KBC Renovations Update

[Brawndo]

 

 

[Brawndo]

 

[Mango]

It is worth noting that renovations = contractually obligated maintenance. The roof has never been replaced and the scoreboard is well passed due on the manufacturers recommendation. 

They originally tried to get this paid for by the county and the county said "that isn't what the lease says". 

Estimates for a true upgrades and renovations to the arena are $150M+. I wouldn't be shocked if they only spend approximately 10-15% of that on the roof/score board. 

 

Edited February 26 by Mango

[shrader]

It’s time to make home ice matter again. Make that sucker retractable. 

[Slack_in_MA]

Huh, didn’t know the scoreboard and old roof were at the root of the poor home record. I guess now they’ll be piling in without the fear of a roof collapse.

Terry… Sabres fans would sit outside in the new football stadium if the Sabres were a contender.

[PASabreFan]

Color me impressed that in the rendition of the scoreboard they don't have the Rangers up 3-0.

[...]

What do you suppose 12:20 signifies?

[Night Train]

6 minutes ago, ... said:

What do you suppose 12:20 signifies?

Lunch appt. with the yacht builder. 

[Pimlach]

 

Better lighting. 

[KC Scouts]

Hold on to your wallets......😜

[OverPowerYou]

I’m so excited about this new roof. I’ll probably buy tickets to see it next year 

[PerreaultForever]

I saw the story about the renovations and my instant thought was - is that the timeline? 24/25 is the planned great leap forward? We can only hope, but the comments above from Pegula lead me to think they do in fact plan to add in free agency now, finally, and 24/25 will be time is now rather than be patient for the future. Or I'm just deluding myself. 

We can only hope. 

[Mango]

33 minutes ago, OverPowerYou said:

I’m so excited about this new roof. I’ll probably buy tickets to see it next year 

If we tear down the skyway before I get to see this beauty, I swear to god!

[Mango]

7 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

I saw the story about the renovations and my instant thought was - is that the timeline? 24/25 is the planned great leap forward? We can only hope, but the comments above from Pegula lead me to think they do in fact plan to add in free agency now, finally, and 24/25 will be time is now rather than be patient for the future. Or I'm just deluding myself. 

We can only hope. 

I think this is likely just the bare minimum to stay in compliance with the lease. The roof has never been done and the jumbotron was done in 2007. Daktronics, the vendor who made says that the life expectancy is about 10 years. We are approaching year 17-18. For reference Golisano replaced the prior jumbrotron 11 years after it fell in 1996. 

Pegula is waaaaaay behind on arena maintenance. 

[TheAud]

11 minutes ago, Mango said:

I think this is likely just the bare minimum to stay in compliance with the lease. The roof has never been done and the jumbotron was done in 2007. Daktronics, the vendor who made says that the life expectancy is about 10 years. We are approaching year 17-18. For reference Golisano replaced the prior jumbrotron 11 years after it fell in 1996. 

Pegula is waaaaaay behind on arena maintenance. 

At least he didn't wait until the jumbotron fell to replace it!

[Mango]

Just now, TheAud said:

At least he didn't wait until the jumbotron fell to replace it!

 

Bahaha. It is hard to believe that thing crashed within the first 60 days or so. 

[Buffalo Super Fan]

This is very good Buffalo Sabres news at least the Sabres are committed to staying in Buffalo. Buffalo fans know I am not a fan of Terry Pegula and I doubt I ever will be even if he finally wins a championship. Because I don’t care for his style of absentee ownership even with the Buffalo Bills it’s minimum at best so after getting that out of the way. 
 
Buffalo Sabres fans can do whatever they want it’s a free country. I would never tell anyone what they should do with their hard earned money or how to think. But understand complaining about seating leg room and restrooms is nonsense. The Buffalo Memorial Auditorium was a dump but we still went to games as Buffalo Sabres fans. The Key Bank Center restrooms today are 5 stars compared to the old Buffalo Memorial Auditorium or Buffalo War Memorial Stadium. If you don’t like sports anymore unless the Sabres are winning or the prices are cheap that is fine. But understand there are consequences for that action it’s called the moving van. Again I am fine with Buffalo NHL or AHL hockey as long as Buffalo has some kind of hockey team. But I have a feeling that the ones complaining the most about restrooms and leg room would never go near a Buffalo AHL team replacement for the NHL Buffalo Sabres if it ever came to that. Yet howl the most about missing NHL hockey in Buffalo. I say this because Buffalo Sabres are down there NHL revenue wise today with Arizona Coyotes and Winnipeg Jets two NHL teams that are at risk for relocation. 

The Key Bank Center seating bowl changes only happen with public money that is the general public responsibility it’s in the Buffalo Sabres lease. The Sabres lease is coming up and we as a Western New York community are going to have a choice renew the lease with the upgrades that the Sabres want or not. I think as a Buffalo Sabres fan it comes down to just like the Buffalo Bills you either want major league sports or you don’t in Buffalo? There is a price for major league sports and there are plenty of cities that will take the Sabres off our hands if you want to do the Oakland as I call it. Which is absolutely nothing but complain and not go to games. The ticket prices are the ticket prices for major league sporting events today go or don’t go it seems pretty simple. But in sports regardless of the level you can’t guarantee winning. I wish you could but you can’t.

But I don’t want to hear complaining if the Buffalo Sabres leave town for the Buffalo AHL replacement you get what you pay for. Tickets are never coming down price wise and will always go up. When I read complaints about the restrooms and leg room in seats it tells me this may not be a major league sports town anymore sadly? You either love NHL hockey or you don’t? Seats and restrooms never entered into watching a hockey game for me. Again I am personally good either way Western New York community wants either to do the Oakland and become Rochester sports rivals keep it up.

The biggest problem with the Buffalo Sabres are that the Sabres players are too comfortable and the roster needs a major block buster trades. Eventually that is going to happen and I think it’s Alex Tuch he isn’t a clutch player and any where but Buffalo would be a try hard player on a third line. Alex Tuch isn’t ever going to be a star or a top 6 forward and too many Sabres fans can’t see that yet. Because Alex Tuch is a semi local player from Syracuse. But the reality is that Patrick Kane the Buffalo hometown player most didn’t want even at his age is a more skilled clutch player than an Alex Tuch now. But unfortunately Sabres fans don’t want to hear or accept that fact. Alex Tuch is at his ceiling he isn’t going to get better only older. Now is the time to move him while the Sabres can hopefully get a good return. I would bring in Patrick Kane in free agency and trade for John Tavares out of Toronto. Which I think John Tavares may come available in the summer after the Toronto Maple Leafs collapse in the NHL playoffs again. John Tavares would be the Sabres new captain and Patrick Kane an alternate captain. Completely remaking the culture and locker room for the current Buffalo Sabres in my opinion. Go Sabres!  Let’s Go Buffalo 

[pastajoe]

The scoreboard isn’t a priority for fans. Replacing the uncomfortable seats with inadequate leg room is. At 6’3’ I have to turn my legs to the side to fit.

[Mango]

32 minutes ago, Buffalo Super Fan said:

This is very good Buffalo Sabres news at least the Sabres are committed to staying in Buffalo. Buffalo fans know I am not a fan of Terry Pegula and I doubt I ever will be even if he finally wins a championship. Because I don’t care for his style of absentee ownership even with the Buffalo Bills it’s minimum at best so after getting that out of the way. 
 
Buffalo Sabres fans can do whatever they want it’s a free country. I would never tell anyone what they should do with their hard earned money or how to think. But understand complaining about seating leg room and restrooms is nonsense. The Buffalo Memorial Auditorium was a dump but we still went to games as Buffalo Sabres fans. The Key Bank Center restrooms today are 5 stars compared to the old Buffalo Memorial Auditorium or Buffalo War Memorial Stadium. If you don’t like sports anymore unless the Sabres are winning or the prices are cheap that is fine. But understand there are consequences for that action it’s called the moving van. Again I am fine with Buffalo NHL or AHL hockey as long as Buffalo has some kind of hockey team. But I have a feeling that the ones complaining the most about restrooms and leg room would never go near a Buffalo AHL team replacement for the NHL Buffalo Sabres if it ever came to that. Yet howl the most about missing NHL hockey in Buffalo. I say this because Buffalo Sabres are down there NHL revenue wise today with Arizona Coyotes and Winnipeg Jets two NHL teams that are at risk for relocation. 

The Key Bank Center seating bowl changes only happen with public money that is the general public responsibility it’s in the Buffalo Sabres lease. The Sabres lease is coming up and we as a Western New York community are going to have a choice renew the lease with the upgrades that the Sabres want or not. I think as a Buffalo Sabres fan it comes down to just like the Buffalo Bills you either want major league sports or you don’t in Buffalo? There is a price for major league sports and there are plenty of cities that will take the Sabres off our hands if you want to do the Oakland as I call it. Which is absolutely nothing but complain and not go to games. The ticket prices are the ticket prices for major league sporting events today go or don’t go it seems pretty simple. But in sports regardless of the level you can’t guarantee winning. I wish you could but you can’t.

But I don’t want to hear complaining if the Buffalo Sabres leave town for the Buffalo AHL replacement you get what you pay for. Tickets are never coming down price wise and will always go up. When I read complaints about the restrooms and leg room in seats it tells me this may not be a major league sports town anymore sadly? You either love NHL hockey or you don’t? Seats and restrooms never entered into watching a hockey game for me. Again I am personally good either way Western New York community wants either to do the Oakland and become Rochester sports rivals keep it up.

The biggest problem with the Buffalo Sabres are that the Sabres players are too comfortable and the roster needs a major block buster trades. Eventually that is going to happen and I think it’s Alex Tuch he isn’t a clutch player and any where but Buffalo would be a try hard player on a third line. Alex Tuch isn’t ever going to be a star or a top 6 forward and too many Sabres fans can’t see that yet. Because Alex Tuch is a semi local player from Syracuse. But the reality is that Patrick Kane the Buffalo hometown player most didn’t want even at his age is a more skilled clutch player than an Alex Tuch now. But unfortunately Sabres fans don’t want to hear or accept that fact. Alex Tuch is at his ceiling he isn’t going to get better only older. Now is the time to move him while the Sabres can hopefully get a good return. I would bring in Patrick Kane in free agency and trade for John Tavares out of Toronto. Which I think John Tavares may come available in the summer after the Toronto Maple Leafs collapse in the NHL playoffs again. John Tavares would be the Sabres new captain and Patrick Kane an alternate captain. Completely remaking the culture and locker room for the current Buffalo Sabres in my opinion. Go Sabres!  Let’s Go Buffalo 

Pegula tried to get this paid for by the county and the county told him to kick rocks and that it was part of the lease agreement that he maintain the facility. 

That is all this is. These aren't upgrades. The jumbotron is nearly double the estimated life expectancy from the manufacturer. It should have been replaced nearly 10 years ago. The roof has never ever been replaced since it went up nearly 30 years ago in 1996. Terry is way behind on maintenance. 

These two replacements have zero to do with the longevity of the team in Buffalo and everything to do with his contractual obligation of the lease. 

Given the fact that multiple sources have cited that the arena could use $150M+ in upgrades (not just replacement/repair) a $10M display and a $5M roof are hardly an investment to get excited about.  In fact, I would posit that spending 20% or so of the estimated cost to upgrade the arena is a reasonable cause for concern. 

I am not sure the second bolded is true. It very well may be. But we know that the lease holder has for KBC has been held accountable for other upgrades in the past. 

https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/buffalo/its-desperately-in-need-are-improvements-on-the-way-for-keybank-center

Quote

"Under the operating agreement, upgrades and renovations fall on Crossroads Arena LLC and Niagara Frontier Hockey LLC. both of which are private entities, the first leases out the arena and the latter holds the Sabres franchise."

https://buffalonews.com/news/local/business/after-bills-stadium-deal-will-keybank-center-upgrades-become-next-priority/article_41cc63d6-2238-11ed-a23f-cff0095c9fe6.html

Quote

At this point, the county, which has an arena lease with the Sabres that expires in 2025, is not planning to put any funding toward renovations at the arena.

“Under the current lease, it is the responsibility of the team owner to do that,” said Peter Anderson, a spokesman for Erie County Executive Mark Poloncarz.

 

Edited February 26 by Mango

[Hank]

34 minutes ago, Mango said:

Pegula tried to get this paid for by the county and the county told him to kick rocks and that it was part of the lease agreement that he maintain the facility. 

That is all this is. These aren't upgrades. The jumbotron is nearly double the estimated life expectancy from the manufacturer. It should have been replaced nearly 10 years ago. The roof has never ever been replaced since it went up nearly 30 years ago in 1996. Terry is way behind on maintenance. 

These two replacements have zero to do with the longevity of the team in Buffalo and everything to do with his contractual obligation of the lease. 

Given the fact that multiple sources have cited that the arena could use $150M+ in upgrades (not just replacement/repair) a $10M display and a $5M roof are hardly an investment to get excited about.  In fact, I would posit that spending 20% or so of the estimated cost to upgrade the arena is a reasonable cause for concern. 

I am not sure the second bolded is true. It very well may be. But we know that the lease holder has for KBC has been held accountable for other upgrades in the past. 

https://www.wkbw.com/news/local-news/buffalo/its-desperately-in-need-are-improvements-on-the-way-for-keybank-center

https://buffalonews.com/news/local/business/after-bills-stadium-deal-will-keybank-center-upgrades-become-next-priority/article_41cc63d6-2238-11ed-a23f-cff0095c9fe6.html

 

"The lease expires in 2025"

Would someone more knowledgeable than I please explain what the possible options could be after the lease expires?

[pastajoe]

1 hour ago, Hank said:

"The lease expires in 2025"

Would someone more knowledgeable than I please explain what the possible options could be after the lease expires?

Pegula blackmails taxpayers to reduce the cost of the lease and/or pay for much of the needed renovations, or else he’ll sell the team to investors in Utah, Atlanta, Houston, or Quebec.

[mjd1001]

2 hours ago, Buffalo Super Fan said:

This is very good Buffalo Sabres news at least the Sabres are committed to staying in Buffalo. Buffalo fans know I am not a fan of Terry Pegula and I doubt I ever will be even if he finally wins a championship. Because I don’t care for his style of absentee ownership even with the Buffalo Bills it’s minimum at best so after getting that out of the way. 
 
Buffalo Sabres fans can do whatever they want it’s a free country. I would never tell anyone what they should do with their hard earned money or how to think. But understand complaining about seating leg room and restrooms is nonsense. The Buffalo Memorial Auditorium was a dump but we still went to games as Buffalo Sabres fans. The Key Bank Center restrooms today are 5 stars compared to the old Buffalo Memorial Auditorium or Buffalo War Memorial Stadium. If you don’t like sports anymore unless the Sabres are winning or the prices are cheap that is fine. But understand there are consequences for that action it’s called the moving van. Again I am fine with Buffalo NHL or AHL hockey as long as Buffalo has some kind of hockey team. But I have a feeling that the ones complaining the most about restrooms and leg room would never go near a Buffalo AHL team replacement for the NHL Buffalo Sabres if it ever came to that. Yet howl the most about missing NHL hockey in Buffalo. I say this because Buffalo Sabres are down there NHL revenue wise today with Arizona Coyotes and Winnipeg Jets two NHL teams that are at risk for relocation. 

The Key Bank Center seating bowl changes only happen with public money that is the general public responsibility it’s in the Buffalo Sabres lease. The Sabres lease is coming up and we as a Western New York community are going to have a choice renew the lease with the upgrades that the Sabres want or not. I think as a Buffalo Sabres fan it comes down to just like the Buffalo Bills you either want major league sports or you don’t in Buffalo? There is a price for major league sports and there are plenty of cities that will take the Sabres off our hands if you want to do the Oakland as I call it. Which is absolutely nothing but complain and not go to games. The ticket prices are the ticket prices for major league sporting events today go or don’t go it seems pretty simple. But in sports regardless of the level you can’t guarantee winning. I wish you could but you can’t.

But I don’t want to hear complaining if the Buffalo Sabres leave town for the Buffalo AHL replacement you get what you pay for. Tickets are never coming down price wise and will always go up. When I read complaints about the restrooms and leg room in seats it tells me this may not be a major league sports town anymore sadly? You either love NHL hockey or you don’t? Seats and restrooms never entered into watching a hockey game for me. Again I am personally good either way Western New York community wants either to do the Oakland and become Rochester sports rivals keep it up.

The biggest problem with the Buffalo Sabres are that the Sabres players are too comfortable and the roster needs a major block buster trades. Eventually that is going to happen and I think it’s Alex Tuch he isn’t a clutch player and any where but Buffalo would be a try hard player on a third line. Alex Tuch isn’t ever going to be a star or a top 6 forward and too many Sabres fans can’t see that yet. Because Alex Tuch is a semi local player from Syracuse. But the reality is that Patrick Kane the Buffalo hometown player most didn’t want even at his age is a more skilled clutch player than an Alex Tuch now. But unfortunately Sabres fans don’t want to hear or accept that fact. Alex Tuch is at his ceiling he isn’t going to get better only older. Now is the time to move him while the Sabres can hopefully get a good return. I would bring in Patrick Kane in free agency and trade for John Tavares out of Toronto. Which I think John Tavares may come available in the summer after the Toronto Maple Leafs collapse in the NHL playoffs again. John Tavares would be the Sabres new captain and Patrick Kane an alternate captain. Completely remaking the culture and locker room for the current Buffalo Sabres in my opinion. Go Sabres!  Let’s Go Buffalo 

Wow, so much here. I'd have no idea how to respond to this post...with a like, a dislike, laughing, thanks, Eyeroll....I can 100% get besides some of your post and totally disagree with others.  I have to think about this for a while...

[Hank]

1 hour ago, pastajoe said:

Pegula blackmails taxpayers to reduce the cost of the lease and/or pay for much of the needed renovations, or else he’ll sell the team to investors in Utah, Atlanta, Houston, or Quebec.

I can't tell if you're being serious or sarcastic. 

[Goldseatsaud]

4 hours ago, pastajoe said:

The scoreboard isn’t a priority for fans. Replacing the uncomfortable seats with inadequate leg room is. At 6’3’ I have to turn my legs to the side to fit.

Agree the lower bowl are terrible. I’m 6’3”. 

[TheAud]

1 hour ago, mjd1001 said:

Wow, so much here. I'd have no idea how to respond to this post...with a like, a dislike, laughing, thanks, Eyeroll....I can 100% get besides some of your post and totally disagree with others.  I have to think about this for a while...

Don’t respond…pretty sure it’s an AI post