Paul Hamilton: Two GMs tell him Darcy overvalues his players by quite a bit

[SDS]

Last night Paul Hamilton said on WGR that 2 different GMs have told him that when dealing with Darcy, that he asks waaaaay too much for his own players, effectively killing a lot of deals. FWIW. (I don't know if the other GMs are undervaluing them).

[dEnnis the Menace]

Last night Paul Hamilton said on WGR that 2 different GMs have told him that when dealing with Darcy, that he asks waaaaay too much for his own players, effectively killing a lot of deals. FWIW. (I don't know if the other GMs are undervaluing them).

.

 

It would be interesting to know which 2 GM's said that, but still interesting fun fact either way.

[Weave]

Last night Paul Hamilton said on WGR that 2 different GMs have told him that when dealing with Darcy, that he asks waaaaay too much for his own players, effectively killing a lot of deals. FWIW. (I don't know if the other GMs are undervaluing them).

 

Hamilton has been using that bit for a long time now. Interesting that he's come out and said that he got that tidbit from other GM's. Until now I assumed it was his own observation.

[dEnnis the Menace]

Hamilton has been using that bit for a long time now. Interesting that he's come out and said that he got that tidbit from other GM's. Until now I assumed it was his own observation.

 

Didn't know that. Being away from Buffalo, I don't listen to WGR often, so I miss a lot of what he says unless people post it here.

[Who Else?]

Paul Hamilton is one of the very few people with or involved with the Sabres I give any credibility to.

[inkman]

He also mentioned to Roy and Stafford that all the mouse potatoes (hehe) want them gone. Standard responses from both. Love playing here...yada, yada, yada.

[That Aud Smell]

thanks for that, scott.

 

i've heard hamilton say that in the past, without attribution. i agreed with him when he said as a matter of opinion, and believe him when he says that 2 other GM's believe it to be true.

 

mind you, darcy's certainly not the only GM who overvalues his players. but i think he is probably among the worst offenders when it comes to that flaw.

 

i'm more than a little sick and tired of saying it, but i will say it again: i just don't like the team that darcy has assembled. there are individuals whom i like and admire (24, 26, 57 (to use a hamilton twitter trick)), but the culture that this team exudes and exhibits is unpleasant to me.

[james duncan]

This is not hard to believe. I think many of us have felt this all along. The only significant roster changes have been via free agency--losses and gains. And another reason to support a move at GM first and foremost before other changes are made.

[LabattBlue]

If true, I don't find is surprising at all. Two things to take from this...

 

1. Darcy continues to adore the players he drafts/acquires.

 

2. He continues to be way too secure in his position as GM. Pegula and Black need to change that. He should be put on notice ASAP that at seasons end, injuries will not be used as an excuse.

 

...but the culture that this team exudes and exhibits is unpleasant to me.

 

Which is why IMO the problems go much deeper than a few injuries.

[K-9]

If I may play devil's advocate for moment, would anyone here be happy with a trade of any players that brought back less than our perceived value of those players?

 

GO SABRES!!!

[RazielSabre]

1. They are all going to say the, especially at the moment, they want good players for cheap.

2. I don't overly mind that, it's worked for us before.

 

BUT having said that I think, as mentioned about, Darcy needs to understand that his not immune from getting fired and that not every pick of his is golden. Sometimes you gotta trade 'em (cough Stafford cough).

[james duncan]

If I may play devil's advocate for moment, would anyone here be happy with a trade of any players that brought back less than our perceived value of those players?

 

GO SABRES!!!

True. But his players haven't won a playoff round in, what, four years? Pretty objective data to help him reach a conclusion one would think.

[That Aud Smell]

otoh, consider this factoid.

 

 

@VanekIsntLazy

Phil Prime

There are more #Sabres (Darcy) 1st & 2nd round picks on active rosters in the #nhl than from any other team/GM #HesAGoodGM

 

https://twitter.com/#!/VanekIsntLazy/status/149153626219220992

[james duncan]

1. They are all going to say the, especially at the moment, they want good players for cheap.

2. I don't overly mind that, it's worked for us before.

 

BUT having said that I think, as mentioned about, Darcy needs to understand that his not immune from getting fired and that not every pick of his is golden. Sometimes you gotta trade 'em (cough Stafford cough).

Actually, I think he realized this for the first time in years once the team was sold.

[HopefulFuture]

otoh, consider this factoid.

 

 

 

@VanekIsntLazy

Phil Prime

 

 

There are more #Sabres (Darcy) 1st & 2nd round picks on active rosters in the #nhl than from any other team/GM #HesAGoodGM

 

https://twitter.com/...153626219220992

 

So...............Buffalo is nothing more then a farm team under Regier?

 

Because that fact is bared out with this information.

[Cereal]

This is not hard to believe. I think many of us have felt this all along. The only significant roster changes have been via free agency--losses and gains. And another reason to support a move at GM first and foremost before other changes are made.

 

Hmm. Good point -- the fact that we have not traded away many players (especially vets) certainly says something about the value of our players in the eyes of the other teams in this league.

[K-9]

True. But his players haven't won a playoff round in, what, four years? Pretty objective data to help him reach a conclusion one would think.

 

I don't disagree with any of that. But when DR lets them go for a bag of pucks my guess is few will be very happy about it. Although, there is much to be said for the simple idea of addition by subtraction. I think we witnessed that last year when the team took off after Roy's injury.

 

GO SABRES!!!

[RazielSabre]

Actually, I think he realized this for the first time in years once the team was sold.

Fair point but we have had the same core for years, now might be the time to get rid of the bits of it that aren't working or could be worth as much/more on the trade market as they are here (Roy, Stafford, Ellis, Leopold, Sekera). Regiers inability to trade players like them bugs me, plus I've wanted him gone for about 3 years so I am more than a little bias (key point I understand).

[james duncan]

I don't disagree with any of that. But when DR lets them go for a bag of pucks my guess is few will be very happy about it. Although, there is much to be said for the simple idea of addition by subtraction. I think we witnessed that last year when the team took off after Roy's injury.

 

GO SABRES!!!

I don't hate Darcy. I don't think he is a bad GM--far from it. I do think he has lost his ability to be effective in Buffalo. I think he would have no problem getting a new job and I think the right GM in Buffalo would step into a great situation with regard to ownership, prospects and the ability to quickly revamp a lineup that needs it badly.

[That Aud Smell]

So...............Buffalo is nothing more then a farm team under Regier?

 

Because that fact is bared out with this information.

 

that wasn't my take at all, no.

 

my take was that, while darcy may be rightly criticized for over-valuing his players, he and his scouting department can also fairly be judged as a superior judge of talent, since they have effectively "placed" the most #1's and #2's into the nhl.

[SDS]

 

 

that wasn't my take at all, no.

 

my take was that, while darcy may be rightly criticized for over-valuing his players, he and his scouting department can also fairly be judged as a superior judge of talent, since they have effectively "placed" the most #1's and #2's into the nhl.

 

Identifying talent that sticks and identifying talent that excels aren't necessarily the same thing.

[james duncan]

that wasn't my take at all, no.

 

my take was that, while darcy may be rightly criticized for over-valuing his players, he and his scouting department can also fairly be judged as a superior judge of talent, since they have effectively "placed" the most #1's and #2's into the nhl.

If they are playing like first and second round picks then maybe so. But if they are third and fourth liners or fifth and sixth d-men, then maybe not. Seems to me that they hit a lot of singles and doubles but very few if any homeruns. I could be way too harsh though too.

[spndnchz]

I would think most GM's overvalue their players. They have to otherwise they'd get taken to the cleaner all the time. As for 2 GM's think DR overvalues his players? Hamilton's not reaching on that one. I'm sure you could find at least 2 GM's out of 30 that think the same about other teams GM's.

 

I'd need to look at the amount of those 1 and 2's that just left to UFA because the organization wouldn't pay up. I can live without DR but what we've seen from him recently is signing guys to longer deals, earlier. IMO he wasn't allowed to do that in the past. Will it work out? Who knows. Some trades do need to happen here even if it's for a few picks and a "future favor".

[K-9]

Just wondering. Are there two GMs in the league who think any other GM UNDER-values his players by just a little, let alone quite a bit?

 

GO SABRES!!!

[HopefulFuture]

that wasn't my take at all, no.

 

my take was that, while darcy may be rightly criticized for over-valuing his players, he and his scouting department can also fairly be judged as a superior judge of talent, since they have effectively "placed" the most #1's and #2's into the nhl.

 

yes, I can get onboard with this assessment. I'd support Darcy as head of scouting. As long as we bring in another GM.