Lots of Decisions to be made

[Marvelo]

Why is it that if so many hockey players hate Buffalo why do so many retire back to the area. It must have something that brings them back. Even a city like Vancouver which is said to be one of the most desirable to play and live isn't perfect. The downtown eastside is the poorest neighborhood in Canada and the gang murders are at times off the charts but people tend to overlook that because of the climate and the scenery and the great fan support.

 

They like to retire to the area because of the low cost of living, the proximity to Canada and the city does have alot to offer for families. But the younger players seem to avoid it like the plague. They want to par-tee.

[nfreeman]

While you make some great points, Im not sure Panthers would be better off with Loungo this season. Vokoun is better IMO, and one of the leagues most underrated players.

 

Good call. I retract that part of my post.

[bunomatic]

Luongo has always been over-rated in my book and hasn't really won anything. The Canadian team won gold in spite of him not because of him. Miller was all world last year and still couldn't push the American team to a gold. Thats how it goes as a goalie. Look at Thomas in Boston this year. Last year he was merely pedestrian . Even with the depth the Canucks have there are no guarantees Luongo will get past the first round. He's good for being asleep on one or two goals a game quite often.

[weehawk]

The only players that like to live in BUF are the older (and slower) family guys who like the schools and the family atmosphere to raise their kids in. The housing is cheap and they can save up for their retirement (Neidermeier/Rivet). The young (and more talented) guys dont want to play and live here for the obvious reasons (weather, no night life, etc). Anyone that thinks hanging out with high school and college kids on Chippewa is a good time is a dolt who has never experienced a thriving city. The so-called egotistical players nailed it. BUF is a dead city with very little to do if you're young, rich, and talented.

 

Also, what the heck is there to do in Clarence? I lived there for six years and can tell you first hand that it's as dead and boring as any backwoods southern town. It's a great place to raise a family, but it aint Miami, San Francisco, NY, or LA by a long-shot. LeBron proved that it's not about money when he left tens of millions on the table to get out of Cleveland. It IS about where you play when you're young, rich, and talented. Both the Bills and the Sabres have been unable to attract any real talent (players, coaches or GMs). It's not just about the money. It's the town and the pi*s-poor ownership that both teams are in the grips of right now. It's going to take a lot more than an extra 1/2 million to get any *real* talent to come here.

 

We'll see what happens when Pegula gets the team. He's got deep-pockets. Let's see who he can attract. It's obvious that both Wilson and Golisano have given up on their teams. I'm curious to see if new ownership changes anything. Pegula better start with getting rid of Darcy and Quinn. NO ONE will play for these stooges.

 

 

I think you put too much weight into the idea that professional athletes hate Buffalo. So what, a couple of unjustly egotistical football players criticized the Buffalo night life. By all accounts, most athletes who live here love it. Sure downtown Buffalo is a little run down, but Amherst, Clarence, Getzville, Grand Island etc are beautiful places to live. And like d4rks4bre said, it's all about the money. If you have to shell out an extra half mil a year for a player to choose Buffalo over LA then so be it, do it. Prove to the players that you want to win and more players will want to play for you.

[Sabre Dance]

The only players that like to live in BUF are the older (and slower) family guys who like the schools and the family atmosphere to raise their kids in. The housing is cheap and they can save up for their retirement (Neidermeier/Rivet). The young (and more talented) guys dont want to play and live here for the obvious reasons (weather, no night life, etc). Anyone that thinks hanging out with high school and college kids on Chippewa is a good time is a dolt who has never experienced a thriving city. The so-called egotistical players nailed it. BUF is a dead city with very little to do if you're young, rich, and talented.

 

Also, what the heck is there to do in Clarence? I lived there for six years and can tell you first hand that it's as dead and boring as any backwoods southern town. It's a great place to raise a family, but it aint Miami, San Francisco, NY, or LA by a long-shot. LeBron proved that it's not about money when he left tens of millions on the table to get out of Cleveland. It IS about where you play when you're young, rich, and talented. Both the Bills and the Sabres have been unable to attract any real talent (players, coaches or GMs). It's not just about the money. It's the town and the pi*s-poor ownership that both teams are in the grips of right now. It's going to take a lot more than an extra 1/2 million to get any *real* talent to come here.

 

We'll see what happens when Pegula gets the team. He's got deep-pockets. Let's see who he can attract. It's obvious that both Wilson and Golisano have given up on their teams. I'm curious to see if new ownership changes anything. Pegula better start with getting rid of Darcy and Quinn. NO ONE will play for these stooges.

 

 

I will agree that Buffalo is no San Francisco or LA. But there are things to do and places to go IF you care to look. Also, if you play for the Sabres, how much time do you actually spend in the area? You play half your games on the road and the season only runs from October to April (well, for the Sabres anyway...) Once the season is over, you go back to Moncton or Moose Jaw or whatever town you hail from. If someone would pay me $1 million a year, I'd even go back and live in Tucson (which I thought was a horrible place to live). The hockey fans here are great, you can get a decent steak and Canadian beer :beer: and the women are pretty. Why not come to Buffalo, at least long enough to win a Stanley Cup?

[thesportsbuff]

Come on where? No rational analysis of the Luongo trade can conclude that the Panthers were helped in any way by that trade. They got Bertuzzi, Auld and a journeyman defenseman in exchange for a top-5 goalie. They didn't save much money because Bertuzzi was making over $5MM per year. Most importantly, they didn't improve at all as a team. While you're right that they are better than the Sabres this year, this is the first year in forever that they've been decent, it has nothing to do with the Luongo trade, and they would certainly be a better team right now with Luongo.

 

If we could get Stamkos for Miller? Sure, pull the trigger. But that's not going to happen. Bottom line is that the Sabres wouldn't get anywhere near equal value for Miller. Trading him for first-round picks would be a terrible move (and, again, there's a reason you don't see NHL GMs making this kind of move). After the first couple of picks in each draft, the NHL draft is a crapshoot. Would you be happy if the Sabres ended up with Artem Kriukov or Joel Savage or Dan Paille or any other of a dozen first-round washouts in exchange for Miller? The same goes for Vanek.

 

As for Pommer, I misinterpreted your comments on him. I agree that the only way to dump his contract is by bribing another team to take it off of the Sabres' hands.

 

The Panthers traded him because they realized there was no point in signing him to the $6 mil contract extension that Vancouver signed him to because they were not playoff contenders. They were (and still are) in rebuild mode. I don't know if Florida ever intended on re-signing him Bertuzzi or not, but keep in mind that he was still considered a good player back then. Of course, we'll never know what the plan actually was because Mike Keenan, the GM who traded Luongo, was replaced before the regular season started. I suspect he intended on finishing in the bottom 5 of the league again and getting another high draft pick, then pursue some big free agents the FOLLOWING season (July 2007 -- maybe he had his eyes set on Drury/Briere).

[thesportsbuff]

The only players that like to live in BUF are the older (and slower) family guys who like the schools and the family atmosphere to raise their kids in. The housing is cheap and they can save up for their retirement (Neidermeier/Rivet). The young (and more talented) guys dont want to play and live here for the obvious reasons (weather, no night life, etc). Anyone that thinks hanging out with high school and college kids on Chippewa is a good time is a dolt who has never experienced a thriving city. The so-called egotistical players nailed it. BUF is a dead city with very little to do if you're young, rich, and talented.

 

Also, what the heck is there to do in Clarence? I lived there for six years and can tell you first hand that it's as dead and boring as any backwoods southern town. It's a great place to raise a family, but it aint Miami, San Francisco, NY, or LA by a long-shot. LeBron proved that it's not about money when he left tens of millions on the table to get out of Cleveland. It IS about where you play when you're young, rich, and talented. Both the Bills and the Sabres have been unable to attract any real talent (players, coaches or GMs). It's not just about the money. It's the town and the pi*s-poor ownership that both teams are in the grips of right now. It's going to take a lot more than an extra 1/2 million to get any *real* talent to come here.

 

We'll see what happens when Pegula gets the team. He's got deep-pockets. Let's see who he can attract. It's obvious that both Wilson and Golisano have given up on their teams. I'm curious to see if new ownership changes anything. Pegula better start with getting rid of Darcy and Quinn. NO ONE will play for these stooges.

 

You can't compare hockey players to basketball players. How often do you hear of hockey players getting in trouble with the law or suspended for doing drugs? Carrying weapons? Committing hit & runs while stoned on marijuana? Aside from the unfortunate Dany Heatley incident several years ago I can't think of any players who have been in trouble with the law. At the very most it's for getting a bar fight or something stupid like that. But it's a yearly occurrence in the NBA and NFL. They live a different lifestyle. NFL players have a LOT of free time and a LOT of money, of course they care about the weather and the night life. The NBA is simply a joke all around, and a majority of their players (until recently) didn't even go to college, so given the millions of dollars theyre making, of course they're more interested in how accessible drugs and weaponry are, and whether or not they can pick up hookers at the local clubs. But hockey players? They're busy. It's a lot of work. Practice practice practice, nap, eat, game, sleep, practice. Road trips every few days. You're always busy. Most of them have worked incredibly hard to get where they are and they're not willing to throw it away over stupid stuff like that. I honestly don't think hockey players care that much about the night life. Sure they still go out, but you're on the road every few days, there's plenty of time to go out in other cities. Also if you notice, most of the high-profile hockey players have families or are in the process of starting families, so why wouldn't they want to raise their kids in a family-friendly environment like Amherst or Clarence? Good schools, good colleges. It's everything you could really ask for.

[weehawk]

Personally, I have no issues with the area. It's my home town and I always loved it. I'm just putting myself in a pro athletes shoes. Keep in mind that the emphasis is on young and talented players. There is no shortage of journeymen and rookies that can, will, and do play here. Our problem is attracting top-flight free agents that are young and loaded with talent. They just wont come here for the reasons I outlined, and we probably wont win a cup without one or two of them. I think the team is dead in the water under Golisano. The only *hope* is through an ownership/staff change. I emphasize hope, because there are no guarantees even with a new owner. No one will play for Darcy/Quinn because they've seen how players are treated here. It really has nothing to do with the city itself, but all of these factors put together paints an ugly picture for the Sabres.

 

 

I will agree that Buffalo is no San Francisco or LA. But there are things to do and places to go IF you care to look. Also, if you play for the Sabres, how much time do you actually spend in the area? You play half your games on the road and the season only runs from October to April (well, for the Sabres anyway...) Once the season is over, you go back to Moncton or Moose Jaw or whatever town you hail from. If someone would pay me $1 million a year, I'd even go back and live in Tucson (which I thought was a horrible place to live). The hockey fans here are great, you can get a decent steak and Canadian beer :beer: and the women are pretty. Why not come to Buffalo, at least long enough to win a Stanley Cup?

[Marvelo]

Personally, I have no issues with the area. It's my home town and I always loved it. I'm just putting myself in a pro athletes shoes. Keep in mind that the emphasis is on young and talented players. There is no shortage of journeymen and rookies that can, will, and do play here. Our problem is attracting top-flight free agents that are young and loaded with talent. They just wont come here for the reasons I outlined, and we probably wont win a cup without one or two of them. I think the team is dead in the water under Golisano. The only *hope* is through an ownership/staff change. I emphasize hope, because there are no guarantees even with a new owner. No one will play for Darcy/Quinn because they've seen how players are treated here. It really has nothing to do with the city itself, but all of these factors put together paints an ugly picture for the Sabres.

 

 

Even if Buffalo gets top flight talent, they usually come here begrudgingly. Even Perreault said his life ambition was to play on the Canadiens along with Beliveau....he didn't want to be in Buffalo either. Alot of the players doubtless think that buffalo is "booby prize." They are pleasantly suprised by how good it is, but usually they are demoralized to live there...It would be a refreshing change to see players who actually represent the city and want to play for the fans under any new ownership (I'm not holding my breath) .

[PASabreFan]

Interesting discussion, but someone's going to have to explain the thrill it would be for any young hockey player to be drafted by and play for... the Detroit, Michigan Red Wings.

[Cereal]

You can't compare hockey players to basketball players. How often do you hear of hockey players getting in trouble with the law or suspended for doing drugs? Carrying weapons? Committing hit & runs while stoned on marijuana? Aside from the unfortunate Dany Heatley incident several years ago I can't think of any players who have been in trouble with the law. At the very most it's for getting a bar fight or something stupid like that. But it's a yearly occurrence in the NBA and NFL. They live a different lifestyle. NFL players have a LOT of free time and a LOT of money, of course they care about the weather and the night life. The NBA is simply a joke all around, and a majority of their players (until recently) didn't even go to college, so given the millions of dollars theyre making, of course they're more interested in how accessible drugs and weaponry are, and whether or not they can pick up hookers at the local clubs. But hockey players? They're busy. It's a lot of work. Practice practice practice, nap, eat, game, sleep, practice. Road trips every few days. You're always busy. Most of them have worked incredibly hard to get where they are and they're not willing to throw it away over stupid stuff like that. I honestly don't think hockey players care that much about the night life. Sure they still go out, but you're on the road every few days, there's plenty of time to go out in other cities. Also if you notice, most of the high-profile hockey players have families or are in the process of starting families, so why wouldn't they want to raise their kids in a family-friendly environment like Amherst or Clarence? Good schools, good colleges. It's everything you could really ask for.

 

Interesting thoughts, Jack. One thing I wanted to add is that weather-wise, a greater percentage of hockey players (compared to NBA and NFL) are probably used to the Buffalo-type climate. Top hockey talents go to juniors out of high school, located moreso in northern regions of the US and Canada, or else the vast majority of Division I hockey programs are up north.

 

Further, while I'm not too knowledgeable on college hockey, these kids are surely not treated like royalty, with the glamorous media exposure, etc. that goes along with college football or basketball stardom. NHL players, in general, do not seem to be caught up in the same type of hype/hysteria.

 

That is not to say this applies to all NHL players. In addition to Heatley, I remember Paetsch and another player getting into some trouble over the summer, Chelios getting a DUI in AZ a while back, and of course, Tallinder, the "third man in" :unsure: . Of course, these types of instances are nothing like the kind of crap some NFL and NBA players get into! You just got me to thinking with your Heatley blurb.

 

I'm excited about the anticipation of new ownership, though! It'd surely make for the first interesting summer for Sabres fans since at least '08.

[PromoTheRobot]

Interesting thoughts, Jack. One thing I wanted to add is that weather-wise, a greater percentage of hockey players (compared to NBA and NFL) are probably used to the Buffalo-type climate. Top hockey talents go to juniors out of high school, located moreso in northern regions of the US and Canada, or else the vast majority of Division I hockey programs are up north.

 

Further, while I'm not too knowledgeable on college hockey, these kids are surely not treated like royalty, with the glamorous media exposure, etc. that goes along with college football or basketball stardom. NHL players, in general, do not seem to be caught up in the same type of hype/hysteria.

 

That is not to say this applies to all NHL players. In addition to Heatley, I remember Paetsch and another player getting into some trouble over the summer, Chelios getting a DUI in AZ a while back, and of course, Tallinder, the "third man in" :unsure: . Of course, these types of instances are nothing like the kind of crap some NFL and NBA players get into! You just got me to thinking with your Heatley blurb.

 

I'm excited about the anticipation of new ownership, though! It'd surely make for the first interesting summer for Sabres fans since at least '08.

Let's not forget Pat Kane's 20-cent brouhaha.

 

PTR

[thesportsbuff]

Let's not forget Pat Kane's 20-cent brouhaha.

 

PTR

 

Ok, that's a good one. I don't know how that one slipped my mind. That was a pretty classless move. But, at least Kane was undoubtedly enjoying the Buffalo night life to be drunk enough to do that!

[bunomatic]

Back in the eighties there was a player who flashed his neighbour in his bathrobe from his driveway. Don't recall who it was but Ciccarelli or maybe Gilmour comes to mind. Does anyone remember that little scandal?

[Marvelo]

Not only do the Sabres players handle the puck like it's a hot potato, but Buffalo has become a hot potato franchise. No one wants to commit to the Buffalo area. It's too far gone. We've had several bad owners in a row and need stability, not these fly-by-night John Y. Brown types.

[Patty16]

Not only do the Sabres players handle the puck like it's a hot potato, but Buffalo has become a hot potato franchise. No one wants to commit to the Buffalo area. It's too far gone. We've had several bad owners in a row and need stability, not these fly-by-night John Y. Brown types.

 

 

What? its a healthy franchise financially with a rabid fan base.

[PASabreFan]

What? its a healthy franchise financially with a rabid fan base.

 

Agreed. It's all there to be tapped into, by the right owner. When was the last time the Sabres had stable ownership? You'd have to go far back into the Knox Era. Remember, at the end, Rigas was bailing them out.

[mphs mike]

Interesting thoughts, Jack. One thing I wanted to add is that weather-wise, a greater percentage of hockey players (compared to NBA and NFL) are probably used to the Buffalo-type climate. Top hockey talents go to juniors out of high school, located moreso in northern regions of the US and Canada, or else the vast majority of Division I hockey programs are up north.

 

Further, while I'm not too knowledgeable on college hockey, these kids are surely not treated like royalty, with the glamorous media exposure, etc. that goes along with college football or basketball stardom. NHL players, in general, do not seem to be caught up in the same type of hype/hysteria.

 

That is not to say this applies to all NHL players. In addition to Heatley, I remember Paetsch and another player getting into some trouble over the summer, Chelios getting a DUI in AZ a while back, and of course, Tallinder, the "third man in" :unsure: . Of course, these types of instances are nothing like the kind of crap some NFL and NBA players get into! You just got me to thinking with your Heatley blurb.

 

I'm excited about the anticipation of new ownership, though! It'd surely make for the first interesting summer for Sabres fans since at least '08.

 

We must add Pelle Lindburgh to the list of NHL players with a legal/alcohol issue.

[Robviously]

Agreed. It's all there to be tapped into, by the right owner. When was the last time the Sabres had stable ownership? You'd have to go far back into the Knox Era. Remember, at the end, Rigas was bailing them out.

Buffalo could be a great destination for hockey players. I don't understand how some of these players can stand to play in markets like LA, Phoenix, Florida, etc. where NO ONE cares about hockey. I've lived in more exciting cities on the West Coast and in Texas, but if I was a pro hockey player, I'd always pick Buffalo over them. You'd want to live somewhere where people actually care about the sport you're dedicating your life to.

[PASabreFan]

Buffalo could be a great destination for hockey players. I don't understand how some of these players can stand to play in markets like LA, Phoenix, Florida, etc. where NO ONE cares about hockey. I've lived in more exciting cities on the West Coast and in Texas, but if I was a pro hockey player, I'd always pick Buffalo over them. You'd want to live somewhere where people actually care about the sport you're dedicating your life to.

 

And you'd think in a culture so steeped in history and tradition, that the main factor would be the chance to win a Cup. See: Detroit. So that's Pegula's challenge.

[Patty16]

Agreed. It's all there to be tapped into, by the right owner. When was the last time the Sabres had stable ownership? You'd have to go far back into the Knox Era. Remember, at the end, Rigas was bailing them out.

 

I would call TG stable. Theres virtually no chance this team goes bankrupt or leaves buffalo. That to me is stable.

 

He is disinterested but thats another story.

[spndnchz]

I would call TG stable. Theres virtually no chance this team goes bankrupt or leaves buffalo. That to me is stable.

 

He is disinterested but thats another story.

 

Good point.

[PASabreFan]

I would call TG stable. Theres virtually no chance this team goes bankrupt or leaves buffalo. That to me is stable.

 

He is disinterested but thats another story.

 

By that definition, sure.

 

But when your owner is short-term, absentee and more interested in his political career and "flipping" a quick profit than winning a Cup, that, to me, is unstable.

[Bmwolf21]

Let's not forget Pat Kane's 20-cent brouhaha.

 

PTR

Rick Tocchet and Janet Gretzky's gambling ring has to be mentioned as well.