ExiledInIllinois Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 When you drive a Suburban, you'll take what you can get. lol No doubt! Just where are are those few pennies that you save ending up... 20 oz. Slurpee and a Butterfinger? ;) ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 No doubt! Just where are are those few pennies that you save ending up... 20 oz. Slurpee and a Butterfinger? ;) ;) The savings for me between $4.11 and $3.87 yields almost $6 difference when I fill my tank. That's Salami and Cheese for my lunch for a week! :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 We saw gas at $3.61 a couple nights ago, and it's as low as $3.51 in the Cleveland area...I'm not complaining as much, but I'd still like to see it get back around $3... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 The savings for me between $4.11 and $3.87 yields almost $6 difference when I fill my tank. That's Salami and Cheese for my lunch for a week! :thumbsup: I have a Dodge Dakota quad-cab with a 24 gallon tank, so the difference now versus three weeks ago (the average price was around $3.94) is about $7 a tank. On the wife's CRV it's about a $4 difference. That adds up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
frisky Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 Our gas is still 4.22 for regular. :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Oxhurtz Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 Gas has been between 3.75-3.90 here. Hopefully it will get back down under $3 a gallon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 I saw an episode of nova yesterday about the car of future. They mentioned that fuel economy of cars doubled from the 70s to mid 80s due to mileage standards. This kept fuel prices in check and to actually fall. Since that time the fuel economy of cars has actually declined some and we see where gas prices have gone. If the government had continued to make the automakers increase mileage standards the last 20 years and if the government would go back to a policy of keeping a strong U.S. dollar then the price of gas would not be as much of an issue as it is. Of course we still need to start getting cars away from using gas in order to reduce political tensions but that is another issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MattPie Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 How are prices for the rest of you? I paid $4.18 for 93 yesterday. 87 was under $4, but neither of my vehicles run on it, so I don't keep track. The outer-western Philly Suburbs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHAAAUGHT!!! Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 I'm actually a commodity leader for my company, which is a global conglomerate, so I'm intimately familiar with worldwide raw material pricing and economic indicators. So let me see if I can break down the reasons for high gas prices for everyone. I've already seen a lot of factors listed in previous posts, but the important thing to remember that no single factor is responsible; it has been the culmination of several factors. The biggest reason for price increase is speculators and economic conditions; supply and demand is not as much as a factor as one might think. 1) There has never been as much money being invested in commodities as right now, due to a few different reasons listed below. 2) Good traders saw the housing fallout coming. All stocks have become risky and more importantly, unpredictable, and as a result more people are putting money into commodity futures because demand was outpacing supply in 2006-2007, and inventories were being depleted. But supply and inventory has gone up, while investment still continues to pour in. This is what continues to drive the price up in all commodities, and not just oil. 3) Money was cheap and easy to get. It?s hard to remember that interest rates were at an all time low not to long ago, and banks were more than willing to loan money out to anyone and everyone. People could borrow money to pay for overhead costs, and use cash to buy futures, stocks, and funds. 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. 5) Inflation. Lower US dollar means it cost more to buy the same amount of oil, regardless of all these other reasons. 6) Trader Psychology - politics aside, stock prices are based on how people feel about the economy. When the economy is going great, investment pours in, when it is going bad, people panic and pull out their money, which is absolutely the wrong thing to do unless bankruptcy looks probable. Guys like Warren Buffet and the guy that bought the huge stake in GM have made their billions by buying low and selling high. The best time to invest is when the economy is in the crapper. 7) Refining capacity. Oil supply is projected to be a problem in the future, but it is not a problem right now. The bottleneck is refining capacity. By just saying that we are going to build more refineries will drive oil prices down, no matter where in the world they are located. 8) Diesel/Kerosene is in much more demand that gasoline, and is more profitable right now, so more refineries are choosing to make diesel instead of gasoline. Since the process to make diesel requires a byproduct of gas refining, they have to purchase more of that byproduct than before, which as a result pushes up price (sorry but I can't remember what the specific byproduct was) 9) War/Middle East tensions - remember that every time there is an oil spill that gas spikes because of confidence in the supply, real or not real. The fact we have destabilized the Middle East (right or wrong) and further alienated oil producing nations like Iran, Russia, etc does not help confidence. Plus, it requires a lot of fuel to be flying helicopter, planes, humvees, and every ship in the Navy. So as you can see it really has been the perfect storm. Hope that helps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 I'm actually a commodity leader for my company, which is a global conglomerate, so I'm intimately familiar with worldwide raw material pricing and economic indicators. So let me see if I can break down the reasons for high gas prices for everyone. I've already seen a lot of factors listed in previous posts, but the important thing to remember that no single factor is responsible; it has been the culmination of several factors. The biggest reason for price increase is speculators and economic conditions; supply and demand is not as much as a factor as one might think. 1) There has never been as much money being invested in commodities as right now, due to a few different reasons listed below. 2) Good traders saw the housing fallout coming. All stocks have become risky and more importantly, unpredictable, and as a result more people are putting money into commodity futures because demand was outpacing supply in 2006-2007, and inventories were being depleted. But supply and inventory has gone up, while investment still continues to pour in. This is what continues to drive the price up in all commodities, and not just oil. 3) Money was cheap and easy to get. It?s hard to remember that interest rates were at an all time low not to long ago, and banks were more than willing to loan money out to anyone and everyone. People could borrow money to pay for overhead costs, and use cash to buy futures, stocks, and funds. 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. 5) Inflation. Lower US dollar means it cost more to buy the same amount of oil, regardless of all these other reasons. 6) Trader Psychology - politics aside, stock prices are based on how people feel about the economy. When the economy is going great, investment pours in, when it is going bad, people panic and pull out their money, which is absolutely the wrong thing to do unless bankruptcy looks probable. Guys like Warren Buffet and the guy that bought the huge stake in GM have made their billions by buying low and selling high. The best time to invest is when the economy is in the crapper. 7) Refining capacity. Oil supply is projected to be a problem in the future, but it is not a problem right now. The bottleneck is refining capacity. By just saying that we are going to build more refineries will drive oil prices down, no matter where in the world they are located. 8) Diesel/Kerosene is in much more demand that gasoline, and is more profitable right now, so more refineries are choosing to make diesel instead of gasoline. Since the process to make diesel requires a byproduct of gas refining, they have to purchase more of that byproduct than before, which as a result pushes up price (sorry but I can't remember what the specific byproduct was) 9) War/Middle East tensions - remember that every time there is an oil spill that gas spikes because of confidence in the supply, real or not real. The fact we have destabilized the Middle East (right or wrong) and further alienated oil producing nations like Iran, Russia, etc does not help confidence. Plus, it requires a lot of fuel to be flying helicopter, planes, humvees, and every ship in the Navy. So as you can see it really has been the perfect storm. Hope that helps. I find it mildly amusing that you come from Gasport, NY... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHAAAUGHT!!! Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 I find it mildly amusing that you come from Gasport, NY... That is hilarious. It all makes sense now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted July 30, 2008 Report Share Posted July 30, 2008 I want one of the Chevy Volt cars. They are still working on the battery, but that car is sweet!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdexchange Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 I'm actually a commodity leader for my company, which is a global conglomerate, so I'm intimately familiar with worldwide raw material pricing and economic indicators. So let me see if I can break down the reasons for high gas prices for everyone. I've already seen a lot of factors listed in previous posts, but the important thing to remember that no single factor is responsible; it has been the culmination of several factors. The biggest reason for price increase is speculators and economic conditions; supply and demand is not as much as a factor as one might think. 1) There has never been as much money being invested in commodities as right now, due to a few different reasons listed below. 2) Good traders saw the housing fallout coming. All stocks have become risky and more importantly, unpredictable, and as a result more people are putting money into commodity futures because demand was outpacing supply in 2006-2007, and inventories were being depleted. But supply and inventory has gone up, while investment still continues to pour in. This is what continues to drive the price up in all commodities, and not just oil. 3) Money was cheap and easy to get. It's hard to remember that interest rates were at an all time low not to long ago, and banks were more than willing to loan money out to anyone and everyone. People could borrow money to pay for overhead costs, and use cash to buy futures, stocks, and funds. 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. 5) Inflation. Lower US dollar means it cost more to buy the same amount of oil, regardless of all these other reasons. 6) Trader Psychology - politics aside, stock prices are based on how people feel about the economy. When the economy is going great, investment pours in, when it is going bad, people panic and pull out their money, which is absolutely the wrong thing to do unless bankruptcy looks probable. Guys like Warren Buffet and the guy that bought the huge stake in GM have made their billions by buying low and selling high. The best time to invest is when the economy is in the crapper. 7) Refining capacity. Oil supply is projected to be a problem in the future, but it is not a problem right now. The bottleneck is refining capacity. By just saying that we are going to build more refineries will drive oil prices down, no matter where in the world they are located. 8) Diesel/Kerosene is in much more demand that gasoline, and is more profitable right now, so more refineries are choosing to make diesel instead of gasoline. Since the process to make diesel requires a byproduct of gas refining, they have to purchase more of that byproduct than before, which as a result pushes up price (sorry but I can't remember what the specific byproduct was) 9) War/Middle East tensions - remember that every time there is an oil spill that gas spikes because of confidence in the supply, real or not real. The fact we have destabilized the Middle East (right or wrong) and further alienated oil producing nations like Iran, Russia, etc does not help confidence. Plus, it requires a lot of fuel to be flying helicopter, planes, humvees, and every ship in the Navy. So as you can see it really has been the perfect storm. Hope that helps. Thanks for informative post :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Screamin'Weasel Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 I'm actually a commodity leader for my company, which is a global conglomerate, so I'm intimately familiar with worldwide raw material pricing and economic indicators. So let me see if I can break down the reasons for high gas prices for everyone. I've already seen a lot of factors listed in previous posts, but the important thing to remember that no single factor is responsible; it has been the culmination of several factors. The biggest reason for price increase is speculators and economic conditions; supply and demand is not as much as a factor as one might think. 1) There has never been as much money being invested in commodities as right now, due to a few different reasons listed below. 2) Good traders saw the housing fallout coming. All stocks have become risky and more importantly, unpredictable, and as a result more people are putting money into commodity futures because demand was outpacing supply in 2006-2007, and inventories were being depleted. But supply and inventory has gone up, while investment still continues to pour in. This is what continues to drive the price up in all commodities, and not just oil. 3) Money was cheap and easy to get. It?s hard to remember that interest rates were at an all time low not to long ago, and banks were more than willing to loan money out to anyone and everyone. People could borrow money to pay for overhead costs, and use cash to buy futures, stocks, and funds. 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. 5) Inflation. Lower US dollar means it cost more to buy the same amount of oil, regardless of all these other reasons. 6) Trader Psychology - politics aside, stock prices are based on how people feel about the economy. When the economy is going great, investment pours in, when it is going bad, people panic and pull out their money, which is absolutely the wrong thing to do unless bankruptcy looks probable. Guys like Warren Buffet and the guy that bought the huge stake in GM have made their billions by buying low and selling high. The best time to invest is when the economy is in the crapper. 7) Refining capacity. Oil supply is projected to be a problem in the future, but it is not a problem right now. The bottleneck is refining capacity. By just saying that we are going to build more refineries will drive oil prices down, no matter where in the world they are located. 8) Diesel/Kerosene is in much more demand that gasoline, and is more profitable right now, so more refineries are choosing to make diesel instead of gasoline. Since the process to make diesel requires a byproduct of gas refining, they have to purchase more of that byproduct than before, which as a result pushes up price (sorry but I can't remember what the specific byproduct was) 9) War/Middle East tensions - remember that every time there is an oil spill that gas spikes because of confidence in the supply, real or not real. The fact we have destabilized the Middle East (right or wrong) and further alienated oil producing nations like Iran, Russia, etc does not help confidence. Plus, it requires a lot of fuel to be flying helicopter, planes, humvees, and every ship in the Navy. So as you can see it really has been the perfect storm. Hope that helps. I cannot even begin to think of the amount of fuel needed to fly a Humvee let alone every ship in the Navy! :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 I want one of the Chevy Volt cars. They are still working on the battery, but that car is sweet!! I'll take a Tesla Roadster. Now if I can only remember which pocket I put that $95k in.... B-) Tesla Roadster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Solution? :lol: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 31, 2008 Report Share Posted July 31, 2008 Solution? :lol: I get pissed off to no end when idiot local news stations tease stories about ways to save at the pump and how to get the most out of your gas, and then run the same damn story that's been running for the last four years. Inflate the tires, reduce weight and take unnecessary stuff out of the vehicle, no jackrabbit starts and stops, etc. No crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. At the risk of starting a whole political derail, the quote above is going to be the real legacy of the current president. He and his cronies are nothing but Robber Barons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 I get pissed off to no end when idiot local news stations tease stories about ways to save at the pump and how to get the most out of your gas, and then run the same damn story that's been running for the last four years. Inflate the tires, reduce weight and take unnecessary stuff out of the vehicle, no jackrabbit starts and stops, etc. No crap. I'm expecting the price of air pumps at gas stations to increase substantially soon as well. Remember free air? I've seen a few news reports lately where they make the comment that with people driving less (what is it like 3% less?) that there will be less money for road repairs. Give me a break! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Greenstein Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 At the risk of starting a whole political derail, the quote above is going to be the real legacy of the current president. He and his cronies are nothing but Robber Barons. I would say that the reason the 70% of spending is on consumer spending is because people love stuff and will continue to go into debt to get stuff. That has nothing to do with Bush - that's been going on since the 50s. It's just that it's worse now than ever. This point piggy-backs off the point about money being so easy to get. Everyone bought houses they couldn't afford because of ARMs and used the savings to buy sweet cars. Now, the ARM re-loads, they can't afford the house, their credit is so bad that they lose the car, the banks are left with a bunch of houses and cars they are trying to sell and can't. I don't think that has anything to do with Bush. There are things you can call him out on, people being stupid really isn't one, IMO... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 I would say that the reason the 70% of spending is on consumer spending is because people love stuff and will continue to go into debt to get stuff. That has nothing to do with Bush - that's been going on since the 50s. It's just that it's worse now than ever. This point piggy-backs off the point about money being so easy to get. Everyone bought houses they couldn't afford because of ARMs and used the savings to buy sweet cars. Now, the ARM re-loads, they can't afford the house, their credit is so bad that they lose the car, the banks are left with a bunch of houses and cars they are trying to sell and can't. I don't think that has anything to do with Bush. There are things you can call him out on, people being stupid really isn't one, IMO... Use to be the banks wouldn't allow people to act upon their stupidity of over-borrowimg. Remember the term, 'colder than a bankers heart?' Since the Reagan era, deregulation of everything has allowed banks to make incredibly stupid loans to idiots that can't read afford it. And banks or morgage lenders then turned around and bundled all these loans into securities and sold them off, basically selling away the risk. What a plan! Make bad loans and sell them off to unsuspecting morons. The mortgage companies had the "independent" rating companies label these securities AAA rating, the best you can get. Gold plated turds. It's all collasped like a house of cards and the government is going to bail everything out, it has to, or else.... Just proves the point, and ounc of prevention is worth a pound of cure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted August 1, 2008 Report Share Posted August 1, 2008 I'm actually a commodity leader for my company, which is a global conglomerate, so I'm intimately familiar with worldwide raw material pricing and economic indicators. So let me see if I can break down the reasons for high gas prices for everyone. I've already seen a lot of factors listed in previous posts, but the important thing to remember that no single factor is responsible; it has been the culmination of several factors. The biggest reason for price increase is speculators and economic conditions; supply and demand is not as much as a factor as one might think. 1) There has never been as much money being invested in commodities as right now, due to a few different reasons listed below. 2) Good traders saw the housing fallout coming. All stocks have become risky and more importantly, unpredictable, and as a result more people are putting money into commodity futures because demand was outpacing supply in 2006-2007, and inventories were being depleted. But supply and inventory has gone up, while investment still continues to pour in. This is what continues to drive the price up in all commodities, and not just oil. 3) Money was cheap and easy to get. It?s hard to remember that interest rates were at an all time low not to long ago, and banks were more than willing to loan money out to anyone and everyone. People could borrow money to pay for overhead costs, and use cash to buy futures, stocks, and funds. 4) Tax breaks/Erosion of the middle class - 70% of our GDP is consumer spending. Rich people don't spend all their money on consumables, they invest. This added to the amount of money being used to drive up commodity pricing. This increased the gap between the haves and have-nots. The less money for the middle class, the less they can contribute to the GDP. 5) Inflation. Lower US dollar means it cost more to buy the same amount of oil, regardless of all these other reasons. 6) Trader Psychology - politics aside, stock prices are based on how people feel about the economy. When the economy is going great, investment pours in, when it is going bad, people panic and pull out their money, which is absolutely the wrong thing to do unless bankruptcy looks probable. Guys like Warren Buffet and the guy that bought the huge stake in GM have made their billions by buying low and selling high. The best time to invest is when the economy is in the crapper. 7) Refining capacity. Oil supply is projected to be a problem in the future, but it is not a problem right now. The bottleneck is refining capacity. By just saying that we are going to build more refineries will drive oil prices down, no matter where in the world they are located. 8) Diesel/Kerosene is in much more demand that gasoline, and is more profitable right now, so more refineries are choosing to make diesel instead of gasoline. Since the process to make diesel requires a byproduct of gas refining, they have to purchase more of that byproduct than before, which as a result pushes up price (sorry but I can't remember what the specific byproduct was) 9) War/Middle East tensions - remember that every time there is an oil spill that gas spikes because of confidence in the supply, real or not real. The fact we have destabilized the Middle East (right or wrong) and further alienated oil producing nations like Iran, Russia, etc does not help confidence. Plus, it requires a lot of fuel to be flying helicopter, planes, humvees, and every ship in the Navy. So as you can see it really has been the perfect storm. Hope that helps. Are you saying that the increased demand from rising economies like China, India, Central and South America, the Middle East and everywhere inbetween are not putting serious upward pressures on the price of oil? There is only so much oil. I'd have to say that increased demand is the key factor in all this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seth Greenstein Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 Are you saying that the increased demand from rising economies like China, India, Central and South America, the Middle East and everywhere inbetween are not putting serious upward pressures on the price of oil? There is only so much oil. I'd have to say that increased demand is the key factor in all this. I would agree with you that the developing countries are changing the supply/demand balance. In addition, they are bidding high prices in order to get what they want. Take Natural gas for example. Here in the US, after some back sliding recently, natural gas was trading today around $9.50/MMBtu. About 2 months ago, here it was trading at $13.50/MMBtu - which is approximately 6.5 times what it was selling for 2002. That price is enormous today. But what's amazing is that there have been a couple of parcels shipped in liquid form to China a couple of months ago at prices around $18/MMBtu. So why would prices go down when you have both the issue of a supply/demand balance change as well as a group of growing countries who are willing to pay top dollar in order to get what ever shipment they want. Remember about 5 years ago, people talked about building LNG (Liquid Natural Gas) terminals in the US so we could get liquified natural gas and that would add to the US supply and lower prices. Well, no international shipments of LNG are coming to the US anymore because we're only willing to pay $13.50/MMBtu while other developing countries are willing to pay $17-$18/MMBtu. Supply/Demand is a big part of the changing dynamics. Buying patterns are as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 I hate words. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted August 2, 2008 Report Share Posted August 2, 2008 I hate words. :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.