OT - Retail lines

[JoeSchmoe]

One thing I've noticed is that people these days that work in minimum wage type jobs all generally act like they could give two F's. It used to get me so upset!

Maybe a month or two ago I had an epiphany.  It dawned on me that in actuality... these minimum wage jobs buy less and less, but the business class just seem to get rich and richer. 

I'm originally from the Canadian side of the border in St Catharines (I've since moved slightly west). When I was a kid, we knew where the "rich" houses were in town. Those same "rich" houses are just considered above average now. The new rich have moved way upscale, yet the working poor cannot even afford rent anymore in the lower income parts of the city.

So now when I'm in a grocery store line and the cashier is moving aggravatingly slow, I pause and try to remember that their wage likely doesn't even allow them to afford a rent payment. Yet the corporations and business class that are screwing them left right and center are sitting pretty from the comfort of their mansions, luxury cars, and 2nd homes... Many times backed by bailout money when times turn tough.

Edited August 10, 2023 by JoeSchmoe

[Eleven]

9 hours ago, Kr632 said:

People have been doing this at red lights. They’ll stop 3-4 car lengths from the light at each intersection. More and more people have been doing it. 

I want two car lengths between me and the person in front of me, and more if it's a truck in front of me.  I want to see and I want to be able to get around them if they're an idiot.  It's not like it slows anything down.

[inkman]

28 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I want two car lengths between me and the person in front of me, and more if it's a truck in front of me.  I want to see and I want to be able to get around them if they're an idiot.  It's not like it slows anything down.

Pardon my ignorance but aren’t there sensors in the road detecting if there are vehicles at that light?  So in theory, if you are 3 car lengths behind the first car you could be inhibiting natural traffic flow as the light doesn’t sense your vehicle, giving priority to a lane it shouldn’t.  (I’m thinking left hand turn lanes specifically)

Edited August 10, 2023 by inkman

[Eleven]

3 minutes ago, inkman said:

Pardon my ignorance but aren’t there sensors in the road detecting if there are vehicles at that light?  So in theory, if you are 3 car lengths behind the first car you could be inhibiting natural traffic flow as the light doesn’t sense your vehicle, giving priority to a lane it shouldn’t.  (I’m thinking left hand turn lanes specifically)

I think they just sense the first car, at the few intersections we have with sensors?  If I'm close to the front I'm usually closer to the car in front, though, anyway.  In my mind's eye, when I wrote my post, I was in a longer line of cars than that.

[mjd1001]

9 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I took my 90 year old independent father shopping at Topps recently. He buys from a hand written list, he takes his time and moves  slow and steady, he pays with cash, he uses change and strives for exact change for some reason.  Bags a lot of it himself in his own bags.  Then he shuffles out slowly, pushing his own cart. I marvel at him.  On the days that I’m not there I sure hope he doesn’t have to deal with the intolerance you describe just because he took a few extra minutes.  His stamina and independence are rare.  We should value our elders more.   What is your hurry?  
 

Its about having courtesy for others.  When you are impacting other people, have some courtesy.  When people drive on the highway, the speed LIMIT is 55 or 65...if someone drives 40 or 45 it isn't against the law, but it would be not too courteous to others.  There are a bunch of other examples.  What is my hurry?  My hurry is that I might be on my way to work, have an appointment...and I have given myself enough time plus a little extra to account for things so I'm not late, but I would not anticipate getting in line at a grocery store and waiting 2 to 3 times as long as expected.  What I described isn't any less 'annoying' than just about any other complaint in this thread.

Edited August 10, 2023 by mjd1001

[Doohickie]

16 hours ago, inkman said:

Yeah I mentioned the COVID thing. I understand the gun point but here in Rochester just this week someone reported a gun sighting at a Walmart.  I immediately called ***** (not that it couldn’t happen) but unfortunately, we usually find out about active shooters after the damage is done.  Lo and behold, no one had a gun.  A whole section of town was shut down, worrying hundreds of people over something some Karen saw they thought was a gun.  I’m glad everyone is safe and being overly cautious is good but you better know what the ***** you are talking about if you are going to throw that out there.  It’s the reason yelling fire in a crowded movie theater is a crime.  You are causing the issue. 

Actually there's been a spate of bomb threats/active shooter reports/both together lately.  One night a week or two ago, a mall near me was evacuated when people started calling in that there were gun shots.  At virtually the same time, similar reports were called in about a Walmart about 30 miles away, and other shopping center about 40 miles away.  I think there was probably some social media prank thing urging teens to call in reports on that night.

16 hours ago, inkman said:

Oh I’ve got plenty to be happy about. It generally has little or nothing to do with anyone outside my circle.  I just thought an OT that people could relate to would be ideal in these lean hockey weeks. 

...or we could talk about my bunions.

[Doohickie]

16 hours ago, inkman said:

Six feet is fine is you at least look like you are in line behind someone. Most of the people I see aren’t even facing the direction of the line.  So I have to ask if they are in line.  

If they're that far away I just assume they're not.  If they are in line, they'll let you know.

13 hours ago, shrader said:

And then there’s the people who ask if you’re in line when that formation you’re standing in with 5 or 6 other people couldn’t possibly be interpreted as anything but a line. 

...but in the fast food example, it could be a line of people who have already ordered and are waiting for their food.

[Doohickie]

10 hours ago, Pimlach said:

I took my 90 year old independent father shopping at Topps recently. He buys from a hand written list, he takes his time and moves  slow and steady, he pays with cash, he uses change and strives for exact change for some reason.  Bags a lot of it himself in his own bags.  Then he shuffles out slowly, pushing his own cart. I marvel at him.  On the days that I’m not there I sure hope he doesn’t have to deal with the intolerance you describe just because he took a few extra minutes.  His stamina and independence are rare.  We should value our elders more.   What is your hurry? 

I was going to say the same without such a concrete example, but that basically if we're lucky, we'll be that old person some day.  None of us looks forward to being in the care of others but rather picture ourselves as still living and operating independently.  To think you're not going to have a drop off in cognitive performance or speed is just hubris.  Cut the older people some slack.

I will admit that I get impatient in stores but I try to hold it inside as much as I can; it's the old, "You never know what someone else is going through" thing.

[Doohickie]

10 hours ago, JoeSchmoe said:

One thing I've noticed is that people these days that work in minimum wage type jobs all generally act like they could give two F's. It used to get me so upset!

Maybe a month or two ago I had an epiphany.  It dawned on me that in actuality... these minimum wage jobs buy less and less, but the business class just seem to get rich and richer. 

I'm originally from the Canadian side of the border in St Catharines (I've since moved slightly west). When I was a kid, we knew where the "rich" houses were in town. Those same "rich" houses are just considered above average now. The new rich have moved way upscale, yet the working poor cannot even afford rent anymore in the lower income parts of the city.

So now when I'm in a grocery store line and the cashier is moving aggravatingly slow, I pause and try to remember that their wage likely doesn't even allow them to afford a rent payment. Yet the corporations and business class that are screwing them left right and center are sitting pretty from the comfort of their mansions, luxury cars, and 2nd homes... Many times backed by bailout money when times turn tough.

The other thing I've noticed is that increasingly these low wage jobs are being done by people who appear to be well past retirement age.  While you might think that's on them because they should have saved more in their youth, you also don't know what their life story is.  I'm okay, not great, financially, but most of that is driven by the fact that I was laid off 4 times in 5 years, 30 years ago, and when I should have been putting a good chunk of my salary away for retirement I was instead constantly behind the ball trying to catch up.  I'm maxed out on what I'm putting in now, but it's a catch up game.  For whatever reason, a lot of people haven't had even the level of opportunity that I have and never saved up enough to retire so they're 75 and still working at a ***** job.  Yes we're all a product of the decisions we make but some people either were never taught how to properly make those decisions or have had to navigate through a life journey that put them into situations that forced them to take actions they knew weren't in their best long term interests but had to get through the short term first.

[Doohickie]

2 hours ago, Eleven said:

I want two car lengths between me and the person in front of me, and more if it's a truck in front of me.  I want to see and I want to be able to get around them if they're an idiot.  It's not like it slows anything down.

It doesn't take two car lengths to be able to pull around someone else.  If you can see the bottom of their bumper you have enough room.

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, mjd1001 said:

Its about having courtesy for others.  When you are impacting other people, have some courtesy.  When people drive on the highway, the speed LIMIT is 55 or 65...if someone drives 40 or 45 it isn't against the law, but it would be not too courteous to others.  There are a bunch of other examples.  What is my hurry?  My hurry is that I might be on my way to work, have an appointment...and I have given myself enough time plus a little extra to account for things so I'm not late, but I would not anticipate getting in line at a grocery store and waiting 2 to 3 times as long as expected.  What I described isn't any less 'annoying' than just about any other complaint in this thread.

It actually sounds like you mean courtesy to you.  You were inconvenienced by being slowed down and are annoyed by it.  If you cared about courtesy for others then you show courtesy to others. 

I get your point on why you are annoyed and I am far from perfect.   What I don't like about your example is the targeting of elderly people that operate with reduced cognitive functional skills.  

[LTS]

48 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

It actually sounds like you mean courtesy to you.  You were inconvenienced by being slowed down and are annoyed by it.  If you cared about courtesy for others then you show courtesy to others. 

I get your point on why you are annoyed and I am far from perfect.   What I don't like about your example is the targeting of elderly people that operate with reduced cognitive functional skills.  

Or they may have fine cognitive skills but acting like debit cards and everything else have been around their entire lifetime is being obtuse. We're not there yet as a society, as surprising as it may be.

Also, don't get in line behind someone who is older if you want to avoid the chance that something might happen. It seems like one could easily avoid the problem by getting in a different line.

[...]

1 hour ago, LTS said:

Also, don't get in line behind someone who is older if you want to avoid the chance that something might happen. It seems like one could easily avoid the problem by getting in a different line.

Or smoking a big J before entering the store.

[Ogre]

10 minutes ago, ... said:

Or smoking a big J before entering the store.

It’s very possible that the people that are pisssing off @inkman by lagging in line have done that very thing!!

That’s why they call it dope.

[inkman]

1 hour ago, Ogre said:

It’s very possible that the people that are pisssing off @inkman by lagging in line have done that very thing!!

That’s why they call it dope.

It’s not often I’m at the store high as I don’t like driving stoned but it certainly quells my anxiety about lines…and just about everyone else. 😀

[Eleven]

5 hours ago, Doohickie said:

It doesn't take two car lengths to be able to pull around someone else.  If you can see the bottom of their bumper you have enough room.

It's the bottom of the next car's tires you want to see, not the bottom of the bumper.  That's just shy of two car lengths for me--my car is really small.

[Kr632]

9 hours ago, Eleven said:

I want two car lengths between me and the person in front of me, and more if it's a truck in front of me.  I want to see and I want to be able to get around them if they're an idiot.  It's not like it slows anything down.

Why does it take you two car lengths to maneuver? If I see someone doing that I take it as you're offering me a spot in front of you and I'll pull right in. Then stop so I can see their rear tires so I have plenty of space to move. 

It actually does slow things down if the lights are on a sensor. I sat at a few lights for ridiculous amounts of time because people stopped way too early. 

1 hour ago, Eleven said:

It's the bottom of the next car's tires you want to see, not the bottom of the bumper.  That's just shy of two car lengths for me--my car is really small.

It's about 6-8 feet from my bumper to their bumper so I can see their rear tires. Smart cars aren't even that small for it to be two car lengths. Smart cars are 8.8 feet long. So less than one of them. 

Edited August 10, 2023 by Kr632

[Kr632]

8 hours ago, Eleven said:

I think they just sense the first car, at the few intersections we have with sensors?  If I'm close to the front I'm usually closer to the car in front, though, anyway.  In my mind's eye, when I wrote my post, I was in a longer line of cars than that.

A lot of these people are the first in line. 

[Eleven]

25 minutes ago, Kr632 said:

Why does it take you two car lengths to maneuver? If I see someone doing that I take it as you're offering me a spot in front of you and I'll pull right in. Then stop so I can see their rear tires so I have plenty of space to move. 

It actually does slow things down if the lights are on a sensor. I sat at a few lights for ridiculous amounts of time because people stopped way too early. 

It's about 6-8 feet from my bumper to their bumper so I can see their rear tires. Smart cars aren't even that small for it to be two car lengths. 

I really don't care if you pull in.  If you're in a hurry or something or whatever, I don't know.  Do what you need to do.

The sensors are at the light (where we have them, as far as I know, Buffalo does not have many, but the suburbs might), not a few cars back.  If I'm in front, I pull up to the stop line.

It is about 25 feet for me to see the bottoms of the rear tires. (I note that I do keep my seat as low and as far back as I can--I'm not a tall guy, but I like my room). I just tested this because of this thread (and because what else is there to do, there is no hockey).  My car is a little over 14 feet long.

Edited August 10, 2023 by Eleven

[Kr632]

3 minutes ago, Eleven said:

I really don't care if you pull in.  If you're in a hurry or something or whatever, I don't know.  Do what you need to do.

The sensors are at the light, not a few cars back.  If I'm in front, I pull up to the stop line.

It is about 25 feet for me to see the bottoms of the rear tires. (I note that I do keep my seat as low and as far back as I can--I'm not a tall guy, but I like my room). I just tested this because of this thread (and because what else is there to do, there is no hockey).  My car is a little over 14 feet long.

I'm talking for the most part about the first car in line stopping far back. But theres a decent amount of intersections in the area that have multiple sensors, one just behind the white line and another farther back that doesnt go off unless there's a couple cars or after a long wait if there's one. I used to know almost all of them, I would pull up to the light then back up to the other sensor to get the light to change. Someone sitting far back at one of these would cause a delay. 

I Uber part time so I see these people multiple times a day. They definitely cause delays. I've found a lot of the people(not saying you just the people I've had experience with) that stop super early usually drive well under the speed limit and cause other issues, seems they don't trust their driving. They'll stop really hard to not get close to the car Infront of them that's still in process of slowing down and pulling up to the light and someone plows into the back of them because there's no reason for them to stop where they are the way they did. Yes the person should have paid better attention and theyre at fault but stopping very early is not something someone expects to happen when there's nothing in the road and would have been avoided if they stopped normally. 

[Eleven]

6 minutes ago, Kr632 said:

I'm talking for the most part about the first car in line stopping far back. But theres a decent amount of intersections in the area that have multiple sensors, one just behind the white line and another farther back that doesnt go off unless there's a couple cars or after a long wait if there's one. I used to know almost all of them, I would pull up to the light then back up to the other sensor to get the light to change. Someone sitting far back at one of these would cause a delay. 

I Uber part time so I see these people multiple times a day. They definitely cause delays. I've found a lot of the people(not saying you just the people I've had experience with) that stop super early usually drive well under the speed limit and cause other issues, seems they don't trust their driving. They'll stop really hard to not get close to the car Infront of them that's still in process of slowing down and pulling up to the light and someone plows into the back of them because there's no reason for them to stop where they are the way they did. Yes the person should have paid better attention and theyre at fault but stopping very early is not something someone expects to happen when there's nothing in the road and would have been avoided if they stopped normally. 

The first car has no need to do that and generally shouldn't.  I am 99% certain that the City of Buffalo does not have multiple sensors.  We can barely afford a single one, and that's not at most intersections.

I definitely do not drive under the speed limit.  I'm a 79 on the Thruway and a 40 on a city street.  I'm not proud, mind you, but I'm not slow, either.

I find that I'm more relaxed behind the wheel when I'm at a light if I give myself some distance to see the world and some room to let other drivers be idiots, though.  So that's what I do.

If you drive Uber, you've probably driven me!

Edited August 10, 2023 by Eleven

[Indabuff]

What about the ones that park their carts in the middle of an aisle with no room to pass by them with your own cart?  That really chaps my hide.  Goddam imbeciles.

[Eleven]

1 hour ago, Indabuff said:

What about the ones that park their carts in the middle of an aisle with no room to pass by them with your own cart?  That really chaps my hide.  Goddam imbeciles.

I just move their carts.

[Zamboni]

11 hours ago, Eleven said:

I just move their carts.

Yep, me too. Or I “glance” their cart with mine so I can get through. Makes a noise and it registers with most people after that. 
 

I personally don’t like any dogs in grocery stores except for working dogs/support dogs. I am pretty confident in saying that not every dog I see in a grocery store is a working dog/support dog. I am also sympathetic to not leaving your dog in a car that is too hot or too cold while you go shopping. And to that I say, shop for 10 minutes at the most and get what you need and get out, or take your dog home first and then go shopping. 

[mjd1001]

15 hours ago, Indabuff said:

What about the ones that park their carts in the middle of an aisle with no room to pass by them with your own cart?  That really chaps my hide.  Goddam imbeciles.

What I see a lot (usually, not but not all the time women), push their car right down the center of the aisle. Stop to look at something...Not enough room to pass them on the left, but with their cart in the middle, they keep on hand on the car and use the other hand to reach for and read the label on something on the right...completely oblivious of anyone else in the aisle or anyone else behind them as their cart and their body becomes a full roadblock.