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Building a Culture

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30 minutes ago, nfreeman said:

The Cowboys team that spanked the Bills in back—to-back SBs had a decidedly non-choir-boy character, but I think that most of them were very serious about winning and busted their butts to do so.  

Exactly my point. Culture is just a word. It’s bullshizz. Just win. 

How about instead of caring about building a culture of winning, you just cared about winning?

Does anyone think the Blues gave a ***** about building a culture of winning this year?

Just ***** win and shut the ***** up about culture.

Edited by SwampD
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29 minutes ago, SwampD said:

Exactly my point. Culture is just a word. It’s bullshizz. Just win. 

How about instead of caring about building a culture of winning, you just cared about winning?

Does anyone think the Blues gave a ***** about building a culture of winning this year?

Just ***** win and shut the ***** up about culture.

Yep.  

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On 8/12/2019 at 9:17 PM, Thorny said:

Culture is a byproduct of winning, not the other way around. 

This isn't wrong because in order to have a strong culture you have to be good enough to sit players down and/or ship them out of town when they don't buy in. Our problem has been we are so bad there's very little that can be done. JBot's definitely tried to identify the problems but it's really hard. ROR winning the cup was the worst thing that could have happened to this franchise. The only thing he can do now is hope their is leadership and work ethic from the kids and enough job competition to force players to step up. Granting further demands to exit will work against him now. 

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I feel like way too many times we don't think that athletes are people and not just talents and numbers. The environment someone is in matters, no matter who you are

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8 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

This isn't wrong because in order to have a strong culture you have to be good enough to sit players down and/or ship them out of town when they don't buy in. Our problem has been we are so bad there's very little that can be done. JBot's definitely tried to identify the problems but it's really hard. ROR winning the cup was the worst thing that could have happened to this franchise. The only thing he can do now is hope their is leadership and work ethic from the kids and enough job competition to force players to step up. Granting further demands to exit will work against him now. 

How is that?  Other than dropping from ~ 17-19 to 31, how did O'Reilly winning the SC screw the Sabres?  Yes, that was arguably the most embarrassing thing that could happen to them (in general & to Botterill/Pegula specifically); but it really didn't materially effect them unless Johnson ends up a bum and somebody that the Sabres were actually targeting in the dozen prior picks ends up a stud.

And there are several much worse things that could happen to the Sabres which will go unmentioned.

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"Culture" is a greatly over-used word these days.

I think it matters very little as compared to, for example, having a bunch of really good players.

Having said that, if there is a "culture" in Buffalo of all the players, starting with Eichel and moving down, not really giving a crap about what they are doing for a living, not putting in their best effort, and being content to drive a Mercedes SUV and bring in the big bucks while being a garbage hockey team, I agree that is a problem and has to be changed.

But good players winning games changes everything automatically.  

 

 

 

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15 hours ago, Taro T said:

How is that?  Other than dropping from ~ 17-19 to 31, how did O'Reilly winning the SC screw the Sabres?  Yes, that was arguably the most embarrassing thing that could happen to them (in general & to Botterill/Pegula specifically); but it really didn't materially effect them unless Johnson ends up a bum and somebody that the Sabres were actually targeting in the dozen prior picks ends up a stud.

And there are several much worse things that could happen to the Sabres which will go unmentioned.

Here's how. Players see what happened. Guy goes to Buffalo, let's everybody know the terrible effect it has on him ("lost my love of the game" etc.) demands to get out, gets out, regains his love of hockey wins the damn cup. What do you think that says to other players? Makes it easier to sign FAs without over paying them? I think not. Makes Buffalo look like a place you might want to play? I think not. Makes Buffalo look like a place to avoid at all costs? Definitely. Also can lead to other frustrated players thinking it went well for ROR so why not me? I want out too. It's a precedent and it can be a contagion. 

Hockey players aren't always the brightest lights but they do talk to each other and they do listen to their agents and if the perception is that getting out of Buffalo can help your career, how is that not the worst thing that can happen to a team desperately trying to create or build a new culture?

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Talent is important.  Culture is important.  It's not all one or the other, you need both.   Some players bring more talent, some bring more "not going to lose" attitude.  It's up to RFK to blend them all into a team.  To be successful, the whole must be greater than the sum of its parts.   It takes both talent AND culture.

image.png.a7a98978db089f79af11d61637b8fe07.png

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5 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

Here's how. Players see what happened. Guy goes to Buffalo, let's everybody know the terrible effect it has on him ("lost my love of the game" etc.) demands to get out, gets out, regains his love of hockey wins the damn cup. What do you think that says to other players? Makes it easier to sign FAs without over paying them? I think not. Makes Buffalo look like a place you might want to play? I think not. Makes Buffalo look like a place to avoid at all costs? Definitely. Also can lead to other frustrated players thinking it went well for ROR so why not me? I want out too. It's a precedent and it can be a contagion. 

Hockey players aren't always the brightest lights but they do talk to each other and they do listen to their agents and if the perception is that getting out of Buffalo can help your career, how is that not the worst thing that can happen to a team desperately trying to create or build a new culture?

So, how much cheaper would Johansson have signed for if not for O'Reilly winning the Stanley Cup?

Which FA's that signed elsewhere avoided the Sabres because of ROR's journey or other vets nixed trades to Buffalo?  Trouba?  He had a single year left on his deal and told the world he'd only sign an extension with the Rags due to his wife's residency.  So, not him.  Maybe somebody else?  Kessel?  Nope.  He nixed a trade to Minnesota.

What team did Skinner escape to so as to avoid Buffalo at all costs?

Totally understand that the O'Reilly situation is frustrating and embarrassing.  But really don't see that as the straw that broke the camel's back.  YMMV.

 

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3 hours ago, Taro T said:

So, how much cheaper would Johansson have signed for if not for O'Reilly winning the Stanley Cup?

Which FA's that signed elsewhere avoided the Sabres because of ROR's journey or other vets nixed trades to Buffalo?  Trouba?  He had a single year left on his deal and told the world he'd only sign an extension with the Rags due to his wife's residency.  So, not him.  Maybe somebody else?  Kessel?  Nope.  He nixed a trade to Minnesota.

What team did Skinner escape to so as to avoid Buffalo at all costs?

Totally understand that the O'Reilly situation is frustrating and embarrassing.  But really don't see that as the straw that broke the camel's back.  YMMV.

 

No, it's the strawman that people use to break everyone else's back.

But, let's use a single situation, in a single year, to define decades. 

"It's totally irrational so it must be the right thing to do".  - The 21st Century Schizoid Man.

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1 hour ago, LTS said:

No, it's the strawman that people use to break everyone else's back.

But, let's use a single situation, in a single year, to define decades. 

"It's totally irrational so it must be the right thing to do".  - The 21st Century Schizoid Man.

😕

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11 hours ago, Tondas said:

Talent is important.  Culture is important.  It's not all one or the other, you need both.   Some players bring more talent, some bring more "not going to lose" attitude.  It's up to RFK to blend them all into a team.  To be successful, the whole must be greater than the sum of its parts.   It takes both talent AND culture.

image.png.a7a98978db089f79af11d61637b8fe07.png

My God did I love that movie. And the craziest thing is that I was there at the 1980 Olympics. Snuck into that game and got booted out with my brother...but I was actually in the building for a couple minutes 🙂

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8 hours ago, Taro T said:

So, how much cheaper would Johansson have signed for if not for O'Reilly winning the Stanley Cup?

Which FA's that signed elsewhere avoided the Sabres because of ROR's journey or other vets nixed trades to Buffalo?  Trouba?  He had a single year left on his deal and told the world he'd only sign an extension with the Rags due to his wife's residency.  So, not him.  Maybe somebody else?  Kessel?  Nope.  He nixed a trade to Minnesota.

What team did Skinner escape to so as to avoid Buffalo at all costs?

Totally understand that the O'Reilly situation is frustrating and embarrassing.  But really don't see that as the straw that broke the camel's back.  YMMV.

 

Johanson was ignored by many teams because of his concussion history. We were far from his first choice, but a job's a job and we paid him well. The question for me is how motivated will he be? Wait and see. I don't know enough about the guy's character to say either way.

Skinner held JBot hostage and was grossly overpaid. I'm hoping he gives us a consistent performance, but I'm a little afraid that now he's got the money he'll become an uncoachable defensive liability. I'm hopeful he will want to star in his chosen locale, but I'm not sure which way that'll go. We might be moaning about him sooner than later.

As for the rest who knows? I'm not just talking about this year (I don't think JBot targeted many after Skinner) but it does set an image and you have to admit it doesn't help us or create the idea that it is a desirable place to be. 

We shall see. Maybe if it all clicks and we win they can flip it sooner than later and ROR will be a footnote. Let's hope.

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