matter2003 Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 Surprisingly, Pittsburgh is 2nd, but the Sabres have a long history of having high numbers of injuries and longer recovery times. What is causing it? Can something be done about it? Is it a training issue? Do they not let players get proper treatment for their injuries or issue to try nd prevent them from occurring? Are they too reactive rather than proactive? Do they not follow the proper workout regimens that end up leading to increased injuries? Nutrition issues? Not utilizing the Pegula's investment in the most cutting edge sports science to their advantage like the Bills have under McDermott, where they are always in the bottom 5 in man games lost to injury? Clearly to be this consistently poor in an area, something isn't being done properly to help prevent them. There is no way over a 10+ year period a team can regularly be this injury prone. What is the solution? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude Balls Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 What's broken - the players How to fix - apparently nothing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 14 minutes ago, Claude Balls said: What's broken - the players How to fix - apparently nothing Lack of talent. Seriously. and wings. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dreams Burn Down Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 The fact that the time period displayed includes the worst continuous stretch of futility in this franchise's history cannot be coincidental. Lack of talent, poor medical staff, and mismanagement from the top (and more?) are all contributing factors. Since the same ownership controls the Sabres and Bills, and the Bills seem to "get it" in this area, emulating their approach and applying it to an ice hockey environment would seem to be a cost effective way to begin. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 3 minutes ago, Dreams Burn Down said: The fact that the time period displayed includes the worst continuous stretch of futility in this franchise's history cannot be coincidental. Lack of talent, poor medical staff, and mismanagement from the top (and more?) are all contributing factors. Since the same ownership controls the Sabres and Bills, and the Bills seem to "get it" in this area, emulating their approach and applying it to an ice hockey environment would seem to be a cost effective way to begin. Correlation does not equal causation. That said, I think this year is bad luck. Most injuries have been on ice stuff, it happens. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thwomp! Posted January 21, 2022 Report Share Posted January 21, 2022 Bad players are often bad at least partially because they're often injured. We've had a lot of bad players during this stretch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Lee Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 18 hours ago, matter2003 said: Surprisingly, Pittsburgh is 2nd, but the Sabres have a long history of having high numbers of injuries and longer recovery times. What is causing it? Can something be done about it? Is it a training issue? Do they not let players get proper treatment for their injuries or issue to try nd prevent them from occurring? Are they too reactive rather than proactive? Do they not follow the proper workout regimens that end up leading to increased injuries? Nutrition issues? Not utilizing the Pegula's investment in the most cutting edge sports science to their advantage like the Bills have under McDermott, where they are always in the bottom 5 in man games lost to injury? Clearly to be this consistently poor in an area, something isn't being done properly to help prevent them. There is no way over a 10+ year period a team can regularly be this injury prone. What is the solution? I saw somewhere else this morning a similar chart that went back over a decade. It showed the Sabres were middle of the pack and not that they were injury prone over a 10+ year period. One other thing that might be a factor: the Sabres are out of contention early. Perhaps they have some players with injuries that they might play through in different circumstances. I'm not saying that any specific injured player on the team could have played or could now play with their injury; but in this of all seasons, there is no great reason to play hurt. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woods-racer Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 Could it also be we have been asking a lot of very young players to play in a mans league to early in their careers? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 18 hours ago, SwampD said: Lack of talent. Seriously. and wings. This is a good point. Persistently trying to make up for lack of skill, just trying to keep up in general, probably is more likely to get you injured than just being better than other players and teams and being able to dictate pace 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 12 minutes ago, Randall Flagg said: This is a good point. Persistently trying to make up for lack of skill, just trying to keep up in general, probably is more likely to get you injured than just being better than other players and teams and being able to dictate pace But I thought they weren’t putting in enough effort? Not intended seriously folks……. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) 23 hours ago, Dreams Burn Down said: The fact that the time period displayed includes the worst continuous stretch of futility in this franchise's history cannot be coincidental. Lack of talent, poor medical staff, and mismanagement from the top (and more?) are all contributing factors. Since the same ownership controls the Sabres and Bills, and the Bills seem to "get it" in this area, emulating their approach and applying it to an ice hockey environment would seem to be a cost effective way to begin. Yup. I love the OP in combined with this post - it’s statistically inarguable the Sabres have been worse off relatively than other teams when it comes to injury, and for a trend to be that clearly established for such a long time makes randomness unlikely (along with the fact that Mike Harrington thinks it’s random which pretty much seals that as being not the case). The good news is once we get better talent, the injuries should improve too. Talent on the ice and off the ice. Edited January 22, 2022 by Thorny 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 23 hours ago, LGR4GM said: Correlation does not equal causation. That said, I think this year is bad luck. Most injuries have been on ice stuff, it happens. I like that this post now has two frowns 3 minutes ago, Thorny said: Yup. I love the OP in combined with this post - it’s statistically inarguable the Sabres have been worse off relatively than other teams when it comes to injury, and for a trend to be that clearly established for such a long time makes randomness unlikely (along with the fact that Mike Harrington thinks it’s random which pretty much seals that as being not the case). The good news is once we get better talent, the injuries should improve too. Talent on the ice and off the ice. No, no it doesn't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 minute ago, LGR4GM said: I like that this post now has two frowns No, no it doesn't. Is that a joke? Lol The longer a trend is established the less likely it can be attributed to randomness. This is basic mathematics 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 Just now, Thorny said: Is that a joke? Lol No I love that a post saying correlation doesn't equal causation is getting hate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 Just now, LGR4GM said: No I love that a post saying correlation doesn't equal causation is getting hate. No one cares dude. Your assertion that randomness doesn’t become more unlikely the longer a trend is established is abjectly false 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 minute ago, Thorny said: Is that a joke? Lol The longer a trend is established the less likely it can be attributed to randomness. This is basic mathematics What do you attribute it to then. Just now, Thorny said: No one cares dude. Your assertion that randomness doesn’t become more unlikely the longer a trend is established is abjectly false Cool dude. Also that's not my argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 If you flip a coin 50 times and it comes up heads 50 times, while statistically possible it’s random it’s exceptionally more likely there’s something causing the coin to do so. Be it weighted, or otherwise. That’s because something happening randomly that many times in a row is basically impossible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 Just now, Thorny said: If you flip a coin 50 times and it comes up heads 50 times, while statistically possible it’s random it’s exceptionally more likely there’s something causing the coin to do so. Be it weighted, or otherwise. That’s because something happening randomly that many times in a row is basically impossible Yea, but you can't define what variables contribute to the Sabres injuries can you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: What do you attribute it to then. Cool dude. Also that's not my argument. 7 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: No, no it doesn't. Edited January 22, 2022 by Thorny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 minute ago, LGR4GM said: Yea, but you can't define what variables contribute to the Sabres injuries can you? I’ve never claimed to be able to define it. We’ve talked about this a lot. Recently I’ve said taro’s idea that it comes down to talent seems to have the most merit I definitely can’t define the variables with certainty, merely expressing confidence they are indeed present: it’s not random. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Thorny said: I’ve never claimed to be able to define it. We’ve talked about this a lot. Recently I’ve said taro’s idea that it comes down to talent seems to have the most merit I definitely can’t define the variables with certainty, merely expressing confidence they are indeed present: it’s not random. If the variable is constantly changing, then yes it is. 23 hours ago, Dreams Burn Down said: The fact that the time period displayed includes the worst continuous stretch of futility in this franchise's history cannot be coincidental. Lack of talent, poor medical staff, and mismanagement from the top (and more?) are all contributing factors. Since the same ownership controls the Sabres and Bills, and the Bills seem to "get it" in this area, emulating their approach and applying it to an ice hockey environment would seem to be a cost effective way to begin. This was what I originally responded to. Correlation does not equal causation. Fire away at that. I think it's funny. Edited January 22, 2022 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 (edited) 4 minutes ago, LGR4GM said: If the variable is constantly changing, then yes it is. So 11 different variables, one for each season, each one randomly arising and affecting the same team each of those years just by chance, and not something influenced by the team or it’s construction Edited January 22, 2022 by Thorny 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marvin Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 Someday, I am going to compute the p value for various things like how well man games due to injury correlate to points percentage just to end arguments like these. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dreams Burn Down Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 54 minutes ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said: Someday, I am going to compute the p value for various things like how well man games due to injury correlate to points percentage just to end arguments like these. That would be great. I was more apt to use the Pearson r in my day, but that would work very well in this scenario, too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SwampD Posted January 22, 2022 Report Share Posted January 22, 2022 1 hour ago, Marvin, Sabres Fan said: Someday, I am going to compute the p value for various things like how well man games due to injury correlate to points percentage just to end arguments like these. There’s always one guy that wants to ruin everyone else’s fun. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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