IKnowPhysics Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 For those of you that believe in the power/interesting nature of statistics, I happened across the player usage charts for this year (note: not ice time charts). I think they illustrate some interesting characteristics of all the teams, and there's some interesting findings about player performances as well. For example, Gragnani posted 15 points on the season and Regeher only posted 5. Want statistical reasoning why Regehr's the better defender? Take a look. The analysis included is refreshingly objective. Available in PDF here: http://www.hockeyabstract.com/testimonials/playerusagecharts2011-12/Player%20Usage%20Charts%202011-12.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 That was pretty interesting. I liked the breakdowns and explanations. made it easier for a non-stats oriented guy like myself to get into it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 Thank you for posting this. Since it is rather detailed I did not read all of it, but did read the whole bit about the Sabres. It basically confirmed my feelings on Regehr and Sekera and others. Then I came across this gem at the end ... "On the Sabres, I think the clustering of the forwards, Vanek, Stafford, Pominville, Leino, it strikes me as being telling of Lindy Ruff's system, which asks pretty much all forwards to be two-way forwards. It's been a major criticism of mine toward him. Using players this way may have worked in 1999 with Stu Barnes and Michael Peca, but players like Ville Leino and Cody Hodgson belong in the offensive zone the majority of the time. And if you can't use them that way, your GM shouldn't acquire them. The chart may even suggest that the GM and coach aren't exactly on the same page." This is Matthew Coller's take on the Sabres (the bold and underline I added for emphasis). I have no idea who this Matthew Coller clown is, but he is bang on. Of course, when I read this he is preaching to the choir ... Still trying to be a good boy ... :angel: . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 Thank you for posting this. Since it is rather detailed I did not read all of it, but did read the whole bit about the Sabres. It basically confirmed my feelings on Regehr and Sekera and others. Then I came across this gem at the end ... "On the Sabres, I think the clustering of the forwards, Vanek, Stafford, Pominville, Leino, it strikes me as being telling of Lindy Ruff's system, which asks pretty much all forwards to be two-way forwards. It's been a major criticism of mine toward him. Using players this way may have worked in 1999 with Stu Barnes and Michael Peca, but players like Ville Leino and Cody Hodgson belong in the offensive zone the majority of the time. And if you can't use them that way, your GM shouldn't acquire them. The chart may even suggest that the GM and coach aren't exactly on the same page." This is Matthew Coller's take on the Sabres (the bold and underline I added for emphasis). I have no idea who this Matthew Coller clown is, but he is bang on. Of course, when I read this he is preaching to the choir ... Still trying to be a good boy ... :angel: . trying to be good or not, you are dead right. That was the one thing that really stuck out to me as well in the Sabres tidbit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 I have no idea who this Matthew Coller clown is, but he is bang on. Of course, when I read this he is preaching to the choir ... Still trying to be a good boy ... :angel: . He's from WGR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 "Myers is far far and away the best defensive defenseman. He's the guy I would like to have matched up with your Ovechkins and Crosbys." Interesting. Very interesting... MAG really did sucked giant balls, it wasn't a figment of my imaginiation. Jason Pominville really is our best forward. This is fascinating I gotta re-read the sabres stuff and study this some more... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 Bazinga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabres Fan in NS Posted June 13, 2012 Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 He's from WGR. The voice of the Sabres ... that WGR ... they actually let him say this kind of stuff!! Bazinga :w00t: ... (since I'm old I had to Google it though) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted June 13, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 13, 2012 This annual writeup is put together by the gentlemen over at Hockey Prospectus, the affiliated hockey version of Baseball Prospectus, which, for those of you that enjoyed "Moneyball," is the famous home of baseball sabermetrics that was started by Bill James. I tend to believe that the numbers they put out are pointedly thoughtful and somewhat meaningful. The verbal interpretation is fairly debatable (isn't it always?), but nonetheless thought provoking. The section on the Sabres is certainly interesting. It looks like Regehr is holding up as one of the best shutdown defensemen we could get our hands on. Nobody started in the defensive zone more often that Regehr among [sabres] defensemen and nobody on the team faced more difficult competition than Regehr. He was given a clearly defined role and his 2.01 goals against per 60 minutes of ES time (2nd best among [sabres] defensemen) speaks to his success at the task he was given. One contributing factor to his brutal +/- is the fact that Regehr was put on the ice for one reason and one reason only, to defend the other teams top players and keep the puck out of his net. As a result, the team did not produce much offense with Regehr on the ice. And Sekera had a breakout season of sorts in our own end by facing much tougher competition. Last season Sekera started in the offensive zone 54.3% of the time last year (3rd highest among [sabres] defensemen); that dropped to 48.9% this season (only Weber and Regehr were lower). Sekera’s CorsiQoC also ballooned from 0.234 last season to 0.740 this season. He was relied on much more in the defensive zone, given more starts in the defensive zone along with more difficult competition; yet, he still managed to allow 1.6 fewer shots per 60 minutes despite this shifted role. His 24.6 SA/60 was the best among [sabres] defensemen this season. And other suspicions many of us had were confirmed by the chart: MAGs sucked balls, Boyes sucked balls, Adam was rightfully demoted, Kaleta's increasing his defensive role, and Sulzer's not bad at all. Concepts contrary to popular belief, such as Roy performing well against tough competition, are evident. I found the data on the other teams also fascinating... Did Joe Thornton stop producing 90 assists per season because he's older or a worse player? Not in the least. How the hell do the Sedin twins start in the offensive zone 80+% of the time? Somebody in Van City has to play tough minutes. Filppula put up 66 points in Detroit, but if you made him a Sabre, he'd likely end up as Ville Leino II. Winnipeg's beloved GST line is a skating line of goals against waiting to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 That was one of the more interesting reads in long time. And it hammers home how Jordan Staal would be the best possible acquisition for the Sabres this summer. Of course it also shows how Lindy would misuse him... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Well, that was interesting. Good find. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R_Dudley Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Wow, that was a really interesting read. I will need to reread it several times to really try and understand some of those stats but I think it was BANG on about the sabres and Ruff's system. Most interesting comment(s); the system is 1999ish and the suggestion GM and coach are not on same page for the system being used. I also found it cool to compare some players from other teams that I also watched, saw how they did and thought they played and then get to understand a little better how they were used by their coaches. Thank you physics or should I say statistics for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted June 14, 2012 Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 For those of you that believe in the power/interesting nature of statistics, I happened across the player usage charts for this year (note: not ice time charts). I think they illustrate some interesting characteristics of all the teams, and there's some interesting findings about player performances as well. For example, Gragnani posted 15 points on the season and Regeher only posted 5. Want statistical reasoning why Regehr's the better defender? Take a look. The analysis included is refreshingly objective. Available in PDF here: http://www.hockeyabs...rts 2011-12.pdf That is a really cool read, and interesting charts. Thanks! Also interesting that Butler got shutdown minutes in Calgary. Basically doing the role that Regher was brought in to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted June 14, 2012 Author Report Share Posted June 14, 2012 Yeah, for years some folks slapped around the criticism that "Ruff's system kills offense," or "Ruff coaches a boring game," or "he ruins players with his system." I don't believe any of that, but those charts illustrate why some might think those things: he forces all players to play two ways. In even strength (keep in mind nothing about the charts deals with special teams), he doesn't favor zone starts, really at all. He wants players that he can use in all situations, which gives him the capability to "roll all four lines" against opponents. Remember when we were good at that? We were good at that. Now, you might say that we should shelter our best players so that they play against the weakest competition. But you look at the Capitals and their results, and you see that their weaker players end up playing in very tough situations defensively. It's obviiously contributing to why WSH hasn't been viewed in a defensive light in the past 7 years. If you go strength vs strength, then you get results like Anaheim. Their obvious failings this season were in their depth players playing poorly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted June 17, 2012 Report Share Posted June 17, 2012 Thanks much for the interesting Sunday morning read. I found this line curious: "The common perception around the league is that Robyn Regehr had a very poor season in his first year in Buffalo." The writer spends the rest of the paragraph disabusing whoever these common perceptors are of this notion, but was that really the common perception around the league? I haven't read that anywhere else; I thought that if there was a common perception around the league, it was that Regehr was the guy doing the heavy lifting on the blueline all year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 Cool info.... The way I read it, Roy and Sekera look to be the best all-around players on the team given any situation. They face quality competition, have a high number of defensive assignments, yet produce scoring chances when on the ice. Myers actually looks pathetic from the chart. He faces average competition, isn't relied on in either zone, and many more scoring chances go against. Very interesting..............good thing Sekera and Roy are already on the team and overpriced or else Darcy would go and trade for them! Nice writeup and theory though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LaLaLaFontaine Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 I also like this report very much. It is interesting and it shows that Regehr carried the hardest defensive work. It also shows the pathetic coaching of Ruff. Everybody needs to play two way. Vanek gets minor minutes and has to play defense very often. He is not used right, like others too. I like the one harsh comment who showed this exactly very much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted June 18, 2012 Report Share Posted June 18, 2012 Looking at these charts, all I can really take away from them is that you want your team to have bigger balls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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