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darksabre

Alex Nylander Watch

Nylander in 2018-19  

67 members have voted

  1. 1. How far does Nylander go this year?

    • Plateau season for the Amerks
      9
    • Better season for the Amerks
      6
    • Occasional call-up to the Sabres
      23
    • Significant ice time for the Sabres
      17
    • Other
      7


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As someone mentioned in another thread it was reported Nylander was in Buffalo working out hard just a few days ago. No mention of injury. He's just being held out? Very strange.

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Lots of speculation he's being held out of Developent camp pending a trade.

 

 

As someone mentioned in another thread it was reported Nylander was in Buffalo working out hard just a few days ago. No mention of injury. He's just being held out? Very strange.

 

I will warn against reading too much into this. It's development camp and lots of new faces since last year. The Sabres have had an entire year of watching Nylander since last years development camp, training camp and a full season (less injuries) in Roch. I suspect they know what they are looking at. Now that I've said that, he'll be baggage in a multi-player trade this weekend.

 

Nylander is a total enigma at this point. The could be on his last inch of rope, or he could be the unexpected breakout sensation rookie this coming season. I suspect if he doesn't provide compelling improvement in his game this year, it's back to the SHL for the 2019-20 season.

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Maybe. But do you think they are going to sit a former 8th overall pick to keep a closer eye on some of these camp invitees that have a near zero chance of being anything within the organization? I've just never seen them really do this before. Then again maybe there is a nagging injury of some kind. It's very strange.

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I personally think it's a will thing. Maybe he was all about being a a professional hockey player before Cal O'Reilly gave him hell, but maybe it soured him on the game and the team and he's just not enjoying it anymore. Add to that the natural struggles that come with growing pains and I can see why he just gave up. Everything I read about the guy makes it seem like an effort issue. Ever work somewhere you hated? Did you do your best work there?

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I expect he’s officially labeled a bust at the end of this season

You're aware the kid turned 20... If he was a 2nd or 3rd round pick we wouldn't be talking bust for another 2 years.

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You're aware the kid turned 20... If he was a 2nd or 3rd round pick we wouldn't be talking bust for another 2 years.

 

Right. But I never really liked this argument because it's all relative. He's an 8th overall pick, he should be showing signs. It's not good enough to find himself among the likes of a Baptiste or Bailey. He needs to be further along at this stage of his development due to value of the pick invested in his selection. If Jack Eichel failed to make the NHL his post draft year, hell, if he failed to crack 40 points, he'd have been getting lambasted. It's just the nature of where one is selected in the draft. This is his third post draft season, and he ISN'T a 2nd or 3rd round pick. In situations like this, I'll be more than happy to eat crow should it become apparent that it's necessary:

 

Stick a fork in him. 

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You're aware the kid turned 20... If he was a 2nd or 3rd round pick we wouldn't be talking bust for another 2 years.

 

I'm also aware that he has shown absolutely nothing as a pro.  No development, no spark, no flashes of brilliance.  He was a mistake as a first round pick.  Hey, it happens.  League wide the hit rate after the top few is around 50%.

 

2nd and 3rd round picks that don't make it aren't busts.  Only about 20% of them ever develop into NHLers.

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I personally think it's a will thing. Maybe he was all about being a a professional hockey player before Cal O'Reilly gave him hell, but maybe it soured him on the game and the team and he's just not enjoying it anymore. Add to that the natural struggles that come with growing pains and I can see why he just gave up. Everything I read about the guy makes it seem like an effort issue. Ever work somewhere you hated? Did you do your best work there?

Interesting thought just occurred to me. Moving ROR could benefit Nylander mentally. Obviously it should have zero sway on Botterill and his attempts to better the team. But if ROR is traded, you’d have to think it would help Nylander. If I was constantly badgered by some a-hole, I wouldn’t wanna go hang out with his brother for the rest of my playing days.

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I know people are down on Nylander, but how would we feel is he had spent the last two years in the OHL racking up 100 pts a season and like Pu was just starting his pro career? We’d all be thrilled to get a look at him. We’d have had threads on what to expect just like Mittelstud. Frankly it probably would have been best to leave him on the OHL instead of destroying his confidence in the AHL.

 

The point of this is we need to sit back and relax and let it play out. Remember we still haven’t written off Bailey and Baptiste and they are 22/23. Nylander is only 20.

Edited by GASabresIUFAN

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I know people are down on Nylander, but how would we feel is he had spent the last two years in the OHL racking up 100 pts a season and like Pu was just starting his pro career? We’d all be thrilled to get a look at him. We’d have had threads on what to expect just like Mittelstud. Frankly it probably would have been best to leave him on the OHL instead of destroying his confidence in the AHL.

 

The point of this is we need to sit back and relax and let it play out. Remember we still haven’t written off Bailey and Baptiste and they are 22/23. Nylander is only 20.

 

We?

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You wrote them off on their draft day.

 

LOL

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2nd and 3rd round picks that don't make it aren't busts.  Only about 20% of them ever develop into NHLers.

 

This is the same board where 6th and 7th round picks were called busts a day or two ago.  It's funny how those things work.

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I’m going to go on record and say Nylander will have a better career in the NHL then Yakupov, but it may not be with the Sabres. I envision him slowing getting better each year. My understanding is that his work ethic is excellent and he good hands and speed. The only real issue is the physical nature of the game.

 

My problem with how the team has developed him is that they threw a kid used to time and space into a league where he wasn’t phyiscally mature enough to handle the change to a lack of time and space. I think that begins to change this season. With the huge influx of prospects joining the Amerks this season (Pu, Oglevie, Hickey, Olofsson, Pilut, and Borgen), Nylander gets an opportunity to kind of start again with a fresh peer group. He also has the benefit of a second year with the same coaching staff and system.

 

I would not be surprised if he stays healthy that he score 60 pts if he stays in Roch for the season.

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I'm also aware that he has shown absolutely nothing as a pro. No development, no spark, no flashes of brilliance. He was a mistake as a first round pick. Hey, it happens. League wide the hit rate after the top few is around 50%.

 

2nd and 3rd round picks that don't make it aren't busts. Only about 20% of them ever develop into NHLers.

Right and only 50-56% of first rounders develop into NHLers. So what's the % needed to be classified a bust?

 

I don't think anybody but fans care when they were drafted to be honest. What GM would say "he's playing like a 20th pick and not an 8th, gotta ship him". What position any player is drafted should be irrelevant to their development.

Going to try to clarify a bit more. If we were trading for a dman. Virtually identical stats and size, let's say 2 very comparable players. One was drafted in the 1st, the other the 3rd. Would that matter as to which we would like to pick up? Of course once upon a time the expectations were greater and lesser respectively, and we would think one may have a higher ceiling, but they're values would still be the same no? If Nylander becomes a middle 6 guy ya we probably could have done better at 8, but where they are drafted has 0 to do with their development

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Right and only 50-56% of first rounders develop into NHLers. So what's the % needed to be classified a bust?

 

I don't think anybody but fans care when they were drafted to be honest. What GM would say "he's playing like a 20th pick and not an 8th, gotta ship him". What position any player is drafted should be irrelevant to their development.

Going to try to clarify a bit more. If we were trading for a dman. Virtually identical stats and size, let's say 2 very comparable players. One was drafted in the 1st, the other the 3rd. Would that matter as to which we would like to pick up? Of course once upon a time the expectations were greater and lesser respectively, and we would think one may have a higher ceiling, but they're values would still be the same no? If Nylander becomes a middle 6 guy ya we probably could have done better at 8, but where they are drafted has 0 to do with their development

 

It's about perception.

 

Look at Nylander and Mittlestadt.

 

Both offence-first players, born six months apart in 1998

Mittelstadt put up 30 points in 34 college games last year, 11 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

Nylander put up 27 points in 51 AHL games last year, 12 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

 

Pretty similar, yet a number of posters seem ready to write Alex off and expect big things from Casey in a middle-six centre slot.

 

The main reasons why:

1) we watched Casey light up the WJC under the spotlight in Buffalo

2) we hear that Nylander looks lost in Rochester.

3) Casey was picked one year later.

Edited by dudacek

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It's about perception.

 

Look at Nylander and Mittlestadt.

 

Both offence-first players, born six months apart in 1998

Mittelstadt put up 30 points in 34 college games last year, 11 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

Nylander put up 27 points in 51 AHL games last year, 12 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

 

Pretty similar, yet a number of posters seem ready to write Alex off and expect big things from Casey in a middle-six centre slot.

 

The main reasons why:

1) we watched Casey light up the WJC under the spotlight in Buffalo

2) we hear that Nylander looks lost in Rochester.

3) Casey was picked one year later.

Well that's a huge thing though. It's not like we only hear it from posters here, or only hear it from local media, but it's both of those AND he can't even get playing time on the Amerks. So everyone here, everyone in the media, and even the organization themselves have indicated he has looked extremely poor

 

Meanwhile, everyone and everything has been the exact opposite for Casey

Edited by WildCard

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It's about perception.

 

Look at Nylander and Mittlestadt.

 

Both offence-first players, born six months apart in 1998

Mittelstadt put up 30 points in 34 college games last year, 11 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

Nylander put up 27 points in 51 AHL games last year, 12 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

 

Pretty similar, yet a number of posters seem ready to write Alex off and expect big things from Casey in a middle-six centre slot.

 

The main reasons why:

1) we watched Casey light up the WJC under the spotlight in Buffalo

2) we hear that Nylander looks lost in Rochester.

3) Casey was picked one year later.

Nylander didn't score in 2016-17, it was 17-18. The same game as Casey actually.

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Nylander didn't score in 2016-17, it was 17-18. The same game as Casey actually.

 

Didn't mean to imply otherwise. Apologies if the syntax misled.

 

Well that's a huge thing though. It's not like we only hear it from posters here, or only hear it from local media, but it's both of those AND he can't even get playing time on the Amerks. So everyone here, everyone in the media, and even the organization themselves have indicated he has looked extremely poor

 

Meanwhile, everyone and everything has been the exact opposite for Casey

 

Exactly what I mean. Perception.

 

 

Everybody saw Casey light up the WJC but not his performance in college.

Everybody talks about Alex getting benched in the AHL playoffs but not about how he played down the stretch.

Edited by dudacek

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Didn't mean to imply otherwise. Apologies if the syntax misled.

 

 

Exactly what I mean. Perception.

Huh? I don't think it's perception I think it's objective observation

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It’s more then that. Jbot management has said Casey will be in the NHL next year, while Nylander looks slated to return to Roch. That is reality not perception. If Nylander was NHL ready, Jbot would say it, as he has with both Casey and Dahlin.

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It's about perception.

 

Look at Nylander and Mittlestadt.

 

Both offence-first players, born six months apart in 1998

Mittelstadt put up 30 points in 34 college games last year, 11 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

Nylander put up 27 points in 51 AHL games last year, 12 points in his post-draft WJC and one goal in a brief NHL experience.

 

Pretty similar, yet a number of posters seem ready to write Alex off and expect big things from Casey in a middle-six centre slot.

 

The main reasons why:

1) we watched Casey light up the WJC under the spotlight in Buffalo

2) we hear that Nylander looks lost in Rochester.

3) Casey was picked one year later.

Honestly I don't think the fact the WJC was held in Buffalo matters much.  Barley anyone even showed up for the games.

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Honestly I don't think the fact the WJC was held in Buffalo matters much.  Barley anyone even showed up for the games.

That's because Russ Brandon was charging 90$ to watch 19yr old kids play hockey which is absurd and I heard that from Buffalo people as well as quite a few foreign fans. 

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That's because Russ Brandon was charging 90$ to watch 19yr old kids play hockey which is absurd and I heard that from Buffalo people as well as quite a few foreign fans. 

Oh I know.  The pricing for that tournament was so dumb.  I was gonna head down to a game but not at some of those prices.

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I’m not trying to say Alex is as good as Casey,

 

I am trying to say there has been a narrative built around each player based on a limited picture.

 

With Alex it was the fact he was overmatched as an 18-year-old AHLer and benched in the playoffs last year.

With Casey it was a flashy development camp cemented by a great, high-profile WJC.

 

People tend to ignore the fact Casey’s numbers weren’t overwhelming in college, and that Alex had a pretty good second half coming off an injury in Rochester.

Their overall bodies of work aren’t that different, especially considering they are of an age.

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