Sabres Trade JJ Peterka to Utah for Defenseman Michael Kesselring and Forward Josh Doan

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1 minute ago, 7+6=13 said:

If it's TBD then why do we get trashed for it until Norris doesn't get hurt or plays good?  We're an illogical fan base now, largely .  Cozens sucks and you're too scared to say it.  Especially at his ridiculous salary.  In hindsight, I would have traded him for nothing, we got better just not having him on the ice.  Let alone for anything Norris brings.

We trash the Norris trade because, while Cozens does suck (like Mitts), he had value (a little more than Mitts), and we got a broken horse in return. 

[Thorny]

We are up and boy are we loving this deal! 

[LGR4GM]

1 minute ago, Jorcus said:

 

No one will shade to Bensons slow slap shot. There are better players available. 

Benson's shot has been laughably turned into the same thing as Reinhart's skating. Benson has an average shot and if the goalie cheats, Benson is going to wrist it home. 

[thewookie1]

We got 2 solid players in a underwhelming trade with Peterka; furious about the lack of creativity and the general smugness of our incompetent GM but at very least the players we got are players I like.

I'll miss JJ though, was an electric player at times and his skill will be missed unless we can replace him in some manner.

I won't miss him on the PP though with his Catch-22 passes to Dahlin where'd he'd put our PP QB in a unwinnable situation. 

[Bangarang]

I hate what this team has become. Maybe one day we can be a serious franchise  

[LGR4GM]

Every time someone says Kesselt-tring instead of Kessel-ring, the drought gets 1 week longer. 

[French Collection]

Doan getting 9 points in 11 games in 23/24 shows a hint of offense. Not JJP type potential but a contributing 3rd liner. He will probably never match his Dad’s skill but if he can carve out a role as a gritty 3rd liner with some offense, there is a spot for him. The organization still has plenty of “small” young scorers in the queue.

Kesselring will need to be a solid player to change people’s minds on this deal.

[Thorny]

21 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

Norris replaces JJP's offense, as do other up and coming players. He really was kind of expendable

He is already averaging about .5 points a game. That's alright 

Expendable 

JJ was really quite expendable 

this is the fire analysis we can expect on Sabre space 

[SabresVet]

26 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Scoring isn't the issue that plagued this team last year. It was the lack of defending from the blueline and forward units. This trade should help in that area.I expect Quinn to have an uptick year. And also, Kulich should be more productive after getting a lot of playing time last year. There has to be a better balance between both sides of the puck. And from that perspective, this deal partially addresses that imbalance. 

Based on his immediate signing with Utah, one can fairly assume that he didn't want to be here. From that context, this was a reasonable deal. It's certainly not a blockbuster deal but it is a deal that better balances out the roster from an offensive/defensive ratio.

We're back to, as fans, assuming increased production from young players who aren't proven.  Still not good enough when you're a franchise in this predicament.  

This deal confirms Adams has no real plan.  We were told they didn't want to block players from being in the NHL.  Then, they signed some vets when that plan was insufficient and they apparently realized the error of the original plan.  It resulted in McLeod and some 4th liners last off-season.  

And now they are trading those younger players, necessary or not?  So, we'll see the Samuelsson buyout perhaps and a trade of Byram.  For what?  More spare pieces?

This is just re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic.  No plan.  No vision.  

Edited 4 hours ago by SabresVet

[Thorny]

11 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

Fair enough. 

I just think that the person primarily responsible for us having 79 points, finishing 7th last, being bad in many ways year after year, is Adams (and Pegula).  I’m not saying he hasn’t made any good moves. But the sum of his moves has equaled futility.  

Doan and Kesserling combined have played fewer NHL games than Peterka.  All of their career has been on a team that is coached the way we were told Ruff coaches a team. Structure and accountability. If it makes people feel good that Kesserling and Doan have good underlying numbers when in their short careers they have been on a team where basically every player has good underlying numbers, then that’s fine. It’s something to have some optimism about, I guess.

I certainly have no issues with either player. Big picture though?  Surely at this point you can forgive a Sabre fan for being skeptical?

The sabres don’t think they got equal value

people get that right? Adams and co don’t believe the sabres got equal value so if you think that you are actually disagreeing with the team. We know for a fact the priority was saving money.
 

We do KNOW our team got worse with the trade - the goal internally was to lose as little as posssible. But the loss is accepted. “Get the best return possible WHILE SAVING MONEY”. If money wasn’t an issue we’d have kept JJ because that is objectively the better end of the trade 

Edited 4 hours ago by Thorny

[LGR4GM]

Just now, Thorny said:

The sabres don’t think they got equal value

people get that right? Adams and co don’t believe the sabres got equal value so if you think that you are actually disagreeing with the team. We know for a fact the priority was saving money.
 

We do KNOW our team got worse with the trade - the goal internally was to lose as little as posssible. But the loss is accepted 

Objection, speculation. 

[Thorny]

Just now, LGR4GM said:

Objection, speculation. 

No I mean you are objectively wrong: if you don’t see that you are burrying your head in the sand we know about the internal cap. 

you think the wizardly sabres are so good they can come out on top on value WHILE saving a bunch of money? Just, win win? They can improve the team when it’s their secondary priority, they’ve advanced that far on the job? 

ya man! 

[dudacek]

17 minutes ago, Archie Lee said:

I’m sure that analytics will be the narrative here (from the Sabres). Peterka’s underlying numbers raise questions and fears of regression, while Kesserling’s and Doan’s suggest untapped promise and/or value that does not show up on the stat sheet. My concern is that we are trying to import a culture change by bringing in young players from what is clearly a culture of accountability and structure. These players just played a short time for Tourigny who, to me, is the anti-Ruff. It reminds me a bit of how Malenstyn and Aubé-Kubel were going to be 4th line demons because they did ok playing in a tough match-up role with Washington.  Lindy Ruff is not Spencer Carberry or Andre Tourigny.  Culture, commitment, accountability, and structure, don’t start with your 25 year old 2nd pairing D or your 23 year old 3rd line winger.  Just my view, but we are swapping out people at the wrong end of the culture issue.

So many variables and coaching is a huge one.

Ive always wanted to see a deep-dive piece on how analytics darlings do after getting traded. How common is the Ryan McLeod path? How many turn out to be Colin Millers?

The bold rings true to me. Should any of those things start with your 1st-line winger? Role matters in dressing rooms and talent helps dictate role.

How respected and serious was JJ? He’s almost certainly not a leader. Was he a good follower? Are the new guys good foot soldiers? Can they be good corporals?

Draft for talent, trade for need is a thing.

Is our coach and GM capable of identifying what was lacking and what is needed?

They haven’t been so far.

[oddoublee]

While not a fan of the entire return, getting a top for RHD in this league is tough. I get KA's thought process in that regard.

What I don't get...is how we didn't get a lil more capital in return. A prospect or 2nd/3rd rounder would have been nice...and candidly expected.

Losing a 23 yr old 25-30 goal scorer is no joke...let's hope our new RHD solidifies things.

[bob_sauve28]

5 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Expendable 

JJ was really quite expendable 

this is the fire analysis we can expect on Sabre space 

Oh calm down. You got three months to seethe over this. But don't vent too much, KA still has Draft Day to piss you off. Save some for tomorrow! 

[HockeyJock1970]

You know what this means...Utah wins the Cup in the next 2 years.

[oddoublee]

4 minutes ago, SabresVet said:

We're back to, as fans, assuming increased production from young players who aren't proven.  Still not good enough when you're a franchise in this predicament.  

This deal confirms Adams has no real plan.  We were told they didn't want to block players from being in the NHL.  Then, they signed some vets when that plan was insufficient and they apparently realized the error of the original plan.  It resulted in McLeod and some 4th liners last off-season.  

And now they are trading those younger players, necessary or not?  So, we'll see the Samuelsson buyout perhaps and a trade of Byram.  For what?  More spare pieces?

This is just re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic.  No plan.  No vision.  

I would argue that this is one of the few moves KA has made that had true roster building in mind - shoring up the RHD position.

That said...I struggle giving up a young 25-30 goal scorer 

[Mustache of God]

1 minute ago, HockeyJock1970 said:

You know what this means...Utah wins the Cup in the next 2 years.

They're long overdue for it, so good for them.

[7+6=13]

13 minutes ago, ... said:

We trash the Norris trade because, while Cozens does suck (like Mitts), he had value (a little more than Mitts), and we got a broken horse in return. 

Why do we keep saying this? No he didn't. He was making a ton of money and not producing. That's a contract and player very few want.  So far it's already playing out that we won and Norris hasn't even iced.  

[Thorny]

4 minutes ago, bob_sauve28 said:

Oh calm down. You got three months to seethe over this. But don't vent too much, KA still has Draft Day to piss you off. Save some for tomorrow! 

Nope today is the swan song 

“expendable” is a completely erroneous term for one of your best forwards I don’t care. It’s just wrong 

We avoided making moves for 5 years in the name of expendable RFAs? Don’t put that ***** on people 

Edited 4 hours ago by Thorny

[French Collection]

The team just got a wee bit older. More grit added at the cost of offense.

Go out and sign Ehlers if they want JJP’s replacement.

Edited 4 hours ago by French Collection

[steveoath]

1 hour ago, LGR4GM said:

What if Dahlin wanted Peterka gone?

[Thorny]

4 minutes ago, 7+6=13 said:

Why do we keep saying this? No he didn't. He was making a ton of money and not producing. That's a contract and player very few want.  So far it's already playing out that we won and Norris hasn't even iced.  

This is the genius of the sabres. We can draft a guy, tailor our entire timeline to him and his group, screw up his contract, win nothing, trade him for nothing, and have it claimed we have “already won.”

it’s literally bizarro world. I don’t have the level of bias to keep up with you guys, I legitimately thought I could fan but I can’t fan THAT much. I mean holy cow 

Edited 4 hours ago by Thorny

[LGR4GM]

Interestingly, Adams has added 2 rhd in the last 4 months. 

A soon to be 25yr old Bernard-Docker and a 25yr old Kesselring. 

[GoPuckYourself]

I can't lie I don't hate this trade which is why I don't think it's Adams who made it LOL we get 2 guys who arent afraid at all mixing it up and throwing their body around. Shane Doan has a that fire like his dad did and is growing more and more into it. The only thing I don't like is that both of them are RFA's next season and we could be going through the same thing again next offseason but I don't hate this at all.