Sabres Fan in NS Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 (edited) What gives? The Sabres on the good side of a SO and a PP goal in the same game. EDIT: Oh, yeah. It's the Kings. Edited December 10, 2014 by Sabres Fan In NS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted December 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 They hit because they don't have the puck. :lol: I'll take every win. (Here's the but) But......this is more of what I expected to see at the start of the season. I'm okay with it, but we will win when hard work and luck team up. This isn't a formula for winning consistently. Serious question: does such a formula exist with this roster? I agree with the sentiment posted upthread that the Sabres have a good #2 line and a good #4 line, and that's all she wrote in the forward ranks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 (edited) Serious question: does such a formula exist with this roster? I agree with the sentiment posted upthread that the Sabres have a good #2 line and a good #4 line, and that's all she wrote in the forward ranks. My best answer (opinion really) is not yet. . Here's the dilemma from my perspective. I can see some success coming from Nolan's style, the hard work, the counter-attack, the shell it back and catch rubber approach.....but at some point the younger players (in the organization, not necessarily on the roster) have to take center ice, go through the growing pains and start at least matching shots. When that happens it will feel like a step back for some time to ultimately progress ahead. A step back from this aint going to look pretty either. Truthfully I think I would rather see 5 to 4 OT losses matching chances at this point than 1-0 shutouts and getting out-chanced 3-1. It is better in terms of developing a roster going forward. I honestly think that's what Murray would prefer to see, much like Ottawa about 3 years ago. But that's mere conjecture on my part. Edited December 10, 2014 by X. Benedict Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Serious question: does such a formula exist with this roster? I say yes. They need to address specific areas of their game. They're getting the work ethic now. Maybe next up is puck possession. Champions? No. But consistent winners? Sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 It was (*sigh*) Harrington on Twitter (I no longer follow that troglodyte, but someone retweeted it) who said something that did genuinely prompt me to reflect about the McEichel derby: It was something ultimately along the lines of "the Kings are in town -- Stanley Cup champions twice in the last three years -- and somehow they've done that without a so-called generational player on the roster. Maybe the Sabres are trying to go the Kings route after all." I'm trying to find a place of zen when it comes to the Sabres playing their way out of the bottom 2. They may still end up there, but that is not the foregone conclusion it was last year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Having a hard time thinking of any game-changing, anchor-type centers that came out of nowhere in today's league. Reinhart would be our shot at it. Ryan O'Reilly is about the only one I could think of. If Reinhart becomes that, he wouldn't be out of no where. He was highly touted and still is. Zemgus is to some degree. He however was someone that many people had an eye on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crusader1969 Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 I think Kopitar was furious by the end of the game, he thrusted his stick into the concrete as they walked off after the game and I can understand why. Most of the game Girgs was his shadow and he was flattened by a big 19 year old. Great win! Great win? I know I am a full on Tank supporter but I've never watched such boring hockey. Wouldn't you rather see a 6-4 loss than what we had to sit through last night? I'm still sleepy today after 1 pot of coffee.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jsixspd Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 I find it really odd that about 6 members of the NBC broadcast could pronounce Jhonas correctly, but Milbury still refuses to. That's ok - I can accept that. I have trouble with Milbury's name too..... I keep pronouncing it as "A$$hole" instead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 (edited) Ryan O'Reilly is about the only one I could think of. O'Reilly certainly has the hype machine that would make you think he is a game-changing anchor-type centre. His numbers on the other hand... 2009-10 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 8 18 26 18 4 2010-11 Colorado Avalanche NHL 74 13 13 26 16 -7 2011-12 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 18 37 55 12 -1 2012-13 Magnitogorsk Metallurg KHL 12 5 5 10 2 6 2012-13 Colorado Avalanche NHL 29 6 14 20 4 -3 2013-14 Colorado Avalanche NHL 80 28 36 64 2 -1 2014-15 Colorado Avalanche NHL 28 4 11 15 4 -14 Looks more like Mike Richards to me. Edited December 10, 2014 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 (edited) Yep which is why they desperately need a center piece to build that offense around Zemgus is part of it but we all need one or both of Mikhail and Samson to work out. Yes. Very entertaining from the tension/battle perspective. A truth about this Sabres team that doesn't get enough posting: they hit. Seventeen hits in the first period alone. In the latter days of Darcy's Darlings we'd need six or seven periods to reach that total. And this was against the Stanley Cup champion LA Kings, hockey's heaviest team. How long have we been waiting for a team that finished its checks? Teddy is starting to make his mark. And this is starting to become a team I can root for. PS: Maybe Zadorov's best NHL game. Funny thing was when the 2013 draft was happening, I figured Zadorov was going to go to Philly. He was the perfect defender for them. Big, hard hitting, mobile defender with an edge. Then they went and drafted Morin. Winnipeg I didn't think would take him but Columbus and the Islanders I thought were good bets to. In the end one took Wennberg and the other took Pulock who I had ranked below Zadorov on my defense list for that draft. When we took him I was excited and annoyed. I wanted Mantha but seeing the results so far we may have gotten a steal at #16. Except Zemgus. Zemgus is Begotten, not made. Consubstantial with the Motherland. Through him, all wins are made. Latvia made love to Volcano while on vacation and 9months later Zemgus was born. The Legend of Zemgus grows. Really, I mean he's one of our best offensive talents and our best defensive forward. And he and Ennis are really clicking. I think the New Core is starting to come together. Line 1: ?, ?, ? Line 2: Ennis, Gus, ? Line 3: ?, Grigorenko?, ? Line 4: Deslauriers, ?, ? I actually think what you may end up with is Grigorenko - Reinhart - ? Ennis - Gus - ? I say that because if Grigorenko is out 3rd line center something is either very right or very wrong. I actual favor moving him to wing in the NHL to some extent (not sure that would happen) because he is a big body down low with a hell of nice shot who can also make crisp passes to the center of the ice. Also we really need some depth on the left side IMPO and if Grigorenko can play with Reinhart, good things could happen. O'Reilly certainly has the hype machine that would make you think he is a game-changing anchor-type centre. His numbers on the other hand... Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 8 18 26 18 4 6 1 0 1 2 2010-11 Colorado Avalanche NHL 74 13 13 26 16 -7 -- -- -- -- -- 2011-12 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 18 37 55 12 -1 -- -- -- -- -- 2012-13 Magnitogorsk Metallurg KHL 12 5 5 10 2 6 -- -- -- -- -- 2012-13 Colorado Avalanche NHL 29 6 14 20 4 -3 -- -- -- -- -- 2013-14 Colorado Avalanche NHL 80 28 36 64 2 -1 7 2 4 6 0 2014-15 Colorado Avalanche NHL 28 4 11 15 4 -14 Looks more like Mike Richards to me. His offensive numbers last year are 2nd line center numbers but you also need to account for his excellent defensive zone play. That is what makes him an Anchor. It was basically the only center that came to mind who had come out of "nowhere" and was an impact factor. Edited December 10, 2014 by LGR4GM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doohickie Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 I actually think what you may end up with isGrigorenko - Reinhart - ? Ennis - Gus - ? I say that because if Grigorenko is out 3rd line center something is either very right or very wrong. I actual favor moving him to wing in the NHL to some extent (not sure that would happen) because he is a big body down low with a hell of nice shot who can also make crisp passes to the center of the ice. Also we really need some depth on the left side IMPO and if Grigorenko can play with Reinhart, good things could happen. I won't argue that point. My point was that when you look at the other players I named (and are already on the team), you can see them taking over the team and setting a general tone for going forward. I like the tone so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 I'd never move grigs to the wing he is our most natural center we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted December 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 It was (*sigh*) Harrington on Twitter (I no longer follow that troglodyte, but someone retweeted it) who said something that did genuinely prompt me to reflect about the McEichel derby: It was something ultimately along the lines of "the Kings are in town -- Stanley Cup champions twice in the last three years -- and somehow they've done that without a so-called generational player on the roster. Maybe the Sabres are trying to go the Kings route after all." I'm trying to find a place of zen when it comes to the Sabres playing their way out of the bottom 2. They may still end up there, but that is not the foregone conclusion it was last year. Well, I'm as anti-tank as the next guy, but Doughty is probably the Kings' best player, and he was drafted #2 overall. And Harrington is a bozo. Ryan O'Reilly is about the only one I could think of. If Reinhart becomes that, he wouldn't be out of no where. He was highly touted and still is. Zemgus is to some degree. He however was someone that many people had an eye on. O'Reilly certainly has the hype machine that would make you think he is a game-changing anchor-type centre. His numbers on the other hand... 2009-10 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 8 18 26 18 4 2010-11 Colorado Avalanche NHL 74 13 13 26 16 -7 2011-12 Colorado Avalanche NHL 81 18 37 55 12 -1 2012-13 Magnitogorsk Metallurg KHL 12 5 5 10 2 6 2012-13 Colorado Avalanche NHL 29 6 14 20 4 -3 2013-14 Colorado Avalanche NHL 80 28 36 64 2 -1 2014-15 Colorado Avalanche NHL 28 4 11 15 4 -14 Looks more like Mike Richards to me. Beat me to it, although I would love (and I suspect TM and TN would too) a Mike Richards on this roster. If the Sabres could get O'Reilly without having to give up Myers, Risto or Nikita, I would be thrilled. Zemgus is part of it but we all need one or both of Mikhail and Samson to work out. I actually think what you may end up with is Grigorenko - Reinhart - ? Ennis - Gus - ? I say that because if Grigorenko is out 3rd line center something is either very right or very wrong. I actual favor moving him to wing in the NHL to some extent (not sure that would happen) because he is a big body down low with a hell of nice shot who can also make crisp passes to the center of the ice. Also we really need some depth on the left side IMPO and if Grigorenko can play with Reinhart, good things could happen. Griggy has 16 points in 24 AHL games this year. Not bad, and of course still too soon to know what his NHL ceiling is, but no one should assume he'll be a top-6 NHL player next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 (edited) Well, I'm as anti-tank as the next guy, but Doughty is probably the Kings' best player, and he was drafted #2 overall. And Harrington is a bozo. You know how painful it was for me to attribute anything to Harrington. But the point, I think, is well taken. Yes, Doughty was a high pick and prized prospect - but he wasn't discussed as a generational talent at the time of the draft. There's no one on the Kings who fits that description. And yet look at them. Edited December 10, 2014 by That Aud Smell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Huckleberry Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Beat me to it, although I would love (and I suspect TM and TN would too) a Mike Richards on this roster. If the Sabres could get O'Reilly without having to give up Myers, Risto or Nikita, I would be thrilled. Probably won't take much to get mike richards out of LA, they are in cap trouble for next year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 You know how painful it was for me to attribute anything to Harrington. But the point, I think, is well taken. Yes, Doughty was a high pick and prized prospect - but he wasn't discussed as a generational talent at the time of the draft. There's no one on the Kings who fits that description. And yet look at them. Who are the current "generational talents" in the NHL? Crosby, Ovi, and Stamkos(maybe)? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 You misspelled grigorenko Enroth making a case for a new contract lately. No. Reinhart is out big shot at the game-changing center. He's twice the prospect Grigorenko is. Grigorenko is looking like a good prospect (much better than the last two years), but he's not looking like the game-changing talent he once we considered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Who are the current "generational talents" in the NHL? Crosby, Ovi, and Stamkos(maybe)? Just Crosby, unless we're redefining "generational." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Ryan O'Reilly is about the only one I could think of. If Reinhart becomes that, he wouldn't be out of no where. He was highly touted and still is. Zemgus is to some degree. He however was someone that many people had an eye on. I was saying that Reinhart would be the one guy we have who could become that without coming out of nowhere. I just worded it poorly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Just Crosby, unless we're redefining "generational." yeah, I agree with this. the "LA" model could be renamed the "not Penguins Model" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 I'd like to echo the things said about O'Reilly. He's not "game-changing/anchor" type but he's probably a top five defensive center in the game who can contribute offensively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Aud Smell Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Who are the current "generational talents" in the NHL? Crosby, Ovi, and Stamkos(maybe)? Just Crosby, unless we're redefining "generational." yeah, I agree with this. the "LA" model could be renamed the "not Penguins Model" All more than fair. I was less focused on who's a generational talent in the league now (and it probably is just Crosby at this point), and more so on who was considered generational as an undrafted prospect. The Hockey's Future site probably has it right in its talent rankings, where it explains that a true "10" (a generationally talented prospect) comes around once a decade, or so. (Maybe the site suggests that there's generally 1 of them every 10 years per position? I'm not sure. No matter.) Drouin tops that site's list right now as a 9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted December 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 Probably won't take much to get mike richards out of LA, they are in cap trouble for next year. True -- I meant that I would love a Mike Richards in his youth, which is where O'Reilly is now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoss Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 True -- I meant that I would love a Mike Richards in his youth, which is where O'Reilly is now. It's a fantastic comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted December 10, 2014 Report Share Posted December 10, 2014 It was (*sigh*) Harrington on Twitter (I no longer follow that troglodyte, but someone retweeted it) who said something that did genuinely prompt me to reflect about the McEichel derby: It was something ultimately along the lines of "the Kings are in town -- Stanley Cup champions twice in the last three years -- and somehow they've done that without a so-called generational player on the roster. Maybe the Sabres are trying to go the Kings route after all." I'm trying to find a place of zen when it comes to the Sabres playing their way out of the bottom 2. They may still end up there, but that is not the foregone conclusion it was last year. :huh: What's Harrington thinking? I don't Tweeter (Tweet? What's the verb?) What's Drew Doughty? Chopped liver? the number 2 pick in 2008? First D chosen? "Generational Talent" is a drafting phrase that I believe was dreamed up as part of HockeyFuture's rating system years ago. Now it is a common phrase in hockey parlance.... it really has become silly in some respects. If you were re-drafting 2005.....who in their right minds would take someone other than Kopitar at #2 behind Crosby? LA has some studs on that roster. They haven't gone without. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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