Kristian Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Sounds like this dude is more of a numbers/marketing guy than a hockey guy. While that stuff is important, I'm more concerned about the hockey department guys. I think Quinn got too involved on the player end so comparing this dudes rule to quinn's may be a little bit of an exaggeration. But the title may still be similar. I think the article more means Black is to Pegula, as Quinn is to Golisano, not Black is to the Sabres as Quinn was to the sabres. If that makes sense. I realize most of you haven't taken the SATs in a good long time. Yeah, I get..... Nope, lost me......... :thumbsup: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R_Dudley Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Sounds like this dude is more of a numbers/marketing guy than a hockey guy. While that stuff is important, I'm more concerned about the hockey department guys. I think Quinn got too involved on the player end so comparing this dudes rule to quinn's may be a little bit of an exaggeration. But the title may still be similar. I think the article more means Black is to Pegula, as Quinn is to Golisano, not Black is to the Sabres as Quinn was to the sabres. If that makes sense. I realize most of you haven't taken the SATs in a good long time. This. Also lets not forget his main background in sports legal matters. This is the guy who helped the Lemieux group navigate the purchase and establishment of a what is now a very solid franchise and business here in Pittsburgh. Good hire in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Is there no shame in the world of New Media? WGR55 Tweets the Black story as if it's their reporting, with links to their site. When you click the link, their story is linked to WKBW's. Leeches! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Programming is one thing. Getting enough advertising revenue to make it viable is another. I am pretty certain that the days of WNY having its own regional sports network are long gone. I expect that there isn't enough population and business base left to generate the advertising to make it profitable. There's a little detail that people so quickly forget. Our previous money losing local sports network only existed in the first place because the owner just happened to own a cable company as well. The concept of a Buffalo or WNY sports channel is great, but ultimately it's a giant collection of red ink. This team will probably be stuck trying to piggyback their broadcasts onto other networks for the rest of the way. Hopefully they can be a little better in their negotiations and try to add some pregame shows or weekly update shows into that contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Bucky has the scoop... "Although it's not clear, it's conceivable he would eventually be named team president..." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Bucky has the scoop... "Although it's not clear, it's conceivable he would eventually be named team president..." That's some crackerjack work there, Jimmy Olsen. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 There's a little detail that people so quickly forget. Our previous money losing local sports network only existed in the first place because the owner just happened to own a cable company as well. The concept of a Buffalo or WNY sports channel is great, but ultimately it's a giant collection of red ink. This team will probably be stuck trying to piggyback their broadcasts onto other networks for the rest of the way. Hopefully they can be a little better in their negotiations and try to add some pregame shows or weekly update shows into that contract. Video production costs have come way down since the Empire days. I can see a network anchored by the Sabres and filled out by Bandits, local college and high schools sports, and it shouldn't cost a fortune to run. True, it might look more like a local cable access channel rather than ESPN at first, but you have to walk before you can run. Another tack could involve a partnership with Time Warner Cable Sports. T-W controls several large cable systems in upstate New York and could get you into Syracuse and Rochester quicker and easier. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Video production costs have come way down since the Empire days. I can see a network anchored by the Sabres and filled out by Bandits, local college and high schools sports, and it shouldn't cost a fortune to run. True, it might look more like a local cable access channel rather than ESPN at first, but you have to walk before you can run. Another tack could involve a partnership with Time Warner Cable Sports. T-W controls several large cable systems in upstate New York and could get you into Syracuse and Rochester quicker and easier. PTR I guess Time Warner could be an option, but would they be interested in this area? Most of those regional Fox and Comcast sports networks are in larger areas and I'm not quite sure WNY/upstate NY brings enough households to the table to be worthwhile. I wonder if YES would ever be an option. Any successful station is more than likely going to need to tap into the NYC market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 I guess Time Warner could be an option, but would they be interested in this area? Most of those regional Fox and Comcast sports networks are in larger areas and I'm not quite sure WNY/upstate NY brings enough households to the table to be worthwhile. I wonder if YES would ever be an option. Any successful station is more than likely going to need to tap into the NYC market. I wouldn't think the Sabres would be treated any better by YES the Yankees network. I can see them doing something with TW as they have given them a dedicated channel already anyway. Channel 700 I think there is room to make it work like that channel now. How bout the lights are on in prime time and game days all day. TW has the capability. Im guessing there has been some ongoing pissing conmtest between LQ and TW and that will be over now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 I wouldn't think the Sabres would be treated any better by YES the Yankees network. It's not so much about how the team is being treated. They're trying to nickel and dime their way on their tv broadcasts. It's mostly their own doing. I suggested YES because if they are in fact serious about getting a better product broadcasted, they wouldn't have to compete with the broadcasts of 3 other hockey teams on that network (and also the Knicks, right?). They'd only have to deal with the Nets schedule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R_Dudley Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 It's not so much about how the team is being treated. They're trying to nickel and dime their way on their tv broadcasts. It's mostly their own doing. I suggested YES because if they are in fact serious about getting a better product broadcasted, they wouldn't have to compete with the broadcasts of 3 other hockey teams on that network (and also the Knicks, right?). They'd only have to deal with the Nets schedule. Very interesting topic and speculation. Admittedly I know next to nothing about the rights, access and licensing around this. Question though; How does the rights to broadcast into southern ontario, Canadian market work with something like this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 As to the TV stuff: They tried this with Empire; it didn't work. I don't think there's enough local sports content to support a 24/7 station. Are people really going to sit inside on nice summer nights to watch minor-league ball on TV? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Very interesting topic and speculation. Admittedly I know next to nothing about the rights, access and licensing around this. Question though; How does the rights to broadcast into southern ontario, Canadian market work with something like this? I really don't know either. I'd imagine blackouts would be an issue if it's someone who cuts far enough into Toronto's market. Ultimately though it would all depend on if they're on a station that is picked up by a canadian cable provider. You'd have to ask a canadian which channels are available on their tvs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Sabres on TV in Canada has been an issue since day one. There was a brief time when ch.2 used to show a few Sabres games. Folks in Canada could see them over-the-air. But Sabres games on cable are not seen in Canada. The most likely reason is the Leafs can block Sabres games from being shown in their market. I'm not sure if there is an answer around that short of buying an over-the-air TV channel and putting Sabres games on it. They still might not get on cable but any Canadian who can get that channel over-the-air could see them irregardless of the Leafs objections. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 There's a little detail that people so quickly forget. Our previous money losing local sports network only existed in the first place because the owner just happened to own a cable company as well. The concept of a Buffalo or WNY sports channel is great, but ultimately it's a giant collection of red ink. This team will probably be stuck trying to piggyback their broadcasts onto other networks for the rest of the way. Hopefully they can be a little better in their negotiations and try to add some pregame shows or weekly update shows into that contract. What makes you say that Empire was losing money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beerme1 Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 It's not so much about how the team is being treated. They're trying to nickel and dime their way on their tv broadcasts. It's mostly their own doing. I suggested YES because if they are in fact serious about getting a better product broadcasted, they wouldn't have to compete with the broadcasts of 3 other hockey teams on that network (and also the Knicks, right?). They'd only have to deal with the Nets schedule. I understand and agree except that it is the Yankees. Thinking there will be 30 or so spring trainging games although mostly day games starting in March. But then they will seemingly play everyday until October sometime and likely late into October and you know that is a large schedule conflict right there. I think I would prefer a heavy local production and get them on cw23 or whatever the other station is 13 or something I believe both of those channels are also HD. If they cant be dedicated on a sports channel then they could at least be dedicated on a local outlet. Remember the good ol days on WUTV 29 I can envision that again with the added benefit of some extra bonus time shows. Get Larry on the phone for me. I've been meaning to talk too him before he leaves anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 What makes you say that Empire was losing money? If Empire/WNSA was profitable, it would have survived the collapse of adelphia in one form or another. If nothing else, if there was money to be had in a local sports network, one would exist. I understand and agree except that it is the Yankees. Thinking there will be 30 or so spring trainging games although mostly day games starting in March. But then they will seemingly play everyday until October sometime and likely late into October and you know that is a large schedule conflict right there. I think I would prefer a heavy local production and get them on cw23 or whatever the other station is 13 or something I believe both of those channels are also HD. If they cant be dedicated on a sports channel then they could at least be dedicated on a local outlet. Remember the good ol days on WUTV 29 I can envision that again with the added benefit of some extra bonus time shows. Get Larry on the phone for me. I've been meaning to talk too him before he leaves anyway. I wonder if they get the kind of exposure they want from a local tv station. I guess the big question was how much of the last couple years was a logistical issue and how much was just Golisano saving as much money as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 I believe Time Warner already has the start of what they need. They have their Time Warner Cable Sportsnet channels which I believe show regional programming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 So Black is a law guy - maybe he is being hired to figure out how to get out of the team no-movement clause. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 So Black is a law guy - maybe he is being hired to figure out how to get out of the team no-movement clause. :) Jeez. I hadn't thought of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 Jeez. I hadn't thought of that. Can they squeeze another 42 hockey dates into the new Pittsburgh arena? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 If Empire/WNSA was profitable, it would have survived the collapse of adelphia in one form or another. If nothing else, if there was money to be had in a local sports network, one would exist. It's Wikipedia so take it for what its worth... Adelphia resisted offers from outside interests to purchase Empire. Despite concerns from viewers and local political leaders, Adelphia chose to eliminate Empire altogether on January 19, 2005. All programming was replaced by a continuous tape loop, showing highlights from the network's history, before Empire finally signed off for good on March 7, 2005. If there were indeed offers to buy then I assume Empire wasn't a big money loser. PTR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 If Empire/WNSA was profitable, it would have survived the collapse of adelphia in one form or another. If nothing else, if there was money to be had in a local sports network, one would exist. I wonder if they get the kind of exposure they want from a local tv station. I guess the big question was how much of the last couple years was a logistical issue and how much was just Golisano saving as much money as possible. Not necessarily. It's Wikipedia so take it for what its worth... If there were indeed offers to buy then I assume Empire wasn't a big money loser. PTR Wikipedia is correct in this instance. There was an offer on the table. The reason the conservators gave for not accepting the offer was that over time the rights fees they'd have to pay to show Empire would overtake the purchase price. Which was an absolutely lousy reason not to accept the offer as they were supposed to be getting the creditors as much of their money back as possible. They intentionally scuttled Empire when they didn't have to. I don't know if it would make sense today to start another Empire as there would be large capital outlays to get started, but Empire made a lot of sense for Adelphia and by the time the criminals' empire was collapsing those initial outlays had been amortized. It would have made sense to keep it running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted February 15, 2011 Report Share Posted February 15, 2011 I believe Time Warner already has the start of what they need. They have their Time Warner Cable Sportsnet channels which I believe show regional programming. Correct. Currenly showing Syracuse College sports, Rochester Red Wings (limited), Rochester amerks (limited), rochester knighthawks (limited), other local college sports (RIT, Naz, & fisher), and then the usual filler crap like fishing and the like. Seems like a slam dunk for Buffalo. Between the Sabres, Bills coverage, UB, and the rest of the local colleges, and the Bisons, Bandits. It makes you wonder why someone hasn't put it together. Must not be very profitable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cdexchange Posted February 16, 2011 Report Share Posted February 16, 2011 So Black is a law guy - maybe he is being hired to figure out how to get out of the team no-movement clause. :) You bastard. :unsure: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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