LGR4GM Posted March 17, 2011 Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Sense there has been an attempt by some to discuss anything happening this summer and because it should be kept to a single thread, If you would like to legitimately discuss trades or UFA/RFA that this team could use or should avoid post it here and save the news and facts hockey talk for the other threads. If you dislike this type of conjecture than do not read this thread but at the least it will help confine the talk to one area. To begin: St. Louis is up for sale and they have TJ Oshie who plays center up as a RFA, they could be a team the sabres look at this summer because players who are not signed may be expendable to help keep cost down but buyer interest up. http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/blog/puck_daddy/post/What-St-Louis-Blues-8216-for-sale-8217-sign;_ylt=Aq39bzCR1UEAsLV05LKHFbV7vLYF?urn=nhl-wp521 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SabresMojo Posted March 17, 2011 Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Would Oshie be an upgrade for something we'd lose though? What are his numbers on faceoffs? Aslong as we UPGRADE from what we got, then we'll be good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 17, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Would Oshie be an upgrade for something we'd lose though? What are his numbers on faceoffs? Aslong as we UPGRADE from what we got, then we'll be good I realize now looking at it that I meant Berglund not Oshie, but Berglund is big 6'4" 210pds, FO% 46.9 and has 45pts this season and is better than TC so just something interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Would likely have to grossly overpay ($4M) to hopefully get them to not match the offer sheet. Not sure I'd like the idea of giving up the picks and the money on a long term deal to either Oshie or Berglund. $994,433 or below - No Compensation $994,434 - $1,506,717 - 2010 3rd round pick $1506,718 - $3,013,433 - 2010 2nd round pick $3,013,433 - $4,520,150 - 2010 1st round pick, 2010 3rd round pick $4,520,151 - $6,026,867 - 2010 1st round pick, 2010 2nd round pick, 2010 3rd round pick $6,026,868 - $7,533,584 - 2010 1st round pick, 2011 1st round pick, 2010 2nd round pick, 2010 3rd round pick Over $7,533,584 - 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013 1st round picks. I prefer the idea of signing Brooks Laich, may cost $4M on the open market but would be an upgrade. I also like the idea of retaining Connolly for $2M or less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 berglund is interesting because he plays on a weak team but still seems to show up. Be interestn to hear what boyes had to say about him. I wonder if you could trade for him and even if it took a 1/3 you wouldnt have to give up 4mil maybe more like 2.5-3, Berglund has one thing though we lack, size. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 I wonder what maximus thinks about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derrico Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 berglund is interesting because he plays on a weak team but still seems to show up. Be interestn to hear what boyes had to say about him. I wonder if you could trade for him and even if it took a 1/3 you wouldnt have to give up 4mil maybe more like 2.5-3, Berglund has one thing though we lack, size. We don't really lack size, just people willing to use that size. Seeing a guy that's 6'4 or whatever is fine but if they play like they're as tall as Gerbe then that won't help us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloSoldier2010 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Honestly i think we need to actually expect some kind of big move over the summer. I expect to sign a big name center. Am i getting my hopes up? maybe. But if Pegula is going to make good on his three year plan, and he's already done pretty well with the million little things, then thats going to be the kind of move we need with the first summer under his ownership. It will send a message not only to the rest of the league that we're gunning for the cup, but as a motivator to our locker room. We need to make it clear that we're doing what it takes, and if you're not jumping on board you're out. Shipping out Connolly would be an excellent example of this, but i still like the idea of having him as a third line center for no more than 2-mil a year. It's unlikely he would agree to such terms, but hey, a man can dream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Honestly i think we need to actually expect some kind of big move over the summer. I expect to sign a big name center. Am i getting my hopes up? maybe. But if Pegula is going to make good on his three year plan, and he's already done pretty well with the million little things, then thats going to be the kind of move we need with the first summer under his ownership. It will send a message not only to the rest of the league that we're gunning for the cup, but as a motivator to our locker room. We need to make it clear that we're doing what it takes, and if you're not jumping on board you're out. Shipping out Connolly would be an excellent example of this, but i still like the idea of having him as a third line center for no more than 2-mil a year. It's unlikely he would agree to such terms, but hey, a man can dream. While I am seriously on 'the Sabres need a (or actually a pair of) top line center(s)' bandwagon; I don't see a whole lot of them available this off-season on the FA market. I'd love to see them get Richards, but if it doesn't happen I'm not moving to DeLucaville. Except for center, the Sabres are in pretty good shape up front. If they can't land Richards, I'd be fine w/ an upgrade at D. Remember, to get to a SC championship in 3 years, you can bring in the stud center(s) in year 2 or 3 if he (they) ain't there in year 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloSoldier2010 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 While I am seriously on 'the Sabres need a (or actually a pair of) top line center(s)' bandwagon; I don't see a whole lot of them available this off-season on the FA market. I'd love to see them get Richards, but if it doesn't happen I'm not moving to DeLucaville. Except for center, the Sabres are in pretty good shape up front. If they can't land Richards, I'd be fine w/ an upgrade at D. Remember, to get to a SC championship in 3 years, you can bring in the stud center(s) in year 2 or 3 if he (they) ain't there in year 1. Absolutely true. And there's nothing wrong with your logic at all that works just as well as anything, but i feel like if we accomplish some kind of aggressive trade move in the off season, it will really send a message that will set the tone for the mentality of this organization for years. This can obviously be set in year two or three as well, but i like sooner than later, even though its better late than never. :beer: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 I wonder what maximus thinks about it? My name is Maximus Decimus Meridius, commander of the Armies of the North, General of the Felix Legions, loyal servant to the true emperor, Marcus Aurelius. Father to a murdered son, husband to a murdered wife. And I will have my vengeance, in this life or the next. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumb_dumb88 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 While I am seriously on 'the Sabres need a (or actually a pair of) top line center(s)' bandwagon; I don't see a whole lot of them available this off-season on the FA market. I'd love to see them get Richards, but if it doesn't happen I'm not moving to DeLucaville. Except for center, the Sabres are in pretty good shape up front. If they can't land Richards, I'd be fine w/ an upgrade at D. Remember, to get to a SC championship in 3 years, you can bring in the stud center(s) in year 2 or 3 if he (they) ain't there in year 1. Morning Taro. I am in your line of thinking on this. The team has an abundance of skilled wingers under contract for next season. I.E. left wing, Vanek, Ennis....right wing, Pominville, Boyes, Stafford. With the return of Derek Roy next season as the scoring line 2 center I am of the belief that it isn't a pair of top line centers that are needed, but more of a true stud/superstar scoring line 1 center and a 2 way forward for line 3 center that has the potential to net 50 points and be a somewhat effective shutdown line leader as well. I think Luke Adam show promise as that line 3 solution. He has the size and scoring touch, although I must confess, I question his skating to some extent and it was very clear, atleast to myself, that he needs to take full advantage of this season in Portland. I would like to see Adam in Portland again next season to continue his development, I just don't see a reason to rush the kid up to the NHL and the time frame you mention in that last sentence would make sense on this. I would also believe that with all of these skilled wingers in Buffalo we have options on a trade, I don't know if that would be enough to bring in a true superstar center, but I do wonder if these wingers combined with how the organization is changing the image of the Sabres to a very player and player family friendly environment would tempt a guy like Richards to atleast consider Buffalo as a possible destination if he were to come available. But overall, I do agree that 2 centers need to be added. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 berglund is interesting because he plays on a weak team but still seems to show up. Be interestn to hear what boyes had to say about him. I wonder if you could trade for him and even if it took a 1/3 you wouldnt have to give up 4mil maybe more like 2.5-3, Berglund has one thing though we lack, size. St. Louis isn't going to trade him to you for less then what the RFA tender would cost for you to sign him. You have to look at it from both sides, they're not just going to do the Sabres a solid and give them Berglund at his current contract for what it would cost for them to sign him to a lucrative long term contract. Therefore, if you want him and don't want to have to pay him you're talking player for player trades as they're not really rebuilding and even if they were Berglund would likely be part of that rebuild. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Would likely have to grossly overpay ($4M) to hopefully get them to not match the offer sheet. Not sure I'd like the idea of giving up the picks and the money on a long term deal to either Oshie or Berglund. $994,433 or below - No Compensation $994,434 - $1,506,717 - 2010 3rd round pick $1506,718 - $3,013,433 - 2010 2nd round pick $3,013,433 - $4,520,150 - 2010 1st round pick, 2010 3rd round pick $4,520,151 - $6,026,867 - 2010 1st round pick, 2010 2nd round pick, 2010 3rd round pick $6,026,868 - $7,533,584 - 2010 1st round pick, 2011 1st round pick, 2010 2nd round pick, 2010 3rd round pick Over $7,533,584 - 2010, 2011, 2012, 2013 1st round picks. I prefer the idea of signing Brooks Laich, may cost $4M on the open market but would be an upgrade. I also like the idea of retaining Connolly for $2M or less. Teams just aren't going to go the offer sheet route. It just doesn't happen in this league. So if you want a guy like that, it will have to be done through the trade route. There is one quick detail that does need to be kept in mind though. The Sabres do not have their 2nd round pick next year. Unless they get it back, they cannot make any offer that calls for a 2nd rounder as compensation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumb_dumb88 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Teams just aren't going to go the offer sheet route. It just doesn't happen in this league. So if you want a guy like that, it will have to be done through the trade route. There is one quick detail that does need to be kept in mind though. The Sabres do not have their 2nd round pick next year. Unless they get it back, they cannot make any offer that calls for a 2nd rounder as compensation. Kevin Lowe of the Edmonton Oilers says hello. The fact is, offer sheets are rare, but they do indeed happen. Example: Thomas Vanek. To simply dismiss the offer sheet route because it doesn't happen very often (for various reasons) isn't prudent in my opinion. As for Buffalo's ability given the lack of a 2nd round pick, I am sure that can be quickly remedied, it's really a non issue. I will say I don't disagree with the sentiment you attempted to convey, specifically tha the likelihood of an offer sheet from Buffalo to a player is near zero chance, about the only player I would see as plausible is Stamkos, and this has already been hashed out in multiple threads with the overlaying consensus being he will never see RFA offer sheet status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Kevin Lowe of the Edmonton Oilers says hello. The fact is, offer sheets are rare, but they do indeed happen. Example: Thomas Vanek. To simply dismiss the offer sheet route because it doesn't happen very often (for various reasons) isn't prudent in my opinion. As for Buffalo's ability given the lack of a 2nd round pick, I am sure that can be quickly remedied, it's really a non issue. Presenting an example from 4 years ago doesn't really back up the idea that it could happen. Take a look at this list (it's wikipedia, but it does look accurate to me). 6 offer sheets in total since the lockout (1 in the last 2 seasons) and only one player actually switched teams. It's not just a coincidence, teams do not want to go that route. If they want a guy, they're going to trade. They have far more control in that scenario. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumb_dumb88 Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Presenting an example from 4 years ago doesn't really back up the idea that it could happen. Take a look at this list (it's wikipedia, but it does look accurate to me). 6 offer sheets in total since the lockout (1 in the last 2 seasons) and only one player actually switched teams. It's not just a coincidence, teams do not want to go that route. If they want a guy, they're going to trade. They have far more control in that scenario. Like I said, just because it rarely happens doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And as I also stated, I tend to agree with the sentiment you conveyed. If it is indeed a trade (which I am in agreeance with you, this is the route the Sabres will go) it's almost certainly coming on draft day. If you recall Regier's interview immediately following the trade deadline this season, he stated he is going to revisit some discussions that didn't bare fruit at the deadline. Which, in my opinion was due to the inflated pricing of talent at this time of the season, and particularly this season, for some reason teams were more willing to move high end draft picks for mid to low end talent, i.e. Fisher, Versteeg. This could be interpreted as a low quality draft class, or it could be viewed as certain teams actual belief in their own ability to make a run for the Cup this season, although, the Fisher trade I would suspect had as much to do about marketing to the Nashville crowd given his marriage to Underwood. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Like I said, just because it rarely happens doesn't mean it doesn't happen. And as I also stated, I tend to agree with the sentiment you conveyed. If it is indeed a trade (which I am in agreeance with you, this is the route the Sabres will go) it's almost certainly coming on draft day. If you recall Regier's interview immediately following the trade deadline this season, he stated he is going to revisit some discussions that didn't bare fruit at the deadline. Which, in my opinion was due to the inflated pricing of talent at this time of the season, and particularly this season, for some reason teams were more willing to move high end draft picks for mid to low end talent, i.e. Fisher, Versteeg. This could be interpreted as a low quality draft class, or it could be viewed as certain teams actual belief in their own ability to make a run for the Cup this season, although, the Fisher trade I would suspect had as much to do about marketing to the Nashville crowd given his marriage to Underwood. Your bolded line was the first thing that came to mind for me. Except, I'm thinking about it from the perspective that teams didn't want to make a particular deal because they still thought they had a reasonable shot at making the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanny Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Teams just aren't going to go the offer sheet route. It just doesn't happen in this league. So if you want a guy like that, it will have to be done through the trade route. There is one quick detail that does need to be kept in mind though. The Sabres do not have their 2nd round pick next year. Unless they get it back, they cannot make any offer that calls for a 2nd rounder as compensation. The lack of offer sheeting was kind of my point. If the Sabres were to trade for him they'd have to give up more than what the Blues would get from an offer sheet. Especially since the team getting the player wouldn't have to pay the higher salary. In turn, the Blues arent a rebuilding team, they're more building on the fly. So it seems that 22 year old former 1st round picks would be the types of guys you'd build around, not trade for picks. I guess what I'm saying is the only way I view possible to get a player like Berglund would be ridiculous overpayment with current roster players who have more upside than he (so Pominville, Hecht, Stafford, Gerbe all out), or an offer sheet that they can't match (which costs you tons of picks). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 The thing thats curious is that there are teams/ centers that could become available a year from now. Most of these players, couture, sharp, others will be signed. However the time to trade would be this summer, we have huge depth at rw and we have defensive prospects everywhere. How often do first round picks bust? Especially later in the round. We have a first round pick still so we have so bargaining chips. What black and regier and pegula and ruff are thinking of IDK, but something is coming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maximus_Decimus Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Why are there so many good or at least decent RFA centers like Dubinsky and obviously Stamkos. If any year would see an offer sheet go out, this year would be it. And I am Maximus Decimus Meridius. ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 The lack of offer sheeting was kind of my point. If the Sabres were to trade for him they'd have to give up more than what the Blues would get from an offer sheet. Especially since the team getting the player wouldn't have to pay the higher salary. In turn, the Blues arent a rebuilding team, they're more building on the fly. So it seems that 22 year old former 1st round picks would be the types of guys you'd build around, not trade for picks. I guess what I'm saying is the only way I view possible to get a player like Berglund would be ridiculous overpayment with current roster players who have more upside than he (so Pominville, Hecht, Stafford, Gerbe all out), or an offer sheet that they can't match (which costs you tons of picks). I'm just hoping to get out the message of how rare those offer sheets really are. Your post seemed like the perfect one to quote, especially with the detail about the Sabres lack of a 2nd round pick, since it spelled out the compensation costs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 I'm just hoping to get out the message of how rare those offer sheets really are. Your post seemed like the perfect one to quote, especially with the detail about the Sabres lack of a 2nd round pick, since it spelled out the compensation costs. Offer sheets are rare no question, and yes we dont have a second but does it have to be this years second if that did happen. I feel like there is some leeway like you can say next years. If an offer sheet is made it will demonstrate that this team cares about being better now, I just do not seem them waiting another year to get the essentials. Honestly though after hearing what tedd black said about something big was gonna happen but maybe this summer, it sounds like we had a deal going with a team in playoff or cup contention that decided to go for it. The summer could change things. Players value fluctuate and who knows maybe you do convince a SJ or a Chicago to trade us something really good. We shall see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 I'm just hoping to get out the message of how rare those offer sheets really are. Your post seemed like the perfect one to quote, especially with the detail about the Sabres lack of a 2nd round pick, since it spelled out the compensation costs. It is so unusual to have an offer sheet extended because the compensation appears to be designed to overcompensate the team losing the player. Stamkos just may be an exception this year. A guy at his level may very well be worth four 1st round picks. Certainly if you traded straight up for an already signed Stamkos TB would be looking for the equivalent of four 1st round picks worthy on-ice talent coming back. Heck, they might demand even more than that for a straight up trade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 I am being very hypothetical at this point. IF, Stamkos hits JULY 1 and we send and offer sheet and it gets accepted, could we trade tampa something so they would not match the offer sheet like a player? We all know that Stamkos, if acquired would fundamentally change this team and thats what we need, something huge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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