Why is Kevyn Adams still the General Manager?

[Rasmus_]

Because Terry is a blind, criminally neglegable twit who cares about his feelings more than the fact he's ruining a franchise. 

[dudacek]

24 minutes ago, darksabre said:

I'm just going to keep saying it until it sticks, but I don't think Pegula has any intention of deviating from the plan he and Adams have previously agreed on. He may want to know how it's going, what has worked, what hasn't, and what Adams intends to do about it.

But he's not going to pull the rip cord. He's not going to disrupt or interfere anymore.

 

22 minutes ago, Thorny said:

The personal satisfaction he gets by simply refusing to engage with what everyone else is saying he HAS to do is the win. It’s Trumpian. 

don’t delete this post or whatever. That’s not political - it’s simply how he operates.

people get that this is what’s happening, right? This isn’t hockey anymore.

This feels right to me: pride.

Blind, willful adherence to insisting you were right regardless of the evidence, regardless of the consequence.

[CallawaySabres]

Just have to give it time, I really think this is our year coming up!

[wingnut]

"Why is KA still the GM" would be a great question to ask at the beginning of every single meeting between reporters and anyone who represents the team in any way.

[Taro T]

52 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Pegula is filthy rich. It’s probably out of spite. He wanted ROR traded because of a locker room comment. Do not overthink this that would be a massive mistake. It’s Terry Pegula. The minds of rich people. They do not deserve an iota of hockey analysis on this 

The locker room comment was the final straw; but he wanted him gone because darn near the very 1st thing he did after signing a mega contract to be a leader of the Buffalo Sabres rebuild was get drunk and use his truck to create a new drive through at a Timmy Ho's.

[DarthEbriate]

A few points:

first...  This song writes itself.

 

second,

We need to stop comparing the Bandits and Bills success (and really, have the Amerks been all that successful?) with the Sabres. Each is its own unique situation. But with the NLL in particular, there's nothing to compare. The average NLL player makes about $19,000/season and up to about $30K for the stars. There are 14 teams in the entire league. You get a good core together and you've got yourself a contender. You could build an entire roster for less than Tyson Kozak's annual salary. Nationwide, the NLL is an non-entity.

 

thirdly:

But, if someone wanted to somehow compare the NFL and NHL and how to build a roster: the Bills have an MVP-caliber QB. What's the best comparison in the NHL? A Vezina-level goalie or an Art Ross-capable 1C. In his five seasons as GM, Adams has had one season with a starting-caliber goalie (Ullmark) whom his predecessor and he both only signed to 1-year deals. (This was signed before Ullmark's dad died and he decided he needed a change of scenery.) Then, there was never even an attempt to find a legitimate 1A goalie in any of the following seasons. On the 1C front, Adams dismantled the core of which Eichel was a part of and traded a top-10 C in the league for a then 2/3W and some futures. You could even toss in a Norris-capable 1D. Adams inherited one of those, too -- and Samuelsson has been the partner of choice for 4 years running. That's all Adams. He's bad at his job.

 

finally,

Adams' presentation: "I want to be here. I'll keep it EEE, keep you safe (from public appearances so you make money from the NFL machine). And just wait until Power turns 26. Then, look out!"

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, HumanSlinky39 said:

Hard to believe the Wings just missed for the 9th straight. They were a model organization for so long. They've managed to almost fall back to the Dead Things. Similar situations to us, though. They've drafted reasonable well, but Yzerman has failed to build a coherent roster around them. He made a decent trade for DeBrincat, but other than that, a lot of very questionable veteran signings.

Yes Stevie Y is struggling too.  He takes action, and it looks reasonable on paper, but the players on the roster just never gel.

DeBrincat is a goal scorer but he gives up a lot too.  

Detroit brought in some talent with Kane, Copp and Compher.  In the past he added ex-Blues like Sunquist, Fabbri, Perron, and now Tarasenko.  He is at least is trying to add guys with playoff experience that are "hard to play against" to go with his home grown players. 

Not sure he has much in the net either.  

Stevie gets a B for effort and a F for results.  

Adams gets and F for both.  

[Brawndo]

1 hour ago, That Aud Smell said:

By whom?

Total BS.

It wasn’t me 

[Taro T]

51 minutes ago, darksabre said:

I'm just going to keep saying it until it sticks, but I don't think Pegula has any intention of deviating from the plan he and Adams have previously agreed on. He may want to know how it's going, what has worked, what hasn't, and what Adams intends to do about it.

But he's not going to pull the rip cord. He's not going to disrupt or interfere anymore.

Oh, that absolutely seems to be the plan.  Yeah, they swapped Cozens out but it was for another guy that's essentially on the same timeline.

It's what we hear directly from people within the organization - the plan is good, it just takes time. 

That ISN'T the message Ruff puts out, but he's about the only one.  Before "hearing" today's non-announcement announcement, was hopeful that we'd at least see Adams pulled out of a direct day-to-day hands on running of things and that Ruff's thoughts about getting the team a bit older were going to take hold.  (Now, not overly hopeful they'll even have THAT level of a change in direction.)

[JohnC]

45 minutes ago, dudacek said:

I realize this thread mostly exists to vent and crack jokes, but it is such a great question: why indeed?

By any objective pro sports results measure, Adams should be fired; the evidence is everywhere. I haven’t done the research myself, but I believe someone posted that he will be among just 2 or 3 GMs in NHL history to get a 6th season after 5 without playoffs.

And it can’t be for business reasons. Whatever the money Terry is saving on salaries, he’s squandering in lost revenue opportunities.

So why?

Does Terry Pegula draw different lines around success and failure than other billionaire sports owners? If so, what are they?

Did Kevyn actually present him with an off-season play for success that he bought? If so, how?

Why?

The driving force for Pegula retaining KA has little to do with performance as it does with his own hubris and stubbornness. The owner made an out of the box hire with KA. He made the hire with little consultation from anyone else. This was the man he chose and if he acknowledges his failing to do the job then he is also acknowledging that he made a mistake. Why was KA hired? He was hired because he presented a plan that was cheaper than following the standard approach to managing a franchise.  At that time, that was a big appeal to the owner who was hemorhaging money on his franchise. The mindset became, if I'm not winning and losing a bounty of money then, it would be better to lose less money while starting over.  

Cam anything be salvaged with the KA retention? Maybe. My sense is that the GM will have pressure on him to make some moves this offseason to be more competitive sooner rather than later. I really don't see this as a status quo offseason. (My opinion/hope.)This offseason should be interesting. TBD.

[Weave]

1 hour ago, darksabre said:

I'm just going to keep saying it until it sticks, but I don't think Pegula has any intention of deviating from the plan he and Adams have previously agreed on. He may want to know how it's going, what has worked, what hasn't, and what Adams intends to do about it.

But he's not going to pull the rip cord. He's not going to disrupt or interfere anymore.

3 days of presentations to Pegula tells me he wanted to see a detailed explanation of where we went wrong, and the path out.  In my experience in the corporate world, this is the management equivalent of a performance improvement plan.  And everyone in the corporate world knows a performance improvement plan is usually a hand on the exit door.

Frankly, Adams hasn’t earned the opportunity to dig his way out, but here we are.

[HumanSlinky39]

KA giving Terry a presentation and all I can picture is this:

[Archie Lee]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

I realize this thread mostly exists to vent and crack jokes, but it is such a great question: why indeed?

By any objective pro sports results measure, Adams should be fired; the evidence is everywhere. I haven’t done the research myself, but I believe someone posted that he will be among just 2 or 3 GMs in NHL history to get a 6th season after 5 without playoffs.

And it can’t be for business reasons. Whatever the money Terry is saving on salaries, he’s squandering in lost revenue opportunities.

So why?

Does Terry Pegula draw different lines around success and failure than other billionaire sports owners? If so, what are they?

Did Kevyn actually present him with an off-season plan for success that he bought? If so, how?

Why?

It's a great question.  We all have our theories.  I think it is simply that Adams is the first guy Pegula has hired to manage the Sabres, who he truly likes and trusts.  Had Murray or Botterill had the sort of success that McBeane is having with the Bills, then maybe they are still with the Sabres, whether Pegula liked and trusted them or not. But neither had any real success, so they were fired. Adams also hasn't had success, but the combination of Pegula liking and trusting Adams along with Pegula also being, I think, sensitive to the perception that he is too quick to fire people, has lead him to be far more patient with Adams than is warranted. I don't think it has anything to do with micromanaging or not being committed to winning*.  I think Pegula just failed to get it right the first 3 times, and now that he finally has a person in the role who he likes and trusts, he is going to give Adams a very long leash. 

*I understand that many, me included, will rightfully say that this is the same thing as not being committed to winning. I just mean that I don't think he has consciously determined that winning doesn't matter or that pinching pennies is more important.  I think that Pegula thinks/hopes that they will eventually win with Adams. As a fan, there may be no point in distinguishing between the motivations. 

Edited 49 minutes ago by Archie Lee

[dudacek]

12 minutes ago, Weave said:

3 days of presentations to Pegula tells me he wanted to see a detailed explanation of where we went wrong, and the path out.  In my experience in the corporate world, this is the management equivalent of a performance improvement plan.  And everyone in the corporate world knows a performance improvement plan is usually a hand on the exit door.

Frankly, Adams hasn’t earned the opportunity to dig his way out, but here we are.

So change is coming, just a year too late, probably 2?

With the very real risk of completely alienating the fans and the good players.

Seriously, what hope does Kevyn have? Trading Byram and Cozens ain’t going to do it.

Seems to me no matter what they spend on the margins, it’s going to be about putting most of his coin on Owen Power and Devon Levi again.

Edited 49 minutes ago by dudacek

[Flashsabre]

Imagine last offseason saying it is playoffs or bust this year and there are no more excuses. Then assembling a team that is last in the conference for most of the season and missing the playoffs for the 5th straight year under your leadership.

And the boss says “Nice presentation, give it another shot this year” 🤪

[JohnC]

45 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Yes Stevie Y is struggling too.  He takes action, and it looks reasonable on paper, but the players on the roster just never gel.

DeBrincat is a goal scorer but he gives up a lot too.  

Detroit brought in some talent with Kane, Copp and Compher.  In the past he added ex-Blues like Sunquist, Fabbri, Perron, and now Tarasenko.  He is at least is trying to add guys with playoff experience that are "hard to play against" to go with his home grown players. 

Not sure he has much in the net either.  

Stevie gets a B for effort and a F for results.  

Adams gets and F for both.  

What resonated with me is your comment that at least Stevie Y is trying. I have more respect for people who try to correct a problem and fail, as opposed to someone who stubbornly goes on the same pathway that is wrong. That's what is so exasperating with how KA and the owner have conducted themselves. 

[Pimlach]

35 minutes ago, Weave said:

3 days of presentations to Pegula tells me he wanted to see a detailed explanation of where we went wrong, and the path out.  In my experience in the corporate world, this is the management equivalent of a performance improvement plan.  And everyone in the corporate world knows a performance improvement plan is usually a hand on the exit door.

Frankly, Adams hasn’t earned the opportunity to dig his way out, but here we are.

I have seen numerous PIPs in my corporate days.  Never saw one that helped "fix" a persons performance unfortunately.  They may be intended to help but the reality is that it is a tool to prevent a lawsuit.  

I doubt Terry is worried about a lawsuit.  I think he truly likes Adams.  Terry could still be spooked about his reputation around the league as being impatient.  He must be counting on Lindy to make a difference. 

Promoting Adams higher into the FO to get him out of the way was never going to work.  If you don't want Adams involved in the FO decisions anymore you release him.  

[Weave]

33 minutes ago, dudacek said:

So change is coming, just a year too late, probably 2?

With the very real risk of completely alienating the fans and the good players.

Seriously, what hope does Kevyn have? Trading Byram and Cozens ain’t going to do it.

Seems to me no matter what they spend on the margins, it’s going to be about putting most of his coin on Owen Power and Devon Levi again.

I am still shocked he survived the palm trees and taxes speech.  That was such an anti-leadership moment.  Should have been fired almost immediately after that bit of leadership failure.  This sounds to me like a short leash situation.  Those kind of presentations usually contain milestones that need to be met.  I would expect a change as soon as a planned item gets missed.

Then again, I said at the time I don’t see how he survives palm trees and taxes, so my prediction rate is not looking good.

[darksabre]

1 hour ago, dudacek said:

 

This feels right to me: pride.

Blind, willful adherence to insisting you were right regardless of the evidence, regardless of the consequence.

I don't think it's pride, I think he's tired of looking like the one sowing chaos by firing so many different GMs, coaches, etc. over his time as owner.  I think he sees himself as a victim. A victim of bad advice from outsiders, a victim of bad staffing internally, etc. So now he's digging in.

 

55 minutes ago, Taro T said:

Oh, that absolutely seems to be the plan.  Yeah, they swapped Cozens out but it was for another guy that's essentially on the same timeline.

It's what we hear directly from people within the organization - the plan is good, it just takes time. 

That ISN'T the message Ruff puts out, but he's about the only one.  Before "hearing" today's non-announcement announcement, was hopeful that we'd at least see Adams pulled out of a direct day-to-day hands on running of things and that Ruff's thoughts about getting the team a bit older were going to take hold.  (Now, not overly hopeful they'll even have THAT level of a change in direction.)

"The NHL is a development league"

 

47 minutes ago, Weave said:

3 days of presentations to Pegula tells me he wanted to see a detailed explanation of where we went wrong, and the path out.  In my experience in the corporate world, this is the management equivalent of a performance improvement plan.  And everyone in the corporate world knows a performance improvement plan is usually a hand on the exit door.

Frankly, Adams hasn’t earned the opportunity to dig his way out, but here we are.

I want to take those rumors with a huge grain of salt. If Adams was doing presentations, I have to assume they were scheduled and may have even been his idea. That kinda stuff is his background. I don't believe he is in any kind of danger whatsoever.

 

[RangerDave]

1 hour ago, LabattBlue said:

Glad some others are hopping on the bandwagon. 

Wouldn't that be jumping OFF the bandwagon??  🤔