X. Benedict Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) I'll ask my semi-annual question, for which no one will have an answer. Why does multi-billionaire owner Terry Pegula, who scoffed at the idea he would dirty himself with the idea of making money as owner of the Sabres, need to qualify for a welfare check from the league — a check that comes at an ever-increasing expense to the fans? I'm happy Darcy is gone. It doesn't mean I can't criticize the ticket price increases. I and others have said it before. There's just this ham-handed, tone-deaf (hi Aud) and near-arrogant way these guys handle issues of public relations. A one-year vacation from raising ticket prices wouldn't have killed them. With the CBA and HRR the team has good faith obligation to get fair market value for its tickets for the players. With season tickets at 16,000 and sold out, a somewhat above average high school student could show on a chalk board that prices are below equilibrium with given demand. The Sabres solution is somewhat ingenious - raise ticket prices, qualify for revenue sharing, and give the money back. Noboby likes a price hike, but something other than greed and arrogance is going on here. Edited May 8, 2014 by X. Benedict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I think this belongs in complaint thursday thread :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Sorry, but those that think this great and can justify it, don't see the forest for the trees, IMO. And, no. I'm not calling anyone out on this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Sorry, but those that think this great and can justify it, don't see the forest for the trees, IMO. And, no. I'm not calling anyone out on this. IMO the people who are seeing the price increase as a complete negative are the ones who can't see the bigger picture because the details are in the way. And yes, I am personally directing this as an attack against you, your character, and your honor. ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Well then, Glass, the joke's on you, as I have no character, or honour :nana: ... So, there. And, a big pile of dog crap is still dog crap no matter how much ketchup you put on it. EDIT: Caught that before the grammar police came to get me. Edited May 8, 2014 by Sabres Fan In NS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chileanseabass Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 a big pile of dog crap is still dog crap no matter how much ketchup you put on it. Sounds like my stepmom's meatloaf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Wonder how this will impact the season ticket holders who sell to the secondary market. That market doesn't get any fancy discounts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Sounds like my stepmom's meatloaf And this comes from CSB so close to Mothers / Stepmothers Day. You better watch out, or you'll end up in her dog house, with lots of meatloaf to keep you going, sans ketchup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Wonder how this will impact the season ticket holders who sell to the secondary market. That market doesn't get any fancy discounts. That's an interesting point. Because I can't use season tickets, don't want season tickets, etc. I don't pay attention to how it works. I understood the concept that basically they raised prices 4% then offered a 4% back in monetary spending at the rink as a way to wash out the increase. But, if only the season ticket holder can benefit from this then the practice of selling to opposing fans might be shunted (or require a higher payment) so the season ticket holder still obtains benefit. Imagine a system where the season ticket holder qualifies for actual money back (as opposed to "store credit") just by showing up at the same. So raise the prices even higher and then give them money back for each game they show up to attend. Hmmmm.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 That's an interesting point. Because I can't use season tickets, don't want season tickets, etc. I don't pay attention to how it works. I understood the concept that basically they raised prices 4% then offered a 4% back in monetary spending at the rink as a way to wash out the increase. But, if only the season ticket holder can benefit from this then the practice of selling to opposing fans might be shunted (or require a higher payment) so the season ticket holder still obtains benefit. Imagine a system where the season ticket holder qualifies for actual money back (as opposed to "store credit") just by showing up at the same. So raise the prices even higher and then give them money back for each game they show up to attend. Hmmmm.... resale market has little to do with the season ticket price, starting point is usually individual game face value. That's what's printed on the ticket, even if it was bought at season ticket prices. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 resale market has little to do with the season ticket price, starting point is usually individual game face value. That's what's printed on the ticket, even if it was bought at season ticket prices. We had a little discussion the other day about this.....one of the easiest ways to get on my A-hole list is to be a "friend" who says..."I have a pair of seats for the Sabres game Saturday.....$120 face value but I will let you have them for $100." Meanwhile...they paid $55 for the pair and the team is a piece of garbage where they should be happy getting $40. You need a car? Here's my 2005 Sentra.....the sticker price was $19,500....but I'll let you have it for $14,000..... Go eat an exhaust pipe..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvelo Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Although it wasn't a big price increase and Buffalo is still a bargain compared to the rest of the NHL market, a price increase after the worst season in Sabres history and one in which the team scored the least amount of goals in modern NHL history is a P.R. disaster at the very least and symbolically a slap in the face to the "suffering" fans. Edited May 8, 2014 by 716 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 Although it wasn't a big price increase and Buffalo is still a bargain compared to the rest of the NHL market, a price increase after the worst season in Sabres history and one in which the team scored the least amount of goals in modern NHL history is a P.R. disaster at the very least and symbolically a slap in the face to the "suffering" fans. The owner and management are tone deaf and clueless. So what about the players? Like it or not, the players, the owners' partners, own 50% of that ticket revenue. Owners can't keep prices artificially low because doing so would be circumventing their labor agreement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 We had a little discussion the other day about this.....one of the easiest ways to get on my A-hole list is to be a "friend" who says..."I have a pair of seats for the Sabres game Saturday.....$120 face value but I will let you have them for $100." Meanwhile...they paid $55 for the pair and the team is a piece of garbage where they should be happy getting $40. You need a car? Here's my 2005 Sentra.....the sticker price was $19,500....but I'll let you have it for $14,000..... Go eat an exhaust pipe..... I always offer my paid price to friends. I always sell to strangers at face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 So what about the players? Like it or not, the players, the owners' partners, own 50% of that ticket revenue. Owners can't keep prices artificially low because doing so would be circumventing their labor agreement. This probably isn't the offseason that I'm going to be concerned about Sabres players, either. But really, we all know why ticket prices have to go up every year, and we should just expect it. I always offer my paid price to friends. I always sell to strangers at face. Same here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I always offer my paid price to friends. I always sell to strangers at face. You live another day...... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 You live another day...... I honestly heard an ominous musical interlude immediately after reading this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) I honestly heard an ominous musical interlude immediately after reading this. No...it was cheery.... "Your facebook friend, he's in a pinch, has a pair of crappy ducats.... 2 days to go, a deal "Hell No!", "I'll screw my friends just F-it!".... A Tuesday night, the Flames "Just Right!", "Who wouldn't want to see THAT?".... A C-note might, just when he's tight, pay the vet bill for his pet cat..... But...NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO.......he lives another Day- - ayyyyy........ He's Hon-or-ableeeeeee......and not so freaking gaaaaaay...... He paid lots of caaaaaash.....for a team that really blooooow-ooooooooows.... So he gives up his seats.....in the nose- - bleed roooooooooooooows....... He Lives..... Another Day............... HE LIVES!........... Another Day......... HE LIVES! Edited May 8, 2014 by Ghost of Dwight Drane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted May 8, 2014 Author Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 So what about the players? Like it or not, the players, the owners' partners, own 50% of that ticket revenue. Owners can't keep prices artificially low because doing so would be circumventing their labor agreement. Ville Leino should be giving each season ticket holder 234$ because realistically he was worth 750k last year not 4.5 million so do a little math and bam! I just more than covered the cost of the ticket increase. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvelo Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 So what about the players? Like it or not, the players, the owners' partners, own 50% of that ticket revenue. Owners can't keep prices artificially low because doing so would be circumventing their labor agreement. I pay woefully little attention to the financial reality of the revenue and stuff like that. I'm just going by my feelings as a hockey fan and after our worst year, I just feel it's a slap in the face to Joe Fan to raise ticket prices. I know from one of your posts that they're doing some shell game to make things right but on the surface of it that's how I feel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 (edited) Although it wasn't a big price increase and Buffalo is still a bargain compared to the rest of the NHL market, a price increase after the worst season in Sabres history and one in which the team scored the least amount of goals in modern NHL history is a P.R. disaster at the very least and symbolically a slap in the face to the "suffering" fans. That's why they are giving "suffering season ticket holders" a 6.5% rebate. If a net 2.5% price decrease is a slap in the face then please slap me silly. Edited May 8, 2014 by PromoTheRobot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 That's why they are giving "suffering season ticket holders" a 6.5% rebate. If a net 2.5% price decrease is a slap in the face then please slap me silly. there already was a 2.5% rebate. So it's essential a 4% against 4% wash (although if you really get into the details of the math, it is a slight decrease) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 I pay woefully little attention to the financial reality of the revenue and stuff like that. I'm just going by my feelings as a hockey fan and after our worst year, I just feel it's a slap in the face to Joe Fan to raise ticket prices. I know from one of your posts that they're doing some shell game to make things right but on the surface of it that's how I feel. Fair enough. I get the misery. But Stanley Cup or no, the reality is that the Sabres will have to raise prices year on year as long as there is outstanding demand. Or at least that's the spirit of their labor agreement that the owners and players negotiated through lockout. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted May 8, 2014 Report Share Posted May 8, 2014 there already was a 2.5% rebate. So it's essential a 4% against 4% wash (although if you really get into the details of the math, it is a slight decrease) That's true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byebye Posted May 9, 2014 Report Share Posted May 9, 2014 (edited) I'll ask my semi-annual question, for which no one will have an answer. Why does multi-billionaire owner Terry Pegula, who scoffed at the idea he would dirty himself with the idea of making money as owner of the Sabres, need to qualify for a welfare check from the league — a check that comes at an ever-increasing expense to the fans? Usually multi billionaires, become multi billionaires by being better at making/saving money. So that does not surprise me. Another thing that doesn't surprise me is prices raising especially considering buffalo has some of the cheapest tickets in the Nhl. I'd like to see you invest millions into a team and community, then get scoffed at for recuperating some loses. I don't care what he said, rich people don't buy or invest for any other means then to make money. I don't think your question is the head scratcher you thought it was I'm pissed because if I find gold beneath my property it belongs to New York State, and goes towards the general good, but the gas beneath my property doesn't belong to me, and isn't considered a State Resource. If I were to find the biggest richest vein of gold in all of the country in my own backyard, that would belong to the State. I don't hate government, because they provide the roads and schools that I use, and the gold could also be used to buy food and shelter and water for many. However, if it is gas or oil that is found, then a bunch of millionaires are going to get richer, under my own feet, and the money will not be distributed evenly. If you live in New York State, then perhaps you have some concept of the State's natural resources. Perhaps you feel a sense of pride for living in such an abundant state. I am sure that you pay taxes, so I'd forgive you for feeling a sense of investiture or ownership in the State. I'd like to remind you, though, that you don't own the oil and gas, because that's a private resource, rather than a State resource. Any pride that you might take in the fact that New York State has gas reserves should be divorced from your calculus. Natural Gas is not a State Resource. Edited May 9, 2014 by Naulter8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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