Casey Mittelstadt traded for Bowen Byram

[dudacek]

9 hours ago, mjd1001 said:

I'm guessing here, but long term, I think the goal would be for Byram and Power to get about 18-19 minutes even strenght per game.  They seem to want to use Power on the PK, so Byram can take the role of 2nd unit PP Qb.  They both end up with 20-22 minutes per game that way, HOPEFULLY bringing Dahlin down to the 23-24 range (he is over 25 now)

If it works the way it's envisioned you're going to see Byram used largely like you see Power used.

I know it's pretty much vanished around the league, but I think you may see the Sabres bringing back a PP with 2 real blueliners on it.

9 hours ago, #freejame said:

If he’s healthy I don’t think people will end up disappointed with Bryam. It’s just not the best use of assets imo. 

I think this is the most realistic reaction for this exact moment in time.

 

9 hours ago, rickshaw said:

It’s not the worst deal but it leads me to believe more is in the works.

I know it’s potential but our defense could be serious in a few years if they can add some right handed players.

The Avs made this deal work for them by dumping Johanssen and adding Walker.

I'm not sure about the D — I kinda think we are going to run with our top 4 in ice time all being LH next year — but removing Casey certainly opens space under the cap and on the roster for a more robust, hard-nosed middle-six forward.

8 hours ago, Thorny said:

I mean, they are 2.5 years apart. If you keep Casey yes you have the better player now, and maybe Byram’s improvement gets him back to what he was. But why isn’t Casey being afforded that same likelihood? If I had to guess who was more likely to improve, I’d go with Casey, given trajectory 

Also I don’t really agree with the Tuch comp. Casey is younger, and also Tuch was in the midst of a career outlier season. Casey’s saw a progression and back to back 60 point seasons 

Definitely disagree with the bolded. Casey may have an outlier season in him, but as a 25-year-old centre with more than 300 games, I think what we've seen the past 2 years is basically what we're going to get with Casey. 

As a 22-year-old D with 140 games played, Byram definitely has a lot more runway. First comparable that popped in to my mind is Morgan Reilly, who's not dissimilar in pedigree. Byram has 63 points in his first 143 NHL games, Reilly had 59 in his first 154. Noah Hanifin had 54 in his first 160. Miro Heiskanen 68 in 150. Byram's no Quinn Hughes, but he's got plenty of room to grow.

 

8 hours ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

or getting a concussion victim who will never be the same (see Tim Connolly for example) for a player just maturing into stardom (see Sam Reinhart for example). 

This is a realistic worst-case scenario.

 

8 hours ago, Thorny said:

Question: As mentioned, I can definitely see the talent with Byram. From a team building standpoint I find it confusing. But, for someone/those more confident than me in this trade ending up beneficial: Do you see the trade potentially improving the team as soon as next season? Would you argue that is likely? Or is that more best case scenario, with your likely estimation being we see net improvement further down the line? 

What say you? I’m open to the idea Byram could end up the better player but it literally only matters, for me, if it can happen for next season 

It's pretty damn hard to predict when a talented young player will cement himself as simply a very good player. Byram hasn't done that yet.

That said, Byrum for Eric Johnson should improve the defence corps.

Your answer is more likely to come from how the other pieces fit as referenced in my reply to @rickshaw: how Adams replaces Casey and the other players that move on from this .500 team. These things don't happen in a vacuum. I don't think the issues with this year's Sabres are mostly about talent.

7 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

It's just confusing from a team building perspective and if he doesn't stay healthy or return to form, we fail... again. 

Maybe a team doesn't have to be built in the mould of 1999 Devils. Maybe it's OK having a really talented attacking defenceman on the ice at all times? it never hurt the '70s Habs.

Maybe all that matters is your guy being better than the other guy and the 'how' doesn't matter?

Because even though I like the player, he certainly isn't the profile I would have targeted.

7 hours ago, Believer said:

Adams hasn’t shown trade chops yet… Mitts for Byram is a start, if Byram stays healthy…

Will be impressed if he moves Samuelson while he has high value for a RH top 4 D in late 20’s… or Tuch for a 20+ goal scorer who plays a physical 200 ft game, likes to be at the net, and goes every game.

Show us what you got Adams. You sure sold Pegula… Show us you can sell Buffalo.

I think this trade should obliterate the narrative that Adams doesn't have the balls to trade away pieces from the happy-to-be-here group, or the one that he's unwilling to take a risk.

I also wondering why we haven't heard much celebration from the 'wake up the pampered country club' crowd. In my view Adams couldn't have fired a clearer shot across that bow than trading your leading scorer, hugely popular dressing room figure and party house host.

 

7 hours ago, Derrico said:

Just as much risk we overpay Mitts and he reverts to who he has been most of his career.  

I don't believe this will happen, but it's just as legitimate a worry as Byram going full Ryan Murray.

Edited March 7 by dudacek

[gilbert11]

11 hours ago, #freejame said:

I really liked Bryam but he’s hasn’t really found his game. I don’t see what he brings that we don’t already have, but he’s another guy who can push for a 3-4 slot. I think he’s probably a 4-5 guy at the end of the day but the potential is there. 

Casey is better and right now Colorado wins the trade if nothing is added. 

Yeah, despite being the team’s highest scorer, of course Casey isn’t the best player.  He’s been solid and improved so much.   He becomes a RFA after this season so maybe that had something to do with it, plus a desire to get out.

As far as all the LH defensemen, TNT did a great demonstration between periods on the impact of a LHD playing on the right side.  Hopefully this is a stepping stone to another deal.  Perhaps they have something in the works to trade like a Power or Ryan Johnson for a star center or a top RHD.

[dudacek]

Thought people might be interested in Byram's Elite Prospects scouting report from his draft year:

https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/326522/bowen-byram

 An exceptionally gifted defenceman who knows his strengths and plays by them. He possesses elite skating ability and is at his best when playing high energy, up-tempo hockey. He handles the puck well and is able to keep control of it under pressure. He makes calculated decisions that consistently shift momentum in his team's favor. His creativity in the offensive zone speaks to his confidence in his ability to be a game-changer.

Defensively astute, he actively takes away lanes and limits options for the oncoming opposition. All-in-all, Bowen Byram is a workhorse who understands how to take advantage of turnovers and shift the pace of play in his favor in all three zones. (Curtis Joe, EP 2019

He’s an excellent skater, with good balance, explosiveness and a high-end top-gear., EPrinkside.com 2019
Byram does a good job of holding the blue line, and he uses an active stick to interrupt passing lanes and disrupt oncoming puck-carriers, EPrinkside.com 2019
The best aspect of his hockey-sense is his ability to rapidly process the play. This extends to all three-zones, Hockeyprospect.com 2019
Possessing excellent vision, creativity and awareness, he’s a highly-precise passer, Future Considerations 2019
He is a near elite passer from the blueline, just as comfortable with a short pass as with a stretch pass, or flip pass, McKeen's Hockey 2019

And from the Athletic:

https://theathletic.com/947751/2019/05/06/wheeler-final-ranking-for-the-2019-nhl-drafts-top-100-prospects/

5. Bowen Byram — LHD, Vancouver Giants, 6-foot-0

I’ve already broken down Byram’s game as the best defenceman in the draft and a frontrunner for third overall in considerably more detail but the short of it is that while there is still work to be done on his defensive play, particularly with his effort and his spacial awareness within defensive zone schemes, Byram is one of the better goal scoring defencemen the NHL draft has seen in recent memory. Furthermore, he is an excellent three-zone passer and a strong skater who can recover from mistakes made pushing the play into the high slot if the puck goes back the other way. And he just keeps getting better, and better and better. The Byram of the last half of the season and into the playoffs was one of the best players in junior hockey.

[GASabresIUFAN]

Just throw more wood on my Adams dislike fire, is he now going to have to trade JJP and Quinn when they breakout further next season?

Seriously, what happens next season contract wise if Quinn, JJP and Bryam all have breakout seasons?  I can almost guarantee we won’t be retaining all three unless someone else gets traded instead.  

Edited March 7 by GASabresIUFAN

[dudacek]

4 hours ago, nfreeman said:

I am highly skeptical that KA could've gotten more for Mitts than Byram.  Frankly, I'm pretty surprised he got that much.

The price for Mitts level player is generally a mid- to late-1st and an equivalent prospect.

You'd never get 4th overall for that package.

So the pertinent question is why has Byram's stock dropped, and is it justified.

 

5 hours ago, Brawndo said:

I do believe this is the first in series of moves.

Could Jokiharju be on the move by Friday? 

 

If you ignore handedness and go by contract and skillset, its a no-brainer that Henri gets moved now.

But the handedness thing just makes it weird. (As an aside, Henri's play this year is the most under-discussed Sabres positive)

I can see a world where Ras is RD1 and Henri and Cliffy are 5 and 6 by ice time, but one of them is on the RD2 in terms of the lineup card

Most pissed-off guy on the team has to be Ryan Johnson. (As an aside, if you're honest with yourself, Bryson has outplayed him since he's been called up)

 

3 hours ago, Brawndo said:

 

Chucking him out there with Ras is so on-brand for Buffalo.

 

3 hours ago, ... said:

I didn't like him at all until about a month and half ago when it became apparent what he was trying to do, other than scoring, was working more than it was not. If we gave Mitts 7 years to develop the game he just left us with, we can give Krebs the rest of this season to develop his. I think they're relatively similar except Krebs will actually do stupid things like hit other players and be an agitator.

I've said it before, in his 3rd pro season Mittelstadt was putting up 22 points while going in and out of the lineup.

Krebs has an interesting opportunity here.

 

[SabreFinn]

2 minutes ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Just throw more wood on my Adams dislike fire, is he now going to have to trade JJP and Quinn when they breakout further next season?

Seriously, what happens next season contract wise if Quinn, JJP and Bryam all have breakout seasons?  I can almost guarantee we won’t be retaining all three unless someone else gets traded instead.  

I think that Adams, if he is still working for Sabres this time next year, will extend JJP and Quinn, no doubt about that.

I find it interesting that he got Byram. It will definitely bring more competition to the defense and several alternatives to the PP. Power has to step up. Stiłl I think/hope Adams plan is to trade for a physical defensive RHD at summer.

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, Ducky said:

Does Byram play the right side?

 

Poorly. It’ll be Dahlin 

[GASabresIUFAN]

5 minutes ago, SabreFinn said:

Stiłl I think/hope Adams plan is to trade for a physical defensive RHD at summer.

Hopium is a dangerous drug.

[Huckleberry]

To be honrst, i got drunk last night and woke up to this, i loved casey as one of our bright spots this year, adams saw him as 3C probably while he was better than thompson and cozens.  Im not ***** happy about this , unless his demands were too much colorado stole him.

[Huckleberry]

What fears me the most is we trade for a top 4 LHD, which means either power or dahlin are heading somewhere, and I do not see power having the balls to request a trade.

Im probably overthinking this.

[Huckleberry]

Or byram is part of a bigger deal coming our way, im confused about the lack of return, sakic got his 2C for years now.

[FrenchConnection44]

So, I presume our purpose as a franchise is to trade away talented forwards to high caliber playoff contenders in the hopes they can win a Stanley Cup? 

O’Reilly, Eichel, Casey, Reinhart … Who will it be next year? 
 

 

#FarmFranchise

 

[SabreFinn]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Hopium is a dangerous drug.

Yeah, but I have to use it for the pain I get from my Sabre fandom disease.

[Huckleberry]

***** trade for us.

[Claude Balls]

16 hours ago, PASabreFan said:

18 goals last two seasons combined.

How many does Krebs have? I'm glad Casey is gone, but Jesus Kevyn....you are actually dumber than I thought. 

[That Aud Smell]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

I think this trade should obliterate the narrative that Adams doesn't have the balls to trade away pieces from the happy-to-be-here group, or the one that he's unwilling to take a risk.

Having seen the photo of Byram with several current Sabres and their girlfriends, I will say: This trade might reinforce my concern that there’s too many of the same kind of guy on the team. Good vibes only.

[WhenWillItEnd66]

So all the talking heads seem to think we got a good dman. Ok, i am good with that. I also know that we cannot keep everyone. Ok with that too. Here is the big but.... BUT:

- We do not need another playmaking defenseman. (Happy to have if he will take minutes away from Dahlin)

- This team is in dire need of speed and scoring. Toronto defensively shut us down..... TORONTO!!!!! Thats embarrassing

- KA knows there are right handed dmen, right????

Talking heads are saying that in a couple of years we will have one of the best defenses in the league....... So, 10 years later we are still waiting to get to the playoffs. I love this team but i am tired of the year after year kick in the nuts this team seems to give the fans. I wish this new guy well and i hope he plays well, but he is NOT what we need. KA needs to be escorted out of the building never to return. He obviously has zero clue. Great defense and nobody that can score and plays scared that wont hit. I am inspired...... HBU?

 

 

[Buffalonill]

Watch adams trade cozens for dawson mercer

That's apparently how he works

[WhenWillItEnd66]

6 hours ago, Ducky said:

Does Byram play the right side?

 

Yes he can

[Archie Lee]

Value-wise, the trade is fine. I’m a little concerned with Byram’s injury history, but perhaps that is largely behind him. Certainly it is possible that he ends up being the clear best player in the deal.

I don’t really get it from a roster building standpoint though. With the regression we have seen in the play of Thompson and Cozens, it does not appear we have a “Cup Calibre” 1st line centre. Add Mitts to the mix and a still developing Krebs, and we at least had 3, and perhaps 4, legit middle 6 centres. So, while we did not have an elite centre, we at least had centre depth. Now we have 2, maybe 3 centres and that depth is erased. Does adding Byram on D offset this?

I contrast this with what Colorado did yesterday. They needed a #2 centre. They identified Mitts as the guy they wanted and then paid a significant price in Byram. The loss of Byram created a hole, so they immediately filled it by acquiring Walker from the Flyers. What did we do?  Did we address a specific need?  Cynically, it seems we had a guy who we were reluctant to pay and so we collected the best piece we could for him. One team is committed to winning and the other appears to be collecting assets still. 

[caseydean]

I do not understand the reaction of some on this board.  I know hard it is not to be pessiimistic after such a long drought, but Adams can't just run the same team out there next year.  Many complained when he did little in the off-season, and when he does something that's no good too.  I really like Mitts, but he is no savior.  Everything I read on Byram is that he has immense potential.  Folks in Denver are happy to get Mitts, but the overall reaction is that the Avs are pushing all the chips into the center now to win the Cup again, but paid for it long-term.  I mean I obviously don't know how this will turn out, but I am willing to at least give it a chance.  Maybe this will be like when the Bills drafted Josh and lots of folks wanted Rosen. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

This guy is paid top 3 D $.  He must have something to give.  He has one year left at $7.5M (or so).  What will he command on his next contract?  He was a highly rated D at the 2019 draft and went #4.  A cup winner who seems to be having an off year.  

Until a year or so ago most here wanted to dump Casey for a bag of pucks and were willing to toss is a draft pick to clinch the deal.

He is playing very well in a contract year - stop me if you've heard this one before.  I like Casey, but you have to give to get.  With the recent signings something had to give.  I support this trade.  A hockey trade of all things.

Unless something else happens (maybe in the summer at this point) I think Dahlin will be almost permanently moved to the right side.

Edited March 7 by Sabres Fan in NS
slightly more goodly ...

[kas23]

16 hours ago, Mango said:

7 career fights. 3 in the NHL. 

All of them give off big Dylan Cozens vibes. Fishbowl incoming. 

https://www.hockeyfights.com/players/24753

I see a fight against a former Tank Commander. This could work. 

[inkman]

35 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

Value-wise, the trade is fine. I’m a little concerned with Byram’s injury history, but perhaps that is largely behind him. Certainly it is possible that he ends up being the clear best player in the deal.

I don’t really get it from a roster building standpoint though. With the regression we have seen in the play of Thompson and Cozens, it does not appear we have a “Cup Calibre” 1st line centre. Add Mitts to the mix and a still developing Krebs, and we at least had 3, and perhaps 4, legit middle 6 centres. So, while we did not have an elite centre, we at least had centre depth. Now we have 2, maybe 3 centres and that depth is erased. Does adding Byram on D offset this?

I contrast this with what Colorado did yesterday. They needed a #2 centre. They identified Mitts as the guy they wanted and then paid a significant price in Byram. The loss of Byram created a hole, so they immediately filled it by acquiring Walker from the Flyers. What did we do?  Did we address a specific need?  Cynically, it seems we had a guy who we were reluctant to pay and so we collected the best piece we could for him. One team is committed to winning and the other appears to be collecting assets still. 

Well the Avs are buying and the Sabres are selling.  

 

[SHAAAUGHT!!!]

9 hours ago, Pimlach said:

We don’t know how good he is, or how good he will be.
 

So if we are trying to improve now then maybe this is not the right guy.  We have 23 year old Dahlin, 21 year old Power. We have Johnson. We locked up Power and Dahlin for big dollars. 
 

- 22 years old

- 190 ish pound defender

- the Avs moving on from him

- we lost our best 2way center to get him. 

Looks like a development project, I want to win now.  We have enough youth already.  
 

 

Not sure about that.  Byram was a major piece on a cup team, performed exceptionally well, and unfortunately has had a few concussions.  The Ave’s already have the best defensemen in the league eating up minutes and they know they will eventually have to pay Byram if he continues his trajectory.  The Ave’s also needed forwards badly.  
 

The Sabres have their top 2 centers locked up long-term and Casey isn’t the type of bottom 6 center we need.  

I expect both players will do well on and for their new teams, and both teams will be better for it.  Plus this finally gets that 10-ply pretender Joker off this team.