GDT: Buffalo Sabres @ Toronto Maple Leaves 25 Oct 2025 5:00 pm ET TV: MSG-B, SN1, Radio: WGR 550

[DarthEbriate]

2 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Perhaps, but he’s an Ellis-blocking anchor in the meantime. With his career numbers, what do you project we get in a trade? Imo, it’s little at best. He needs to be jettisoned. 

Husso got Future Considerations last year.

The thing about Luukkonen is that he's got 3 years left at 4.75M. If you're a GM, are you taking that risk? You'll lose your job if you bet on him.

Maybe a team planning to tank next season that needs to get to the cap would do it. But...  no one is doing that right now. The tanking teams already have those guys. Boston already has a Korpisalo. Pittsburgh already has a Jarry. The teams that just tanked (CHI, SJ) don't want him on their books for 3 seasons when they're going to be on the rise.

[CTJoe]

2 minutes ago, HILLsabre said:

Too easy to blame goalie play. Look deeper folks. Too much cheating and soft play on defense. Owen Power is as much as a liability as Dylan Cozens was on this team. Lindy needs to ride his backside until he learns to play defense. Send him packing if it's not his nature!

It's easy blame the goalie when he should have given up 2 goals and led us to a 5-2 victory (empty net). FCK you Power b6tching - he was fine today and was a direct result of one of our goals. He's an easy target but was very good today. Puck jumped on him in ot, tage couldn't get back in time and UPL choked per usual

[K-9]

Just now, mjd1001 said:

I think if you try to trade him, there are probably a bunch of teams that might look at him 2 years ago, see his size, his 'pedigree' (Draft status) and say they would take a shot with him.  

But 'taking a shot' means you aren't going to give up much.

20 games two years ago. That’s the extent of his experience as a competent NHL goalie. The rest of his pro career, including the AHL, is less than mediocre. If KA thinks teams are gonna line up for that and insists on waiting for the “right” deal, good luck. But in the meantime he shouldn’t be playing and that’s just a worst situation all the way around. 

[DarthEbriate]

4 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

I don't think it was a decision. Ellis woke up not feeling well 

Right. So then it's Lyon and Ellis as the backup. Luukkonen is still conditioning. Easy.

Just now, K-9 said:

20 games two years ago. That’s the extent of his experience as a competent NHL goalie. The rest of his pro career, including the AHL, is less than mediocre. If KA thinks teams are gonna line up for that and insists on waiting for the “right” deal, good luck. But in the meantime he shouldn’t be playing and that’s just a worst situation all the way around. 

Yup. His fantastic run got him all the way up to ... .910%. Which is above league average, but... 15th-ish in the league. Nothing elite. And that means that his other 30 games were... his normal output.

And I love his name!

[mjd1001]

6 minutes ago, HILLsabre said:

Too easy to blame goalie play. Look deeper folks. Too much cheating and soft play on defense. Owen Power is as much as a liability as Dylan Cozens was on this team. Lindy needs to ride his backside until he learns to play defense. Send him packing if it's not his nature!

I'm going to disagree big time on Power being a liability.  On this board he often gets blamed (like on the goal yesterday) when in reality a lot of the D-men on this team are 'hung out to dry' and look bad due to the forwards not getting back in time or makign mistakes.  Yeah, he has some bad moments, but I think Power has looked a lot better this year than last year.

I do agree with your overall point, that it isn't just UPL this game. He wasn't good, but the rest of the team?  Not terrible, but not their best game. It was a pretty even game positionally between a banged up Leafs team and a banged up Sabres team, with sloppiness on both sides.

[K-9]

1 minute ago, DarthEbriate said:

Husso got Future Considerations last year.

The thing about Luukkonen is that he's got 3 years left at 4.75M. If you're a GM, are you taking that risk? You'll lose your job if you bet on him.

Maybe a team planning to tank next season that needs to get to the cap would do it. But...  no one is doing that right now. The tanking teams already have those guys. Boston already has a Korpisalo. Pittsburgh already has a Jarry. The teams that just tanked (CHI, SJ) don't want him on their books for 3 seasons when they're going to be on the rise.

Right. So just waive him and bite his AAV. He is never gonna be the workhorse, 55 game starter in this league. He’s a backup 25 game goalie at best. At best. Let him get a fresh start somewhere else. 

[CTJoe]

2 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

Right. So then it's Lyon and Ellis as the backup. Luukkonen is still conditioning. Easy.

Yup. His fantastic run got him all the way up to ... .910%. Which is above league average, but... 15th-ish in the league. Nothing elite. And that means that his other 30 games were... his normal output.

And I love his name!

Yep and the normal UPL (last year and the 2 years before) ranked like 60th in most important goalie stats.

[HumanSlinky39]

Okay, so Ellis wasn't ready to go. Okay. Then call up Levi. UPL shouldn't be seeing NHL action yet and he has a horrific track record against the Leafs. I hate how much this organization loves self-flaggelation.

[mjd1001]

3 minutes ago, K-9 said:

20 games two years ago. That’s the extent of his experience as a competent NHL goalie. The rest of his pro career, including the AHL, is less than mediocre. If KA thinks teams are gonna line up for that and insists on waiting for the “right” deal, good luck. But in the meantime he shouldn’t be playing and that’s just a worst situation all the way around. 

Goalies have a tendency to have really bad years and bounce back, and they have really good years that sometimes are just a 'career year'.  Overall, you know what you usually are as a goalie? What your long term stats say you are. Not as bad as your worst year, but not as good as your best. 

So what does that make UPL?  He's a guy with a GAA just about 3, and a Save% just below .900.  Slightly worse overall career numbers than Alex Lyon.

[rickshaw]

Time for KA to be big boy and cut the cord on UPL. They simply cannot afford to wait and see. 

[CTJoe]

1 minute ago, HumanSlinky39 said:

Okay, so Ellis wasn't ready to go. Okay. Then call up Levi. UPL shouldn't be seeing NHL action yet and he has a horrific track record against the Leafs. I hate how much this organization loves self-flaggelation.

Adams isn't good with common sense

[pastajoe]

3 minutes ago, HumanSlinky39 said:

Okay, so Ellis wasn't ready to go. Okay. Then call up Levi. UPL shouldn't be seeing NHL action yet and he has a horrific track record against the Leafs. I hate how much this organization loves self-flaggelation.

Like Lyons, Levi just played last night.

[HumanSlinky39]

3 minutes ago, pastajoe said:

Like Lyons, Levi just played last night.

Okay, fine. Suit up the goddamn Zamboni driver. The Leafs always lose to those guys.

Edited 3 hours ago by HumanSlinky39

[PASabreFan]

Gotta be Lyon Tuesday, no?

[mjd1001]

7 minutes ago, pastajoe said:

Like Lyons, Levi just played last night.

If Ellis woke up with a sore back, and Lyons is starting to deal with a heavy workload as a 30+ year old goalie, it made sense to go with UPL tonight.

IF all those things are true, I'm OK with the decision. But what the result shows you (and what you can see with your eyes) is just one more little piece to add to the pile of reasons UPL maybe should be the odd man out going forward.

Just now, PASabreFan said:

Gotta be Lyon Tuesday, no?

With almost 4 days off between his games, I would think yes.

[DarthEbriate]

18 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Right. So just waive him and bite his AAV. He is never gonna be the workhorse, 55 game starter in this league. He’s a backup 25 game goalie at best. At best. Let him get a fresh start somewhere else. 

Adams has to convince his boss to buy him out and keep paying him for a few more years any. And take the extra cap hit in addition to Skinner.

[Jorcus]

16 minutes ago, rickshaw said:

Time for KA to be big boy and cut the cord on UPL. They simply cannot afford to wait and see. 

Not going to happen.

2 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

Adams has to convince his boss to buy him out and keep paying him for a few more years any. And take the extra cap hit in addition to Skinner.

Not going to happen

[Jorcus]

22 minutes ago, K-9 said:

Right. So just waive him and bite his AAV. He is never gonna be the workhorse, 55 game starter in this league. He’s a backup 25 game goalie at best. At best. Let him get a fresh start somewhere else. 

Less money to pay Tuch or Benson or anyone else. Not going to happen.

[zow2]

As others have said the problem i have with UPL is his penchant for giving up mid-late 3rd period goals.  Thats the money time when a lot of games are tied or you are up 1 or down 1 and need a save. But maybe even getting to OT is improvement.  Certainly we have lost plenty of games the last few seasons by giving up the late 3rd period goal to break a tie. and UPL has been in the net for a lot of those.

[kas23]

34 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

I don't think it was a decision. Ellis woke up not feeling well 

 

 

I wake up every morning not feeling well. I just don’t think we’re getting the full story here. UPL goes down to the AHL and players a single (godamn) conditioning game, then is inexplicably called up after a rookie showed up the best team in the Atlantic division. Now we learn Ellis “wasn’t 100%”. Something is rotten in Denmark, but I’m sure we already knew this. My guess is KA got bullied by UPL’s agent.

[SABRES 0311]

This game reminds me of when Wolf “The Dentist” Stansson told Gunnar Stahl, “you lost it for me.”

[LGR4GM]

49 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

UPL was -1.7 Goals Saved Above Expected 

[Scottysabres]

UPL never has to make a save if Owen freaking Power buries that one on one against the goalie instead of letting the puck slip off his blade and on to the waiting stick of a leafs players. Ridiculous, just ridiculous.

[LGR4GM]

31 minutes ago, mjd1001 said:

Goalies have a tendency to have really bad years and bounce back, and they have really good years that sometimes are just a 'career year'.  Overall, you know what you usually are as a goalie? What your long term stats say you are. Not as bad as your worst year, but not as good as your best. 

So what does that make UPL?  He's a guy with a GAA just about 3, and a Save% just below .900.  Slightly worse overall career numbers than Alex Lyon.

You're just describing what the term "average" means. 

[DarthEbriate]

10 minutes ago, Jorcus said:

Not going to happen.

Not going to happen

7 minutes ago, Jorcus said:

Less money to pay Tuch or Benson or anyone else. Not going to happen.

Yup. But no sane GM is trading for a just-below-average goalie on that salary and term. You can bury him each October in Rochester. Lowers the cap hit, doesn't lower the payout from the owner.

And... I'm not going to forget it... they're also paying Georgiev because they were unwilling to play hardball and get a PTO from someone.

But --- more importantly --- Luukkonen could be part of a tandem with Lyon (potentially, at least -- if you get good -- staying in his net and not leaning forward Luukkonen). He just shouldn't be in the lineup this early. He shouldn't have been called up until he had made at least two, and preferably 3, rehab starts.