Trettioåtta Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p><br /> <br /> </p> The army pays for the pilot's schooling and the pilot gives xx number of months of their lives to the Army. Some get lucky and go to Hawaii, others go to Ft Campbell and spend 42 out of 60 months away from their family. Where you end up is more often than not the luck of the draw, but one thing a pilot cannot do is say "I Quit", and take their services elsewhere. Thats called desertion, and the army takes pretty seriously. In the analogy i am not saying the pilot decides to not just turn up one day, but rather, that he uses a loop hole to get through the contract - thus he invalidates the contract, rather than simply deserting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> <br />In the analogy i am not saying the pilot decides to not just turn up one day, but rather, that he uses a loop hole to get through the contract - thus he invalidates the contract, rather than simply deserting<br /> <br /><br /> </p> I understand your anagoly. The Army is a bad example to use because there are no loopholes in the contract. Besides, the kid never signed a contract with the Ducks, he's a free agent because he DIDN'T sign a contract. My own useless opinion is the kid decided he would be happier living/playing/developing in Madison, Wisconsin then he would be in Anaheim (Or farm team). Instead of taking the financial security he decided to stay put and see what happened. He took a risk, if he ended up getting a career ending injury he'd have been screwed. I think what he did took huge balls and it worked out for him. Good for him I say. He owes the Ducks and their fans absolutely nothing. It could be argued the the league owes the Ducks a compensatory pick, but thats not the players problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p><br /> <br /> </p> I understand your anagoly. The Army is a bad example to use because there are no loopholes in the contract. Besides, the kid never signed a contract with the Ducks, he's a free agent because he DIDN'T sign a contract. My own useless opinion is the kid decided he would be happier living/playing/developing in Madison, Wisconsin then he would be in Anaheim (Or farm team). Instead of taking the financial security he decided to stay put and see what happened. He took a risk, if he ended up getting a career ending injury he'd have been screwed. I think what he did took huge balls and it worked out for him. Good for him I say. He owes the Ducks and their fans absolutely nothing. It could be argued the the league owes the Ducks a compensatory pick, but thats not the players problem. I'm not even sure the league owes the Ducks anything. What if Grigs goes to the K? Did he screw over the Sabres? Does the league owe the Sabres another pick? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> <br />I'm not even sure the league owes the Ducks anything. What if Grigs goes to the K? Did he screw over the Sabres? Does the league owe the Sabres another pick?<br /> <br /><br /> </p> Probably not. I think there should be compensatory picks awarded in certain situations though. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> <br /><p><br /><br /> <br /><br /> </p><br /> <br /> Probably not. I think there should be compensatory picks awarded in certain situations though. Just my opinion.<br /> <br /> Why do I have all that extra crap in my post when I quote someone??? <br /> </p> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 So if the Sabres drafted Shultz and he did the same thing, everyone would be cool with it? Because it's allowed? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 lol 0 views, but 22 replies... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> So if the Sabres drafted Shultz and he did the same thing, everyone would be cool with it? Because it's allowed? Speaking for myself, yes, but it would suck. Why do fans feel players "owe" them anything? I've never understood that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trettioåtta Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p><br /> <br /> </p> Speaking for myself, yes, but it would suck. Why do fans feel players "owe" them anything? I've never understood that. Do you feel you owe your company/boss professionalism? It is the same, the fans, by proxy, may for the players salaries, they are icons of their societies and so do owe the fans if they are professional Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campy Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 Saw a piece on that Justin Schultz last night. Anyone interested in seeing the Sabres take a run at him? Not often a talented 22 year old hits the free agent market. I like the idea. If Bob McKenzie can be believed, the Sabres won't be in the running. He's reporting Schultz narrowed down the list of teams he'll sign with to 'Nucks, Oilers, NYR, Leafs, and Sens. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 So if the Sabres drafted Shultz and he did the same thing, everyone would be cool with it? Because it's allowed? I think everyone would be pissed at Darcy because he didn't land him. That's what people wouldn't be cool with. Anaheim had 4 years to sign the kid to a contract. George Bush was president when this kid got drafted. I can't blame him. Why sign with Anaheim and risk getting sent to the AHL on 2-way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I don't know if they tried to sign him earlier; but I would think by the end of the 3rd year in college they should have some clue if they want to sign the kid and should be working on it by then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> <br />the fans, by proxy, pay for the players salaries, they are icons of their societies and so do owe the fans if they are professional<br /> <br /><br /> </p> I respect you opinion, I just dont agree with it. My veiw is, after the bills are paid I have xx amout of disposable income per month for entertainment. I spend part of that money on 20-25 Predator games and 5-6 games in St Loius per season. I do it because that is the form of entertainment I choose. Thats it. They owe me nothing beyond entertainment on that given night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I think everyone would be pissed at Darcy because he didn't land him. That's what people wouldn't be cool with. I'm certain of that as well. People are pissed he didn't turn the draft picks into Bobby Ryan. :wacko: Anaheim had 4 years to sign the kid to a contract. George Bush was president when this kid got drafted. I can't blame him. Why sign with Anaheim and risk getting sent to the AHL on 2-way. Teams normally take 2-3 years to sign their picks, minus top tier guys, correct? (I'm just guessing) What's to say when year 3 rolled around Justin studied up on the CBA, which I'm sure his agent did, and said wait a second, I can get over here. It's allowed but I think it's dirty pool. Maybe it's just who I am. I've been with the same company 13 years and feel like I do owe them something as they have been good to me and help provide for me and mine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopefulFuture Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 Ah i see thanks for clearing that up. I think that he should have requested a trade rather than refuse to sign (maybe he did though?) especially as they did trade a young defenceman, that would have been an opportune time for Ducks management to get rid of him had he requested to move. It is more out of courtesy, the organisation put money, time and assets into him, so he should thank them for this and either return the favour by signing him or request a trade. If, however, he did request a trade and the ducks refused then i don't have a problem with this. However, why had the ducks not signed him to an entry level contract prior to now? If he has refused in the past then that would have suggested he didnt't want to sign, or can you only sign a contract once you have left university/college? There are others more versed in the specifics on NHL contract knowledge than I. I'm sure they can give you the specifics. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 <p> <br />I'm certain of that as well. People are pissed he didn't turn the draft picks into Bobby Ryan. <br /> <img src='http://forums.sabrespace.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wacko.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':wacko:' /><br /> <br /> Teams normally take 2-3 years to sign their picks, minus top tier guys, correct? (I'm just guessing) What's to say when year 3 rolled around Justin studied up on the CBA, which I'm sure his agent did, and said wait a second, I can get over here. It's allowed but I think it's dirty pool. Maybe it's just who I am. I've been with the same company 13 years and feel like I do owe them something as they have been good to me and help provide for me and mine.<br /> <br /><br /> </p> I have no idea what you do, but whatever it is if you make 100K and another company down the street offers you the same job for 150K you dont take it? You sacrifice 50K a year for your family out of loyalty to the company? No judgement if you do, thats cool, but you would definately be in the minority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trettioåtta Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I have no idea what you do, but whatever it is if you make 100K and another company down the street offers you the same job for 150K you dont take it? You sacrifice 50K a year for your family out of loyalty to the company? No judgement if you do, thats cool, but you would definately be in the minority. Firstly, we are presuming it is money - he has an upper limit to what he can earn, so it probably isnt (i imagine Anaheim would rather pay him $3million a year than lose him?) Secondly, i don't think you can compare a normal job to sport, as like i said, businesses are designed so that most people in the company are replaceable fairly easily, whereas hockey is not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 Saw a piece on that Justin Schultz last night. Anyone interested in seeing the Sabres take a run at him? Not often a talented 22 year old hits the free agent market. I like the idea. I would love Schultz but to me the bigger question is why hasn't "hockey heavan" been embraced yet. In my opinion, it is a failure of the organization that a rabid hockey community within driving distance to Canada is still not considered a potential landing spot for a player like this. I have read a ton about him and not once was Buffalo listed as a potential landing spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I would love Schultz but to me the bigger question is why hasn't "hockey heavan" been embraced yet. In my opinion, it is a failure of the organization that a rabid hockey community within driving distance to Canada is still not considered a potential landing spot for a player like this. I have read a ton about him and not once was Buffalo listed as a potential landing spot. Two reasons off the top of my head would be taxes and lack of a night life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etiennep99 Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 1. The kid is a free agent. He can do as he pleases. He doesn't owe Anaheim anything. To say that he does would impy that Anaheim was giving him benefits which is clearly a violation of NCAA rules. 2. There are no guarantees in life. He has a right to try to maximize his limited opportunities. But, if it reaches the Eric Lindros level of saga, then I'd be turned off. 3. I think that Buffalo should pursue whatever/whomever it can to increase its talent level. And heck, Buffalo is almost a Canadien city anyhow. 4. I wonder if Darcy is afraid to pursue him because it might upset Anaheim, and then any Bobby Ryan trade would be scuttled. I would hope that their GM wouldn't hold a grudge because it was outside of his power to sign the kid. Still, it might not look so nice. Unless, of course, we agreed to sign him, and then trade Schultz to Anaheim for Ryan. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RazielSabre Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I'm certain of that as well. People are pissed he didn't turn the draft picks into Bobby Ryan. :wacko: Teams normally take 2-3 years to sign their picks, minus top tier guys, correct? (I'm just guessing) What's to say when year 3 rolled around Justin studied up on the CBA, which I'm sure his agent did, and said wait a second, I can get over here. It's allowed but I think it's dirty pool. Maybe it's just who I am. I've been with the same company 13 years and feel like I do owe them something as they have been good to me and help provide for me and mine. I'm with you on this one, Schultz has done a Lindros. One of the few players I don't wish the best for. When you get the chance to achieve your dream you play for any damn team, especially one with a legend like Selanne on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 There are others more versed in the specifics on NHL contract knowledge than I. I'm sure they can give you the specifics. The answer to his first paragraph would be nobody has a freaking clue. The answer to the second question would be many players sign contracts while in college, they can either leave college and once their past nine games their contract kicks in. If they stay in college they have until after they graduate or leave. Depending on age they may or may not qualify to be UFA's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 The answer to his first paragraph would be nobody has a freaking clue. The answer to the second question would be many players sign contracts while in college, they can either leave college and once their past nine games their contract kicks in. If they stay in college they have until after they graduate or leave. Depending on age they may or may not qualify to be UFA's. Are you sure about college kids and contracts? I thought once a contract was signed, college eligibilty was over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HopefulFuture Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 I would love Schultz but to me the bigger question is why hasn't "hockey heavan" been embraced yet. In my opinion, it is a failure of the organization that a rabid hockey community within driving distance to Canada is still not considered a potential landing spot for a player like this. I have read a ton about him and not once was Buffalo listed as a potential landing spot. It will take more than 18 months or so to change the culture that existed here. The "Hockey Heaven" phrase was describing a desirable destination, to change the perception to that will take a decade or so I would assume. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted June 28, 2012 Report Share Posted June 28, 2012 It will take more than 18 months or so to change the culture that existed here. The "Hockey Heaven" phrase was describing a desirable destination, to change the perception to that will take a decade or so I would assume. Nothing takes that long anymore, except maybe building a new Peace Bridge...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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