Thorny Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 (edited) Apologies, I believe we are somewhat talking past eachother due to us both editing/adding on to previous posts of ours. I am specifically talking about points per game, the rate at which guys are scoring at. In that regard, Crosby is currently 5th ever. Obviously, Crosby's PPG could go down, if he doesn't continue scoring at his current pace, which has a good chance of happening with age. But the fact that at this time, after 10 seasons in the NHL, his scoring rate is 5th all time, with the way the game is now, is remarkable. And I agree, making comparisons across eras is exceedingly difficult. I do not think Crosby warrants a straight up comparison to The Great One and wouldn't claim such. I will say though that McDavid's career, in my opinion, both in numbers and effect on the game, will be much more likely to resemble that of Crosby's than Gretzky's. Edited October 2, 2015 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 (edited) TSN just posted the current preseason stats for Eichel and McDavid http://www.tsn.ca/follow-the-phenoms-mac-vs-jack-tracker-1.365439 Connor - 0g, 5a, 4games TOI 19:49 Jack - 2g, 3a, 3games TOI 17:48 Edited October 2, 2015 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rasmus_ Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Eichel across the board. McWho? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 I feel like sometimes people forget that Crosby is 5th ALL-TIME in points per game scoring. This, considering that scoring is so much lower nowadays, is nothing short of mind-boggling. You. I think I like you. As amazing as it is, I honestly believe Crosby has somehow become underrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 We shall see. Eichel said he weighed 215 coming into camp. He measured 6'3 at the combine. Connor McDavid is 2 inches shorter and weighs almost 25lbs less at 190lbs. That makes a big difference in the NHL, skating through checks, etc... McDavid won't be able to just skate by eveybody like he did against smaller competition in the OHL where you're playing aginst 16-20 year olds. Eichel was playing against men, div I college players avg 23 years old. It would've been interesting to see what kind of numbers Eichel would put in juniors and what McDavid's number would be like playing NCAA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Apologies, I believe we are somewhat talking past eachother due to us both editing/adding on to previous posts of ours. I am specifically talking about points per game, the rate at which guys are scoring at. In that regard, Crosby is currently 5th ever. Obviously, Crosby's PPG could go down, if he doesn't continue scoring at his current pace, which has a good chance of happening with age. But the fact that at this time, after 10 seasons in the NHL, his scoring rate is 5th all time, with the way the game is now, is remarkable. And I agree, making comparisons across eras is exceedingly difficult. I do not think Crosby warrants a straight up comparison to The Great One and wouldn't claim such. I will say though that McDavid's career, in my opinion, both in numbers and effect on the game, will be much more likely to resemble that of Crosby's than Gretzky's. Good post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 I really think the game as it is played today is better suited to Eichel, who has more body strength, perhaps a heavier shot, and the ability to play inside. But if this were 1992, I think McDavid would be the easy answer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted October 2, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 You. I think I like you. As amazing as it is, I honestly believe Crosby has somehow become underrated. He's no longer the shiny toy, but do you think McDavid isn't the better prospect? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 He's no longer the shiny toy, but do you think McDavid isn't the better prospect? I didn't follow prospects nearly enough back then (see: at all) to really make a fair assessment on that--it'd be like 98% hindsight and colored by my opinion of Crosby as a player. I knew about the hype of course and the whole "next Gretzky" thing, but I didn't really follow his career, if that makes sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 (edited) You. I think I like you. As amazing as it is, I honestly believe Crosby has somehow become underrated. I like you too, Blue. And I agree, Crosby has somehow become underrated. I really think the game as it is played today is better suited to Eichel, who has more body strength, perhaps a heavier shot, and the ability to play inside. But if this were 1992, I think McDavid would be the easy answer. Well said. He's no longer the shiny toy, but do you think McDavid isn't the better prospect? It really does seem like splitting hairs. I definitely don't see a significant spread between the two. If it does lean in McDavid's favor, my guess is it would be unlikely for that difference to be enough to offset the difference in how the game is being played today. If McDavid scores at the rate Crosby did, I'd call McDavid the better player. Crosby was often referred to as "The Next One" during his time as a prospect. He was drawing direct comparisons to Gretzky in the same way McDavid is. Completely different hype than that of players like Tavares, MacKinnon, and whoever else in the last 20 years. Edited October 2, 2015 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Formerly Allan in MD Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Much of what these guys do in their rookie seasons will be based on the quality of their teams, linemates and coaching. Come back in a few years to this topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musichunch Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 Sidney Crosby, right now, is a top 5 all-time scorer. What if he played during the days when there were so many more goals being scored? Crosby is a great player, no doubt. 1st ballot HOFer even with so few games. But even with a high PPG, he's not a Gretzky, Lemieux, or Orr. In fact, if we are talking best ever primes, he's for sure behind: Gretzky, Lemieux, Orr, Bobby Hull, Hasek He's somewhere in the bunch with: Lafleur, Beliveau, Richard, Bossy, Trottier, Bourque, Potvin, Lidstrom, Howe, Jagr, Forsberg, Esposito, Robinson, etc. He's in that mix with the top 10-30 greatest players ever. The difference between him and McDavid is that I think McDavid has the talent to break that top 10. Eichel's ceiling is to join that top 10-30. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 We should probably wait until we see what they both do in the NHL before we start talking about how great they will become. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
musichunch Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 We should probably wait until we see what they both do in the NHL before we start talking about how great they will become. I don't see a problem with speculating. If the expectations are too high, reality will kick in sooner or later. No need to moderate ourselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 The average age of college hockey freshman is 20 years old. http://www.boston.com/sports/articles/2008/03/02/college_hockey_undergoes_a_freshman_reorientation/?page=full... Division 1 college hockey, where the average age of a freshman is 19.8. What that means at the other end is unsettling to some coaches. "Last year we played a team that had two 26-year-old [seniors]," said Parker, in his 35th season as BU's coach. "I'm not saying it's not fair, but it might be dangerous." For the 18-year-olds, that is, which is why Parker and York have reassessed the way they recruit. Cognizant that so many teams are skating 20- and 21-year-old freshmen and thus have an abundance of 23-, 24-, 25-, and even 26-year-olds in the lineup, York - in his 36th year of coaching and 14th at BC - and Parker have to be convinced a true-age freshman is not going to be overmatched physically. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted October 2, 2015 Report Share Posted October 2, 2015 I think 102 is possible for McDavid. Regardless Gretzky tied for the Art Ross his rookie year so I don't need McDavid to break 100 right away. Looking at the career arc of the all time greats, I expect a top 5 finish this year and domination starting his 2nd or 3rd year. That's if he's going to be a top 10 all time type player, a level above Crosby. I was thinking the same, hall had 81 points last year, putting him with a #1 center will make them both reach 100. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 I was thinking the same, hall had 81 points last year, putting him with a #1 center will make them both reach 100. Hall did not have 81 points last year. He had 38 in 53 games. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JujuFish Posted October 3, 2015 Report Share Posted October 3, 2015 Hall did not have 81 points last year. He had 38 in 53 games. He did have 80 in 75 games the year before, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 He did have 80 in 75 games the year before, though. Didn't see that. Fair enough, although he did score at a much slower pace last year. McDavid will certainly help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 Well, it's only preseason so it doesn't mean much, but McDavid and Eichel's final preseason stats: McDavid 5 GP, 0 Goals, 5 Assists, 5 Points, +1 Eichel 4 GP, 2 Goals, 4 Assists, 6 Points, +3 Also, for reference: Reinhart 5 GP, 0 Goals, 5 Assists, 5 Points, -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted October 4, 2015 Report Share Posted October 4, 2015 That settles it. Eichel is better than McDavid, who is only a touch better than Rheinhardt. Close the thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted October 12, 2015 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 2-0 Eichel so far. Just sayin' ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted October 12, 2015 Report Share Posted October 12, 2015 I said it before the draft, by getting the second pick the Sabres effectively won the draft because they weren't pressured into drafting McDavid. In my heart I know the Oliers are going to regret how this draft played out for many years. The Oilers drafted a quality player, just not the player they needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 I said it before the draft, by getting the second pick the Sabres effectively won the draft because they weren't pressured into drafting McDavid. In my heart I know the Oliers are going to regret how this draft played out for many years. The Oilers drafted a quality player, just not the player they needed. I agree. I think McDavid is going to be a great player. He just wasn't the player Edmonton needed. So far Jack's physical ability has been helping him create opportunities. He is going to be scary good when he starts processing the game at NHL speeds and learns a little more about positioning. I like the progress I have seen in 3 games from Jack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
North Buffalo Posted October 13, 2015 Report Share Posted October 13, 2015 Jack is sure lookin good. Will only get better as he gets a feel for the pro game. The speed of him and Kane are something else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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