Taro T Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 21 minutes ago, ... said: Maybe RK is going to completely shake up the hockey world by using 3 D and 2 F for his schemes. Well, it's been over 25 years since the Jets toyed with that plan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, darksabre said: This isn't even remotely accurate. By "less physically gifted" he must mean "smaller." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuuuuuuuuu Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, darksabre said: This isn't even remotely accurate. Physically? Risto is bigger and stronger and possibly faster. Are we operating on different assumptions of what "physically gifted means? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, Stu said: Physically? Risto is bigger and stronger and possibly faster. Are we operating on different assumptions of what "physically gifted means? I'm factoring skating into this equation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, Stu said: Physically? Risto is bigger and stronger and possibly faster. Are we operating on different assumptions of what "physically gifted means? Just now, darksabre said: I'm factoring skating into this equation. Gardiner is absolutely a better skater, in both speed and form. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 Gardiner's stats suggest he's a lot better in his own end too 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 1 minute ago, WildCard said: Gardiner's stats suggest he's a lot better in his own end too Well, I think he's just as bad at Risto while in his own end. He's just so much better at transitioning the puck that he doesn't get trapped there for entire shifts at a time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 1 minute ago, WildCard said: Gardiner's stats suggest he's a lot better in his own end too Correct. He's a better defenseman than Risto in basically every way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
... Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 And not a grain of salt in sight. I LIKE IT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuuuuuuuuu Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, ... said: ***rabble rabble quality of teammates****Morgan Riley absorbs tougher minutes***I have no data to back up my position*****stats are for nerds*** Goes back to watching Don Cherry Rock 'Em Sock 'Em videos from the early 90'S 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 7 minutes ago, That Aud Smell said: And not a grain of salt in sight. I LIKE IT. The grain of salt would be Gardiner's back injury. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 22 minutes ago, TrueBlueGED said: Well, I think he's just as bad at Risto while in his own end. He's just so much better at transitioning the puck that he doesn't get trapped there for entire shifts at a time. That’s a huge part of what defense is. Getting the puck out of the defensive zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 3 minutes ago, Curtisp5286 said: That’s a huge part of what defense is. Getting the puck out of the defensive zone. I agree, I just don't think everyone sees it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 5 minutes ago, Curtisp5286 said: That’s a huge part of what defense is. Getting the puck out of the defensive zone. A huge part of that is also having the forwards to make smart choices, our forward group is so bad Gardiner might have same stats as Risto playing here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 These Gardiner rumors just wont go away. Obviously would lead to more reshuffling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 If the Sabres landed Gardiner what that would say to me is that the market value for Risto is IN THE TANK and all of this "some GMs think he's a first pairing D man" stuff is totally out to lunch. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scottysabres Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 16 minutes ago, tom webster said: These Gardiner rumors just wont go away. Obviously would lead to more reshuffling. Maybe Botterill rebuilding the entire D in 1 off season is a good thing? Not sure. 15 minutes ago, darksabre said: If the Sabres landed Gardiner what that would say to me is that the market value for Risto is IN THE TANK and all of this "some GMs think he's a first pairing D man" stuff is totally out to lunch. Gardiner is a left shot, does he play the right side? I'm not sure what position he played on D. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, darksabre said: If the Sabres landed Gardiner what that would say to me is that the market value for Risto is IN THE TANK and all of this "some GMs think he's a first pairing D man" stuff is totally out to lunch. I'm not understanding your logic on this. Why is adding Gardiner a sign that Risto's trade value is very low? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
... Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 20 minutes ago, darksabre said: If the Sabres landed Gardiner what that would say to me is that the market value for Risto is IN THE TANK and all of this "some GMs think he's a first pairing D man" stuff is totally out to lunch. Interesting take. And so, real question, what does he do to pare down the roster? Trade bodies for picks? That seems like the only thing he can do if he can't trade bodies for bodies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 31 minutes ago, Huckleberry said: A huge part of that is also having the forwards to make smart choices, our forward group is so bad Gardiner might have same stats as Risto playing here. Its true. I think Risto is not very good at making quality outlet passes though. Even compared to some of his fellow Sabres defensemen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darksabre Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 7 minutes ago, Curtisp5286 said: I'm not understanding your logic on this. Why is adding Gardiner a sign that Risto's trade value is very low? It's purely a numbers thing. Signing Gardiner makes Risto's cap hit untenable and gives us too many players to protect for expansion. It would immediately dilute Risto's value. 6 minutes ago, ... said: Interesting take. And so, real question, what does he do to pare down the roster? Trade bodies for picks? That seems like the only thing he can do if he can't trade bodies for bodies. It's gonna be D for picks and forwards you gotta think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 39 minutes ago, Huckleberry said: A huge part of that is also having the forwards to make smart choices, our forward group is so bad Gardiner might have same stats as Risto playing here. The regression models take team context into account. If you want to argue the measures they use to do that, or contend the particular regressions employed aren't statistically appropriate, have at it. But those factors are not being ignored. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Curt Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 Just now, darksabre said: It's purely a numbers thing. Signing Gardiner makes Risto's cap hit untenable and gives us too many players to protect for expansion. It would immediately dilute Risto's value. Ah, ok, I see what you mean. It dilutes his value moving forward because other teams will feel that Buffalo NEEDS to make a move. I would say that they wouldn't need to make a trade immediately. The signing wouldn't put them over the cap. A Gardiner signing could mean that a Risto, or other D, trade is already well in the works and is imminent. Its all speculative right now anyway. We don't even know the reliability of this report that Buffalo is in on Gardiner. We'll see how things shake out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
... Posted July 3, 2019 Report Share Posted July 3, 2019 2 minutes ago, darksabre said: It's gonna be D for picks and forwards you gotta think. My question, upon review, wasn't worded correctly. The answer is obvious based on the way I worded it. Sorry to affect the collective IQ of the board. What I meant to ask was what is he EXPECTING to do after acquiring all of these players (especially if the Gardiner thing comes to pass)? Sure, we don't know really (do we?), but I'm not picking up a pattern or thread that indicates any strategy here other than "get the ones you can when you can and worry about it later". Sort of like he's building up a big blob of clay to eventually start carving away into some sculpture. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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