuff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Yes. He and his dad said that he would not play for Quebec. Douchiest move by a prospect ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny DangerFace Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Douchiest move by a prospect ever. But not an NFL qb :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 What would be the offer? If Arizona was offering #2, their second #1 pick this year and sake of argument a prospect like Max Domi, it would be foolish of the Sabres not to give that serious consideration. The plan here is to build a great team not pin all the hopes on 1 player. If you can add significant assets without dropping much or at all in the quality of player you would be drafting with your first pick, that is direction to go in. Not even close. If there's any thoughts of going from 1 to 2 it has to include known commodities. OEL. And, again, the second point is completely off point. Nobody is pinning all their hopes on one pick. Won't that argument die already? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 (edited) Douchiest move by a prospect ever. But not an NFL qb :) Yeah, Eli Manning and Elway pulled the same stunt. Unlike Lindros, they each won two championships, though. Edited March 28, 2015 by Eleven Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Not even close. If there's any thoughts of going from 1 to 2 it has to include known commodities. OEL. And, again, the second point is completely off point. Nobody is pinning all their hopes on one pick. Won't that argument die already? Shirley, you can't be serious. That's most fans. "Go Arizona, we'll get McDavid and win Cups." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Not even close. If there's any thoughts of going from 1 to 2 it has to include known commodities. OEL. And, again, the second point is completely off point. Nobody is pinning all their hopes on one pick. Won't that argument die already? The tankers have been trying to convince themselves this for 2+ years now. The fervor (mania) to finish 30th says otherwise. I think the only people that really believe that are the ones who have been against the tank from the start. It's probably why we don't care what pick we end up with and watch the games exactly like we have every March/April since Pegula took over, with complete apathy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 (edited) Shirley, you can't be serious. That's most fans. "Go Arizona, we'll get McDavid and win Cups."Sigh. Seriously? Ristolainen, Reinhart, Girgensons, Ennis, Zadorov, Baptiste, Bailey, Fasching, Moulson, Bogosian, Kane, Gorges, Pysyk... I'm going to be honest: I thought this silly argument had died for the most part. Edited March 28, 2015 by Tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 Sigh. Seriously? Ristolainen, Reinhart, Girgensons, Ennis, Zadorov, Baptiste, Bailey, Fasching, Moulson, Bogosian, Kane, Gorges, Pysyk... Your logic is breaking down. Why is it so important to finish 30th then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 No one will ever convince me that this BS was not about McDavid and the consolation (?) / Miss Congeniality 2nd prize. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 (edited) Your logic is breaking down. Why is it so important to finish 30th then.Because we want the best talent we can get and getting a star to lead a group of very good players is the best plan in the eyes of many. It can be extremely important that we finish last and not be about one pick (it was NEVER about one player in this year's draft, it's always been McDavid and Eichel). We want the star to cap off years of gathering fantastic assets. If we went into this season without those players then it would've been a MUST that we finish last and you'd be right... But we have spent years gathering these assets and now it's time to cap off the building. The argument you three are making is confusing to me. What are you ACTUALLY trying to say? This whole thing was about one player or this season? This season, you could say, was. But the entire plan doesn't hinge on one pick. I think THIS SEASON is a major let down if we don't get one of the top two but that doesn't mean the entire plan is a failure. We're set up well for the future either way. Edited March 28, 2015 by Tank Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 No one will ever convince me that this BS was not about McDavid and the consolation (?) / Miss Congeniality 2nd prize. They keep trying to by using phrases like "high end talent", which if true would mean that people would be comfortable with picking 3rd. But we all know Tank-nation would be apoplectic if the Sabres ended up picking third, ergo it's not about "high end talent", it's about one player (maybe 2 if you're into that). It's also perfectly reasonable to assert that, should the Sabres get McEichel, and then subsequently fail to win a Cup with him ala Washington with Ovechkin, that this entire thing will have been for naught. But no one in Tank-Nation is willing to recognize that McEichel not delivering a Cup is even a possibility. "We just want high end talent!" is the battle cry where Cup success is already a forgone conclusion. It's the only way to rationalize the entire situation. You have to believe that it will lead to a Championship. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I thought we've established Center > Winger? And yeah, I'll be very upset if we pick third, like you wouldn't be? So you don't want the tank, I get that, but are you willing to shoot yourself in the foot just to prove a point? To spite all the tankers? Tank brings up the other point about this: it's not like we're completely devoid of talent outside our top pick this year. We have so much young talent in Buffalo, and in our system, that yeah, it's perfectly reasonable to assume that bringing in the one of the two best prospects in the last decade will put us over the top and get to a Cup. It's not hard to rationalize a tank because, well, it's been proven to work in the past. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 But no one in Tank-Nation is willing to recognize that McEichel not delivering a Cup is even a possibility. You mean besides those of us who accept the truth that there are no guarantees in life, right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 I thought we've established Center > Winger? And yeah, I'll be very upset if we pick third, like you wouldn't be? So you don't want the tank, I get that, but are you willing to shoot yourself in the foot just to prove a point? To spite all the tankers? Tank brings up the other point about this: it's not like we're completely devoid of talent outside our top pick this year. We have so much young talent in Buffalo, and in our system, that yeah, it's perfectly reasonable to assume that bringing in the one of the two best prospects in the last decade will put us over the top and get to a Cup. It's not hard to rationalize a tank because, well, it's been proven to work in the past. I will be upset if we pick third. "Proven to work" is a pretty big swing. This method isn't proven. It has worked, yes. But hardly enough to be hit-me-over-the-head convincing. You mean besides those of us who accept the truth that there are no guarantees in life, right? If there are no guarantees then why root for the tank? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 (edited) I will be upset if we pick third. "Proven to work" is a pretty big swing. This method isn't proven. It has worked, yes. But hardly enough to be hit-me-over-the-head convincing. If there are no guarantees then why root for the tank? Because its about probability,and McEichel gives us the best odds of icing a perrenial contender going forward, just as Strome or Marner would have us looking better long term than if we pick 15th. This has always been what the tank is about, increasing our chances. No guarantees. Edited March 28, 2015 by Claude_Verret Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 They keep trying to by using phrases like "high end talent", which if true would mean that people would be comfortable with picking 3rd. But we all know Tank-nation would be apoplectic if the Sabres ended up picking third, ergo it's not about "high end talent", it's about one player (maybe 2 if you're into that). It's also perfectly reasonable to assert that, should the Sabres get McEichel, and then subsequently fail to win a Cup with him ala Washington with Ovechkin, that this entire thing will have been for naught. But no one in Tank-Nation is willing to recognize that McEichel not delivering a Cup is even a possibility. "We just want high end talent!" is the battle cry where Cup success is already a forgone conclusion. It's the only way to rationalize the entire situation. You have to believe that it will lead to a Championship. BS. Landing McEichel is about the entertainment value of watching this team which has been nigh unwatchable the last 2-1/2 seasons. There us no doubt at all that this team will be more entertaining with McDavid than with Strome. Will having McDavid give the team a better chance to win the SC than Strome would? Nearly definitely. But noone should believe having McEichel guarantees a SC. And for the most part, the only people making that argument are anti-tankers setting up a strawman. The point of buying tickets to go watch these guys play is to be entertained. If they win, it's gravy. I can't wait to see one of these guys wearing the crossed swords. Definitely hope it happens; know it still might not, but it's looking good that it will. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 They keep trying to by using phrases like "high end talent", which if true would mean that people would be comfortable with picking 3rd. But we all know Tank-nation would be apoplectic if the Sabres ended up picking third, ergo it's not about "high end talent", it's about one player (maybe 2 if you're into that). It's also perfectly reasonable to assert that, should the Sabres get McEichel, and then subsequently fail to win a Cup with him ala Washington with Ovechkin, that this entire thing will have been for naught. But no one in Tank-Nation is willing to recognize that McEichel not delivering a Cup is even a possibility. "We just want high end talent!" is the battle cry where Cup success is already a forgone conclusion. It's the only way to rationalize the entire situation. You have to believe that it will lead to a Championship. The condescending tone of this entire post aside, if we don't get a cup within the timeline of this whole tank then of course the entire thing is a failure... Any plan that doesn't result in a cup is a failure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
... Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 There are no guarantees, period. There is no sure-fire path to the Cup. This is the path the Sabres have chosen, though, so Bob's your uncle. I could see trading down if the Sabres wind up with third or worse, but trading up from third or worse would cost more than anyone would be willing to spend. I think tank was partially making this point; this season's tank is only part of the grand scheme where they acquire the cherry on top. The Sabres had an entire roster to turn over and they have collected a lot of those parts already. You can get stuck in a cycle of trading and acquiring, trading and acquiring, or you commit to the roster and get going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny DangerFace Posted March 28, 2015 Report Share Posted March 28, 2015 They keep trying to by using phrases like "high end talent", which if true would mean that people would be comfortable with picking 3rd. But we all know Tank-nation would be apoplectic if the Sabres ended up picking third, ergo it's not about "high end talent", it's about one player (maybe 2 if you're into that). It's also perfectly reasonable to assert that, should the Sabres get McEichel, and then subsequently fail to win a Cup with him ala Washington with Ovechkin, that this entire thing will have been for naught. But no one in Tank-Nation is willing to recognize that McEichel not delivering a Cup is even a possibility. "We just want high end talent!" is the battle cry where Cup success is already a forgone conclusion. It's the only way to rationalize the entire situation. You have to believe that it will lead to a Championship. What is so confusing about a rebuild that brings in high end talent through the draft to build a new core with the hopes of winning a Stanley cup? Can't tell if you all are just trying to bother Tank or actually believe this stuff? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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