The Ryan O'Reilly super thread 2015!!!

[Bob Malooga]

I've been super prO'Reilly (see what I did there?), but I would be pissed if Bogosian was in a deal. Bogosian, Risto, Reinhart and Eichel are my four untouchables in the deal.

I'm pretty sure it's safe to say that GMTM gave up a bounty of assets for Evander Kane, and had to take Bogosian back to equal things out.

 

If Bogosian is an "untouchable," there is absolutely zero doubt that Kane should/would be too.

 

 

(Eichel, Reinhart, Kane, Girgensons, Bogosian, Ristolainen, Zadorov...that would be my 7-player core moving forward.)

[Drunkard]

Can you name a player who would be cheap to acquire, yet deserve a big contract? Or vice versa? Sorry, but high trade value and high monetary value tend to go hand in hand.

Free agents don't cost anything other than big contracts and O'Reilly set himself up to get to UFA status the first year he was eligible to and I highly doubt that was an accident. I doubt he extends with anyone who trades for him unless he gets severely overpaid though.

 

Evander Kane and Zach Bogosian both cost us a lot in assets but they are both on pretty reasonable contracts.

[Bob Malooga]

Of course Ryan O'Reilly is a core guy. He's Ryan Freaking O'Reilly! He's like the love-child of Chuck Norris and Teddy Bruschi and even more awesome (and responsible defensively). He can do no wrong and we must acquire him at any cost even if it means trading half our team away and paying him so much that we watch Eichel, Reinhart, and Ristolainen walk in free agency. The guy can stick check the devil himself, and he can divide by zero. I wish he was my Dad, even though I'm like 10 years older than the guy, I'm sure he can travel through time to make it possible.

Let's hear ONE example of when a team trading for a quality player prevented them from keeping their 3 best players?

 

Did getting Gaborik make the Kings lose Doughty, Kopitar and Quick?

 

How about the Blackhawks getting Hossa, did Toews, Keith and Kane leave, or did it prevent the Blackhawks from extending their contracts?

 

The point of stockpiling assets is to be able to supplement your "star" players through trades, or to acquire a "star" player, or someone close to being one.

 

Getting Ryan O'Reilly has ZERO effect on what happens with Jack Eichel, Sam Reinhart and Rasmus Ristolainen YEARS down the road.

Edited June 17, 2015 by Bob Malooga

[WildCard]

Let's hear ONE example of when a team trading for a quality player prevented them from keeping their 3 best players?

 

Did getting Gaborik make the Kings lose Doughty, Kopitar and Quick?

 

How about the Blackhawks getting Hossa, did Toews, Keith and Kane leave, or did it prevent the Blackhawks from extending their contracts?

 

The point of stockpiling assets is to be able to supplement your "star" players through trades, or to acquire a "star" player, or someone close to being one.

 

Getting Ryan O'Reilly has ZERO effect on what happens with Jack Eichel, Sam Reinhart and Rasmus Ristolainen YEARS down the road.

Well first off we're nowhere near where those teams were/are in terms of being able to compete for a Cup in the next two years. You're right on the point of stockpiling assets, but pulling the trigger now when we're not ready to make that move could be detrimental; depending of course on who/how much we give up.

 

Secondly, O'Reilly has a huge impact on what happens down the road for those players regarding his contract/cap space, as noted by a few different posters. 

[Drunkard]

Let's hear ONE example of when a team trading for a quality player prevented them from keeping their 3 best players?

 

Did getting Gaborik make the Kings lose Doughty, Kopitar and Quick?

 

How about the Blackhawks getting Hossa, did Toews, Keith and Kane leave, or did it prevent the Blackhawks from extending their contracts?

 

The point of stockpiling assets is to be able to supplement your "star" players through trades, or to acquire a "star" player, or someone close to being one.

 

Getting Ryan O'Reilly has ZERO effect on what happens with Jack Eichel, Sam Reinhart and Rasmus Ristolainen YEARS down the road.

Ok fine. So we'll lose some combination of Zadorov, Girgensens, Bogosian, Kane, and Ennis instead so we can pay Ryan O'Reilly top line center money to either play on the wing or to play 3rd line center. Edited June 17, 2015 by Drunkard

[Hoss]

I'm pretty sure it's safe to say that GMTM gave up a bounty of assets for Evander Kane, and had to take Bogosian back to equal things out.

 

If Bogosian is an "untouchable," there is absolutely zero doubt that Kane should/would be too.

 

 

(Eichel, Reinhart, Kane, Girgensons, Bogosian, Ristolainen, Zadorov...that would be my 7-player core moving forward.)

I forgot to include Kane. I don't look at Zadorov as an untouchable.

I also disagree that Bogosian was just a throw in to even things out.

[Bob Malooga]

Well first off we're nowhere near where those teams were/are in terms of being able to compete for a Cup in the next two years. You're right on the point of stockpiling assets, but pulling the trigger now when we're not ready to make that move could be detrimental; depending of course on who/how much we give up.

 

Secondly, O'Reilly has a huge impact on what happens down the road for those players regarding his contract/cap space, as noted by a few different posters.

 I understand we are not near a cup, I was strictly talking about managing the cap. All these other teams found a way to do it, and with having most of our best players (or soon to be) on cheaper contracts, there's no reason a $7M contract cannot fit in there. Either way if you are going to add one of these kinds of players, whether it be O'Reilly, Toffoli, Saad, Tarasenko, Oshie, Sharp, Williams or whomever, you're going to be paying them big kinds of money, for a decent amount of term. If it is O'Reilly that Murray sees fit to fill that role of a top-6 forward, then there is no reason why he cannot find a way to manage the cap and keep the core in place, for the long-term, especially with the cap going up every year. Some of the older players will be coming off the cap within time as well. The Sabres cap situation is very good, and should cause no kinds of complications in the next 7-10 years.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/buffalo-sabres/

 

Ok fine. So we'll lose some combination of Zadorov, Girgensens, Bogosian, Kane, and Ennis instead so we can pay Ryan O'Reilly top line center money to either play on the wing or to play 3rd line center.

 I see no reason why we would have to lose any of them either. Bogosian is tied up through 2019 on a friendly deal, as is Kane and Ennis through 2018. Girgensons is up in 2016 and could see a $2M raise, while Zadorov would see one in 2017. I still see no problem here, at all.

 

There is nothing to suggest that Ryan O'Reilly CANNOT play on the wing, in a 2nd line role. He has done it before, and succeeded.

 

I forgot to include Kane. I don't look at Zadorov as an untouchable.

I also disagree that Bogosian was just a throw in to even things out.

Not saying Zadorov is untouchable, but that I would like to see him as part of our core moving forward. Kane is untouchable.

 

As for Bogosian, I didn't quite explain that very well. I do not think he was just a "throw-in" in terms of being something that had no value, like Jason Kasdorf, but that there was another player that needed to be included and Murray landed on him, for numerous reasons. My point was more so based around the idea that Evander Kane was the big player in that trade, and if Bogosian is "untouchable," then Kane should be too. ;)

Edited June 17, 2015 by Bob Malooga

[Drunkard]

I understand we are not near a cup, I was strictly talking about managing the cap. All these other teams found a way to do it, and with having most of our best players (or soon to be) on cheaper contracts, there's no reason a $7M contract cannot fit in there. Either way if you are going to add one of these kinds of players, whether it be O'Reilly, Toffoli, Saad, Tarasenko, Oshie, Sharp, Williams or whomever, you're going to be paying them big kinds of money, for a decent amount of term. If it is O'Reilly that Murray sees fit to fill that role of a top-6 forward, then there is no reason why he cannot find a way to manage the cap and keep the core in place, for the long-term, especially with the cap going up every year. Some of the older players will be coming off the cap within time as well. The Sabres cap situation is very good, and should cause no kinds of complications in the next 7-10 years.

 

http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/buffalo-sabres/

 

I see no reason why we would have to lose any of them either. Bogosian is tied up through 2019 on a friendly deal, as is Kane and Ennis through 2018. Girgensons is up in 2016 and could see a $2M raise, while Zadorov would see one in 2017. I still see no problem here, at all.

 

There is nothing to suggest that Ryan O'Reilly CANNOT play on the wing, in a 2nd line role. He has done it before, and succeeded.

 

Not saying Zadorov is untouchable, but that I would like to see him as part of our core moving forward. Kane is untouchable.

 

As for Bogosian, I didn't quite explain that very well. I do not think he was just a "throw-in" in terms of being something that had no value, like Jason Kasdorf, but that there was another player that needed to be included and Murray landed on him, for numerous reasons. My point was more so based around the idea that Evander Kane was the big player in that trade, and if Bogosian is "untouchable," then Kane should be too. ;)

I think the liklihood that O'Reilly signs a long term contract for a $7 million cap hit is extremely remote at best. The guy is already making $6 million and he's one season away from becoming a top free agent at the age of 25. To convince him to forego free angency I think you're talking $8 or $9 million per year minimum and likely even more than that or else he can just wait the year out and get at least that much from whoever is the highest bidder next summer. There's always at least one team willing to overpay big time and all it takes is one. His style of play should keep his injury risk low as well.

 

Paying $8 or $9 million for a top 6 winger will definitely cause us cap issues down the road. There's a reason the Avalanche aren't willing to do it and that's because they'd rather earmark that money to pay guys like Landeskog, Duchene, and MacKinnon. I'd rather earmark our truly big cap hits for Eichel, Reinhart, and Ristolainen, leaving plenty of cap room for reasonable contracts of other good players like the other guys being mentioned (Kane, Bogosian, Girgensons, Ennis, Zadorov, etc.)

[LGR4GM]

 I see no reason why we would have to lose any of them either. Bogosian is tied up through 2019 on a friendly deal, as is Kane and Ennis through 2018. Girgensons is up in 2016 and could see a $2M raise, while Zadorov would see one in 2017. I still see no problem here, at all.

 

You think the best 2way forward is going to go from 1.36mil to merely 3.36mil?  I am doubtful of such a thing. Zemgus' next contract will be higher IMO. 

[Huckleberry]

I think he doesn't want to lose any of our top prospects, like Grigo or Zad.  Especially Grigo.

 

Well yeah, things people are willing to give up for this guy, I would be somewhat down with it, but not at 7.5 mill a year.

And to be honest, i know im to much of a grigo fanboy, but ffs if i want any kid to make it its him, and i think he would bleed blue and gold if he does.

Edited June 18, 2015 by Heimdall

[MattPie]

To sum up my thoughts:

• Ryan O'Reilly is a great player, and will expect to be paid that way.
• If you trade for him now, you're betting on a few things:

1. You'll be able to resign him otherwise he's a one-year "rental"
2. You'll be able to sign him for significantly less money than he'll get in UFA next year
3. Maybe the extra contract his own team can offer year matters to him

It's a gut feeling, but I don't see him doing of those. Maybe he'd get to Buffalo and love it and decide that the future is bright here, but so far money seems to be his driving motivation. The extra contract year may help, but it also may be a negative. I could see him taking a "short" contract of 3-4 years so he can sign an even larger contract at 29. Take a run at him when he's UFA next year, don't waste assets now.

 

As for teams screwed by big contracts, wasn't Tampa Bay hosed a bunch of year ago because they 4 guys on huge contracts and no significant money to fill the roster (Lecavillier, St. Louis, Boyle, and ???). With the cap, you can't pay everyone in you top-6 first line money. It just doesn't work.

Edited June 18, 2015 by MattPie

[Hoss]

Why would a team trading for him be betting that they can sign him at significantly less money than he can get as a UFA?

 

Also, I wonder what type of term O'Reilly will be looking for. Is he going to want to take the full 7/8 years and take his next contract at 32/33? Or will he go 4 years and get his next contract at 28/29?

Edited June 18, 2015 by Hoss

[Bob Malooga]

I think the liklihood that O'Reilly signs a long term contract for a $7 million cap hit is extremely remote at best. The guy is already making $6 million and he's one season away from becoming a top free agent at the age of 25. To convince him to forego free angency I think you're talking $8 or $9 million per year minimum and likely even more than that or else he can just wait the year out and get at least that much from whoever is the highest bidder next summer. There's always at least one team willing to overpay big time and all it takes is one. His style of play should keep his injury risk low as well.

 

Paying $8 or $9 million for a top 6 winger will definitely cause us cap issues down the road. There's a reason the Avalanche aren't willing to do it and that's because they'd rather earmark that money to pay guys like Landeskog, Duchene, and MacKinnon. I'd rather earmark our truly big cap hits for Eichel, Reinhart, and Ristolainen, leaving plenty of cap room for reasonable contracts of other good players like the other guys being mentioned (Kane, Bogosian, Girgensons, Ennis, Zadorov, etc.)

 Just going off the numbers I have seen throw around by people who actually know...they say $7-7.5.

 

You think the best 2way forward is going to go from 1.36mil to merely 3.36mil?  I am doubtful of such a thing. Zemgus' next contract will be higher IMO.

On a bridge contract, compared to other similar players around the league? Yes. Maybe a $3M increase.

[Drunkard]

 Just going off the numbers I have seen throw around by people who actually know...they say $7-7.5.

 

On a bridge contract, compared to other similar players around the league? Yes. Maybe a $3M increase.

 

I guess we'll see eventually, but I highly doubt it. Who are these people who actually know that you're speaking of, because my guess would be that if O'Reilly was willing to sign a long term deal for $7 or $7.5 million then the Avalanche would just resign him themselves and never would have signed him to that last 2 year contract that let's him reach UFA status at 25 which is as soon as he possibly could have.

[dudacek]

Ryan O'Reilly as done everything in his power to set himself up for UFA status as early as possible.

Unless he already has a short list of destinations that includes your team, that's a pretty hard thing for a GM to ignore.

[LGR4GM]

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun  10s11 seconds ago

Avs GM Joe Sakic said he's had talks with Ryan O'Reilly's agents at Newport. Hopes to get a deal done before the season...

[MattPie]

To sum up my thoughts:

• Ryan O'Reilly is a great player, and will expect to be paid that way.
• If you trade for him now, you're betting on a few things:

1. You'll be able to resign him otherwise he's a one-year "rental"
2. You'll be able to sign him for significantly less money than he'll get in UFA next year
3. Maybe the extra contract his own team can offer year matters to him

It's a gut feeling, but I don't see him doing of those. Maybe he'd get to Buffalo and love it and decide that the future is bright here, but so far money seems to be his driving motivation. The extra contract year may help, but it also may be a negative. I could see him taking a "short" contract of 3-4 years so he can sign an even larger contract at 29. Take a run at him when he's UFA next year, don't waste assets now.

 

As for teams screwed by big contracts, wasn't Tampa Bay hosed a bunch of year ago because they 4 guys on huge contracts and no significant money to fill the roster (Lecavillier, St. Louis, Boyle, and ???). With the cap, you can't pay everyone in you top-6 first line money. It just doesn't work.

 

 

Why would a team trading for him be betting that they can sign him at significantly less money than he can get as a UFA?

 

Also, I wonder what type of term O'Reilly will be looking for. Is he going to want to take the full 7/8 years and take his next contract at 32/33? Or will he go 4 years and get his next contract at 28/29?

 

Thanks for summing up my post! :)

[inkman]

 

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun  10s11 seconds ago

Avs GM Joe Sakic said he's had talks with Ryan O'Reilly's agents at Newport. Hopes to get a deal done before the season...

 

I hope so this thread is nauseating

[beerme1]

I hope so this thread is nauseating

 

 

And then add in the O O O O'Reilly's auto parts commercial song as background whenever you open this thread lol 

[X. Benedict]

I hope so this thread is nauseating

I slept with Ryan O'Reilly and he, well, just kind of layed there. 

 

All kidding aside, he's become this years Paul Stasny. 

[WildCard]

I slept with Ryan O'Reilly and he, well, just kind of layed there.

 

All kidding aside, he's become this years Paul Stasny.

Given all this talk about his two-way game I'm assuming there was a third in this shindig? Was it TrueBlue?

Pierre LeBrun ‏@Real_ESPNLeBrun 10s11 seconds ago

Avs GM Joe Sakic said he's had talks with Ryan O'Reilly's agents at Newport. Hopes to get a deal done before the season...

Soooo....Toffoli/Saad anyone? Or Tarasenko?

And then add in the O O O O'Reilly's auto parts commercial song as background whenever you open this thread lol

I laughed :D

[Bob Malooga]

Yeah, I've given up on this idea. They want a top d-man, and we don't have that to give up, and it's not Zadorov or Pysyk, IMO.

 

There's just no way Zadorov, Grigorenko, pick #21 and even pick #31 would be enough.

 

I've been talking to a couple Avs fans, and they say Roy wants O'Reilly as his top line center with Landeskog and MacKinnon. Duchene would be the second line center, and the focus would then turn to finding him a running mate on the wing for the 2nd line.

 

I saw an article that said $7M/year for 8 years...but they think they will give in and pay him $8M for 7-8 years.

 

Time to turn our attention elsewhere. It's not what it would cost to re-sign him, but what it'll cost to get the opportunity to do so.

[Hoss]

DaveDavisHockey: Ryan O'Reilly's 1.94 5-on-5 points-per-60 minutes last season was better than Ovechkin, Kopitar, Sharp, Hall, Nugent-Hopkins & H.Sedin.

[TrueBlueGED]

DaveDavisHockey: Ryan O'Reilly's 1.94 5-on-5 points-per-60 minutes last season was better than Ovechkin, Kopitar, Sharp, Hall, Nugent-Hopkins & H.Sedin.

No 1st line players in that list :angel:

[LGR4GM]

No 1st line players in that list :angel:

Then he is worth what a 1st line player would get in a trade.  That has been this entire argument.  If he is X then you have to pay for X.  No more of these 21st and Pysyk trade ideas. We are talking Rasmus, Zemgus, 21st and something.  To me that isn't worth it.