woods-racer Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 (edited) My money is on Jared killing himself before landing in Jail or getting offed in his first 24...... It takes an amazingly strong willed and determined person to kill them selves, a person of very little will and determination goes to jail for what he is going for. From my life street learnings.... Inmates will absolve each others' crimes in a weird kind of way once they are in prison. Except for those that do crimes against the young involving sex. They find people that can do or did that as being the lowest of the low. He will receive a future in prison that will be worse than what you predict for him. Edited August 20, 2015 by Woods-Racer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 This is the first I heard about Jared getting busted. Being a super familiar face and having committed that crime? Prison won't be pleasant for him. It takes an amazingly strong willed and determined person to kill them selves, a person of very little will and determination goes to jail for what he is going for. No... it doesn't? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Are you implying that women are not intelligent enough to understand they have the ability to say no? Surely that's not your intention? I am saying we need to empower women. Knowing you can say no and feeling you have the power to say no are not the same thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted August 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 From my life street learnings.... Inmates will absolve each others' crimes in a weird kind of way once they are in prison. Except for those that do crimes against the young involving sex. They find people that can do or did that as being the lowest of the low. He will receive a future in prison that will be worse than what you predict for him. This is true. What may mitigate things for this guy (in prison) is that his crimes were apparently directed to 16 year-old girls. That sort of crime is not viewed the same way as someone who had victims who were elementary school aged boys. But his celebrity should all but assure that he will be in some form of special housing, or in a facility that is heavy on sex offenders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Former President Jimmy Carter's Ted Talk on the mistreatment of women in the US and the world. https://www.ted.com/talks/jimmy_carter_why_i_believe_the_mistreatment_of_women_is_the_number_one_human_rights_abuse#t-599733 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hank Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 I am saying we need to empower women. Knowing you can say no and feeling you have the power to say no are not the same thing. Why do you believe women don't feel they have the power to say, "don't take my pants off me, I don't want to have sex with you"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 No... it doesn't? Yes. It does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Why do you believe women don't feel they have the power to say, "don't take my pants off me, I don't want to have sex with you"? I think maybe a female poster might be better to answer this. I think that young women especially do not feel they can say that and judging from the research it seems to come up again and again. Social pressure, situational pressure, not understanding their own rights fully, many things can contribute to someone not feeling they have the power to say no. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Why do you believe women don't feel they have the power to say, "don't take my pants off me, I don't want to have sex with you"? I think the better way of saying what Liger is saying is women should have the peace of mind that when they say no it will be respected. Unfortunately that's not the case in all situations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Yes. It does. Or it takes a weak willed person that feels as though there's no other way to turn. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Or it takes a weak willed person that feels as though there's no other way to turn. You know nothing of what you speak. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 You know nothing of what you speak. Hey, thanks for that assumption. I just read an article about Jared's arrest. His accomplice attempted to kill himself in the jail cell. Do you think he failed at killing himself because he wasn't determined enough? Or because he didn't have the tools available to him in a cell? Internet black and white disclaimer: I'm not saying everybody who commits suicide is weak willed. But to say that it takes a strong willed and determined person to commit suicide? That's not true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Or it takes a weak willed person that feels as though there's no other way to turn. Waaaayyyyyyyy too simplistic a viewpoint about this subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Waaaayyyyyyyy too simplistic a viewpoint about this subject. That's not my viewpoint. That was a counter point to the blanket statement "It takes an amazingly strong willed and determined person to kill them selves" People in all kinds of different situations commit suicide for different reasons. If somebody commits (or attempts to commit) suicide, I don't believe that's a reflection of their character in any way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 Or it takes a weak willed person that feels as though there's no other way to turn.No Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 No See above post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 See above post.I getcha, it posted while I was typing so I didn't see it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woods-racer Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 That's not my viewpoint. That was a counter point to the blanket statement "It takes an amazingly strong willed and determined person to kill them selves" People in all kinds of different situations commit suicide for different reasons. If somebody commits (or attempts to commit) suicide, I don't believe that's a reflection of their character in any way. I agree to that view also. But in my personal view a person that has the will to commit suicide as the only viable choice to end their pain is strong willed. If they saw a way to end the pain and it was a much easier course to take, I assume that would be the path they chose. I'm not saying they are of strong character or at all bringing in a human value system into it. My thought was more simplistic. Being strong willed, one of the many traits that make up a person, is not seen by me as being the most lacking of traits in their character. Suicide is very complex and emotional topic. I tried to in one sentence claim that suicidal people are not weak, or weak minded. A chemical imbalance, depression, a unreasonable fear of something are reasons I would be easily convinced of as to why someone would try. I just felt compelled not to let hang that suicide is for the weak as a way out, and I'm sure the post I was commenting on ever even meant to implied that. A total derail of a thread by me. Sorry, not intended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LTS Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 (Not quoting LTS because that was long) Good post. I don't disagree with just about anything you're saying, although I think we can both agree a kiss is different than shoving your genitals on somebody else. There's a reason genitals are referred to as "private parts" and lips aren't. You shouldn't just go around kissing people, but it's absolutely part of dating if not explicitly said otherwise. And most of the time there will be obvious moves to say yes or no. If a woman or man says no to the kiss then fine, don't be a jerk in response. But if a man or woman attempts to rub genitals then there's absolutely a line crossed. That's not to say you need to scream "HEY WANNA GRIND!?" But when the woman isn't even aware of your existence and/or hasn't had any eye contact or contact otherwise with you then you don't proceed to go for it. That's what I'm getting at. However, the original point was his response to her. If he would've been like "my bad" then whatever. But the name-calling and acting like anything she did was whorish and wrong is the type of culture women face for not covering every inch of skin other than their arms and face. And it's not just a rave thing. No, he SHOULDN'T do it.. but people like that exist. And I 100% agree with you that his response was unwarranted but again, unfortunately there are people like that. This seems pertinent to this thread. http://www.buzzfeed.com/maryanngeorgantopoulos/alleged-new-hampshire-prep-school-rape-victim-testifies#.kjoAk4EDz "She graphically described how their sexual encounter quickly escalated. She let him take her shirt off, she said, because she didn’t want to offend him. The girl began crying when she described how Labrie allegedly ripped her bra off. She said Labrie tried removing her underwear and that she said “no” while trying to be as polite as possible. The girl was worried about causing conflict and did not want to come off as “bitchy.” “I didn’t know how to deal with it because I’ve never been in a situation like this,” she testified in court, while crying. “I’d never been touched in that way.” The problem here, is a part of an overall problem in society, and that is the fear of people to forcefully express themselves for fear of retribution or other negative consequences. I think, to some degree, this goes along with an overall atmosphere in our culture to try not to offend others because others are so easily offended. There needs to be a strong focus on the importance of individualized thought and that thinking differently is not a problem. The key of course then becomes strengthening people's ability to not be concerned with what everyone else thinks. We know that peer pressure, social pressure, play huge roles in why people go along with something. They feel like they need to belong to something. That's not something you can easily correct. I'm not saying she is wrong, it's a huge problem that I wish would have been identified and perhaps she could have been reinforced in ways to express her feelings. The other piece of information that is hugely relevant in this post is her inability to act because she was still trying to process the information. This probably underscores the need to have these kinds of conversations with your children, both male and female, on what is appropriate action and how to react when something like this happens. You can only hope that the lesson registers when its needed most. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwksndmonster Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 I agree to that view also. But in my personal view a person that has the will to commit suicide as the only viable choice to end their pain is strong willed. If they saw a way to end the pain and it was a much easier course to take, I assume that would be the path they chose. I'm not saying they are of strong character or at all bringing in a human value system into it. My thought was more simplistic. Being strong willed, one of the many traits that make up a person, is not seen by me as being the most lacking of traits in their character. Suicide is very complex and emotional topic. I tried to in one sentence claim that suicidal people are not weak, or weak minded. A chemical imbalance, depression, a unreasonable fear of something are reasons I would be easily convinced of as to why someone would try. I just felt compelled not to let hang that suicide is for the weak as a way out, and I'm sure the post I was commenting on ever even meant to implied that. A total derail of a thread by me. Sorry, not intended. I see what you meant now. And don't be sorry, thread derails are a part of life on this board. (and my remark was just as much responsible) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 I think maybe a female poster might be better to answer this. I think that young women especially do not feel they can say that and judging from the research it seems to come up again and again. Social pressure, situational pressure, not understanding their own rights fully, many things can contribute to someone not feeling they have the power to say no. How do you suggest we accomplish this, preventing sexual advances when neither party shows reluctance? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 No means no. It really is that simple. But let's make it about a level of sexual excitement that causes us to lose our humanity because, damn-it!, I had reached a point of no return and that bitch owed me! Rape has little to nothing to do with sex. It's about power and imposing your will upon someone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 How do you suggest we accomplish this, preventing sexual advances when neither party shows reluctance? If somebody is discussing financials with you and how they want to help you do you reach in their pocket for their wallet without asking just because they never told you not to? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JJFIVEOH Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 If somebody is discussing financials with you and how they want to help you do you reach in their pocket for their wallet without asking just because they never told you not to? Last I checked the next step in two people having sexual relations after they hook up (willingly or not) is removal of clothes. I'm pretty sure that's what happens 100% of the time in the timeline of having sex. I don't think people generally reach into somebody else's pocket to grab their wallet when discussing financial matters. Maybe it's different in BFLO. If two people hook up at a club after they've been dancing together, they decide to go back to one of their places together, they get into bed and are preparing to have sex........... then she decides she doesn't want to have sex. How do you suggest we stop this advancement when she doesn't give the impression she doesn't want to stop, not to mention never says 'no'? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K-9 Posted August 20, 2015 Report Share Posted August 20, 2015 ... If two people hook up at a club after they've been dancing together, they decide to go back to one of their places together, they get into bed and are preparing to have sex........... then she decides she doesn't want to have sex. How do you suggest we stop this advancement when she doesn't give the impression she doesn't want to stop, not to mention never says 'no'? You answered your own question. The advancement stops when she decides she doesn't want to have sex. Period. Doesn't matter how far along in the act they were. Once it is not consensual, it is game over. That could be before, during, or after intercourse, by the way. That should be obvious to a gentleman with an ounce of moral fiber that doesn't let his d ick do his thinking for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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