Bmwolf21 Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 05/06 had what you need to win in the playoffs. Grit and toughness. 06/07 was more concerned with making SportsCenter's Top 10 with a 3 goal comeback in the last 5 minutes, and they wouldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. I'll take the former. Spot on, 100% accurate. I agree that the expectations were different, and the 05-06 run was much more fun. But I have to disagree that the Carolina series was lost before the defense became a mash unit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 Spot on, 100% accurate. I agree that the expectations were different, and the 05-06 run was much more fun. But I have to disagree that the Carolina series was lost before the defense became a mash unit. They had a chance to go up 2 games to none and let game two slip away, sleep walked their way through game 4 and had more then a couple of chances to win game five. The injuries to the defense, some of which were attributable to the pounding they took from Carolina, is a convenient excuse that further enables the "Camelot' feeling some seem to get from this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R_Dudley Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 I agree, expectations have everything to do with the way we view those teams ... ... I think this is the best way to put it ... in 05-06, they were a really good team that came together played their best at the right time. In 06-07, they were a really good team that did NOT play their best at the right time, and therefore they were a disappointment ... but I don't think they were a worse team. Well said and agreed I agree that the expectations were different, and the 05-06 run was much more fun. But I have to disagree that the Carolina series was lost before the defense became a mash unit. Also a great point worth noting and last They had a chance to go up 2 games to none and let game two slip away, sleep walked their way through game 4 and had more then a couple of chances to win game five. The injuries to the defense, some of which were attributable to the pounding they took from Carolina, is a convenient excuse that further enables the "Camelot' feeling some seem to get from this team. Which all comes back to expectations, we are more willing to let them slide when it wasn't expected then when the expectations are at/through the roof.... That and it is more fun when it isn't expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 They had a chance to go up 2 games to none and let game two slip away, sleep walked their way through game 4 and had more then a couple of chances to win game five. The injuries to the defense, some of which were attributable to the pounding they took from Carolina, is a convenient excuse that further enables the "Camelot' feeling some seem to get from this team. I'd have to go back and re-watch some of those games, but from my recollection there weren't any glaring "blown games" in that series. Even if they did, that's going to happen in seven-game series. Not a lot of teams play top-flight hockey for the entire playoff run. I definitely do not agree that the defensive injuries are a convenient excuse. I don't even look at those injuries as an excuse. Even as the defensemen were dropping like flies (and we were apparently blowing games left and right) they played well enough to put themselves in a position to win the series in Game 7. Problem is they went into that game with Fitzpatrick, Paetsch, Jillson and Janik manning the blue lines and playing significant roles. Take pretty much any Cup contender over the last 10-15 years and take two-thirds of their starting defense out of the lineup and I'd bet most of those teams cannot find a way to overcome those losses. Maybe a Detroit team, and a trapping Devils team, but that's about all I can think of off the top of my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wonderbread Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 Hey PA whats up with the towel by the computer? That's more than just disconcerting that's just plain nasty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bob_sauve28 Posted July 27, 2008 Report Share Posted July 27, 2008 05-06 was easily the BEST year of my life (at 15/16 years old!) and the Sabres had a LOT to do with it. Countless parties to watch and celebrate what none of us really expected... the best Sabres team in recent history. It's sad thinking back to it: 6-4 win in the season opener, at home, vs the Islanders. I attended. Bill Clinton at the Dallas game in December. Afinogenov's OT winner vs the Ducks... quick pump fake on the pass then slides in and rifles a slapshot past JS Giguere. My friends and I made a Stanley Cup out of flower pots and tinfoil... hoping to raise it. We even took it to a party and got everybody riled up. THIS is a true story: a girl locked me in my room at one of my infamous sabres parties. she started talking, grabbing my hand, wanted to talk about "US." WELL SORRY SISTER, BUFFALO / OTTAWA IS IN OVERTIME RIGHT NOW. SHUT THE $@#$ UP!!! hahaha, I was like "hold on this is a huge game." and then Thomas Vanek seals the deal with his gay around the world shot over Hasek's shoulder in the shootout... oh man. GOOD times. The girl was gone, I went to my living room and everybody was going nuts. Needless to say I joined in haha. Chris Drury to Mike Grier, 5.6 seconds to go to beat the NJ Devils (I think). And we ALL know the playoff story... haha. I went to my first playoff game ever... a 7-2 (or 1 maybe?) stomping of Philly.. Dumont and Pominville both register hat tricks. The night we beat Ottawa... i almost cried. I'd never been more happy in my life. My brother and I had to go to buy my mom a Mothers Day present that night... I threw on my Sabres jersey at 10:30-11PM, rode with him to Walmart and started slapping hands with anybody I saw that wanted to. oh man I could go on forever. that was such a great year. Was she hot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregkash Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 05/06 had what you need to win in the playoffs. Grit and toughness. 06/07 was more concerned with making SportsCenter's Top 10 with a 3 goal comeback in the last 5 minutes, and they wouldn't hit water if they fell out of a boat. I'll take the former. You all are crazy. 05-06 was awesome. It was so much fun proving everybody wrong, but 06-07 was MAGICAL. The whole city was a buzz. We started off with 2 come back wins, won 10 straight. Went on countless tears. Had more come from behind wins than Ive ever seen. Came back from 3 down to beat the Leafs in HSBC. Came back from 3 down to beat Boston in Boston. The Ottawa team fight. The city was electric, a buzz, i've never wanted to be back in Buffalo so much in my life. I realize it didn't end how we wanted it to, but that was the most fun I've ever had watching the Buffalo Sabres. We'd be down 3-1 going into the third and it wasn't over. It was never over for that team. 10 seconds left down by a goal you were leaning forward in your chair instead of leaning back in defeat. Game 5 against the New York Rangers still gives me tingles like no other game does when I watch the highlights on youtube. It's the best season in Sabres history and in my book better than 05-06. Don't get me wrong, 05-06 is up there, possibly #2, but 06-07 is the best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregkash Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 06-07 total hits: 1303 05-06 total hits: 1073 per nhl.com stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ko12010 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 Well, I didn't say they weren't good. They just weren't a "heckuva" team. As the years roll by, I am convinced Sabre fans will remember the 05-06 Sabres as a much better team than 06-07. It just sucks that we didn't get one cup out of 2005 to 2007. The 2005-2006 team seemed absolutely destined for a Stanley Cup while the 2006-2007 team seemed destined to come up short despite the high expectations. It still gets my adrenaline flowing to think of the 2005-2006 playoffs and how good of a team that group was and then I get terribly sad to think that they didn't win it. If any one team ever seemed destined to win their league's championship it was that team. Still boggles my mind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted July 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 I don't think that I've ever felt better about a team than I did going into the Carolina series in '05-'06. I mean when I looked at this team: <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value=" name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src=" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object> I thought "oh my god, these guys are actually going to do it!" At that point, I had know doubt they would win it all. There were a couple of times during the '06-'07 that I thought "wow, these guys may have a chance", but there wasn't a time where I thought they definitely would. I admit that several reviewed goals and Drury's/Max's goals in game 5 against the Rangers had me thinking maybe they were destined to, but the feeling was never quite the same as in '05-'06. That's the big difference for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesportsbuff Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 You all are crazy. 05-06 was awesome. It was so much fun proving everybody wrong, but 06-07 was MAGICAL. The whole city was a buzz. We started off with 2 come back wins, won 10 straight. Went on countless tears. Had more come from behind wins than Ive ever seen. Came back from 3 down to beat the Leafs in HSBC. Came back from 3 down to beat Boston in Boston. The Ottawa team fight. The city was electric, a buzz, i've never wanted to be back in Buffalo so much in my life. I realize it didn't end how we wanted it to, but that was the most fun I've ever had watching the Buffalo Sabres. We'd be down 3-1 going into the third and it wasn't over. It was never over for that team. 10 seconds left down by a goal you were leaning forward in your chair instead of leaning back in defeat. Game 5 against the New York Rangers still gives me tingles like no other game does when I watch the highlights on youtube. It's the best season in Sabres history and in my book better than 05-06. Don't get me wrong, 05-06 is up there, possibly #2, but 06-07 is the best. I wonder if there's anywhere we could find out the Sabres record when trailing going into the third period for each season. To me, it seemed like 05-06 had more come from behind wins. I remember even saying to my friend one time, as we entered the third period down 3-1... "down 2? just where we want to be in the third haha." and of course they came back and won. though i will admit, 06-07 was a great year as well. we had some crazy parties for those playoffs, and probably the biggest pile on ever during drury/max's goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 06-07 total hits: 130305-06 total hits: 1073 per nhl.com stats. More proof that some hockey stats are extremely subjective and open to interpretation, like scoring chances and turnovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesportsbuff Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 Was she hot? indeed she was. come on now! it wouldn't be a sabres party with a bunch of ugly chicks, would it!? but on a serious note, she was pretty hott. we had been dating on and off before that, but she kinda had a thing, at the time, for my best friend. the weekend after valentines day (go figure, i want my $30 talking teddy bear back) they hooked up and that made seeing Vanek roof one on Hasek worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awill29 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 So many of the kids were better in 06/07. If you put Dumont, McKee and Grier instead of Kotalik, Spacek and Connolly and 06/07 wins the Cup. 05/06 blew that series against Carolina long before their defense became a MASH unit. The argument now is only fueled by what the expectations were. Yeah, you're right, they had absolutely no chance of winning that series...even if they were up 1 with 20 minutes to go in Game 7. <_< You all are crazy. 05-06 was awesome. It was so much fun proving everybody wrong, but 06-07 was MAGICAL. The whole city was a buzz. We started off with 2 come back wins, won 10 straight. Went on countless tears. Had more come from behind wins than Ive ever seen. Came back from 3 down to beat the Leafs in HSBC. Came back from 3 down to beat Boston in Boston. The Ottawa team fight. The city was electric, a buzz, i've never wanted to be back in Buffalo so much in my life. I realize it didn't end how we wanted it to, but that was the most fun I've ever had watching the Buffalo Sabres. We'd be down 3-1 going into the third and it wasn't over. It was never over for that team. 10 seconds left down by a goal you were leaning forward in your chair instead of leaning back in defeat. Game 5 against the New York Rangers still gives me tingles like no other game does when I watch the highlights on youtube. It's the best season in Sabres history and in my book better than 05-06. Don't get me wrong, 05-06 is up there, possibly #2, but 06-07 is the best. Since when does being the most enjoyable team to watch translate into winning the Cup? I didn't say that 06-07 wasn't fun, but they flat out ran outta luck. No team can count on coming back all those times, especially in the playoffs. No team can expect to just not show up the first 3 games of a series and come back to win it all like nothing. They had all the talent. They had the leadership. They had the goaltending, the defense, the coaching, they had everything but what 05-06 had: heart and grit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 You all are crazy. 05-06 was awesome. It was so much fun proving everybody wrong, but 06-07 was MAGICAL. The whole city was a buzz. We started off with 2 come back wins, won 10 straight. Went on countless tears. Had more come from behind wins than Ive ever seen. Came back from 3 down to beat the Leafs in HSBC. Came back from 3 down to beat Boston in Boston. The Ottawa team fight. The city was electric, a buzz, i've never wanted to be back in Buffalo so much in my life. I realize it didn't end how we wanted it to, but that was the most fun I've ever had watching the Buffalo Sabres. We'd be down 3-1 going into the third and it wasn't over. It was never over for that team. 10 seconds left down by a goal you were leaning forward in your chair instead of leaning back in defeat. Game 5 against the New York Rangers still gives me tingles like no other game does when I watch the highlights on youtube. It's the best season in Sabres history and in my book better than 05-06. Don't get me wrong, 05-06 is up there, possibly #2, but 06-07 is the best. Good post. That game vs Ottawa with the brawl (which we won in the shootout, IIRC) was an epic. As for the Game 5 vs. the Rangers, I'm conflicted. It was an incredible win, and at the time I was completely beside myself, but Drury leaving has ruined it for me. I can't really get that much enjoyment out of watching it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregkash Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 More proof that some hockey stats are extremely subjective and open to interpretation, like scoring chances and turnovers. I love how stats are only acceptable if they prove the Sabres don't hit. Throw some proof against it and stats are no longer acceptable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregkash Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 of 06-07 played 05-06 06-07 would win the game 15-12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gregkash Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 I wonder if there's anywhere we could find out the Sabres record when trailing going into the third period for each season. To me, it seemed like 05-06 had more come from behind wins. I remember even saying to my friend one time, as we entered the third period down 3-1... "down 2? just where we want to be in the third haha." and of course they came back and won.though i will admit, 06-07 was a great year as well. we had some crazy parties for those playoffs, and probably the biggest pile on ever during drury/max's goals. I couldn't find when trailing after the second. But according to nhl.com this is the stats when trailing after the first:: 05-06 = .432 06-07 = .529 About 16 points better in 06-07 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 I love how stats are only acceptable if they prove the Sabres don't hit. Throw some proof against it and stats are no longer acceptable. I guess you can go ahead and incorrectly assume that was my point, but in reality it has nothing to do with that. It has to do with the fact that there are several subjective stats, including hits, scoring chances, turnovers and blocked shots, and there a lot of reasons why those stats can be considered suspect. The league has recently started tracking a lot of these stats, so there is a very good chance that scorekeepers don't have or understand what the league's uniform standards are for those categories -- one person's "hit" is another person's bump on the way to the benches; one person's "blocked shot" is another's deflected off his back when he wasn't looking, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 I couldn't find when trailing after the second. But according to nhl.com this is the stats when trailing after the first:: 05-06 = .432 06-07 = .529 About 16 points better in 06-07 I think this is incorrect. According to NHL.com I found these numbers: Trailing after 1 05-06 - 8-14-3, .320 06-07 - 8-6-3, .471 Trailing after 2 05-06 - 9-21-2, .281 06-07 - 5-13-1, .263 Leading after 1 05-06 - 21-1-2, .875 06-07 - 25-3-0, .893 Leading after 2 05-06 - 33-1-3, .892 06-07 - 39-5-2, .848 LINK for 05-06 stats LINK for 06-07 stats That .432 you found was more likely not trailing after one, but allowing the game's first goal, since it is listed here right next to the category for "scoring 1st." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted July 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 one person's "hit" is another person's bump on the way to the benches Yeah, I bet somebody even gave OV a hit for . :thumbsup: So, anyone want to pull those "from behind" stats for '07-'08? Talk about depressing ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inkman Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 indeed she was. come on now! it wouldn't be a sabres party with a bunch of ugly chicks, would it!? It was how I pictured it in my head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 It was how I pictured it in my head. Which one? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 I guess you can go ahead and incorrectly assume that was my point, but in reality it has nothing to do with that. It has to do with the fact that there are several subjective stats, including hits, scoring chances, turnovers and blocked shots, and there a lot of reasons why those stats can be considered suspect. The league has recently started tracking a lot of these stats, so there is a very good chance that scorekeepers don't have or understand what the league's uniform standards are for those categories -- one person's "hit" is another person's bump on the way to the benches; one person's "blocked shot" is another's deflected off his back when he wasn't looking, etc. My friend, we might be reaching some common ground at last. I wish the league would institute an "asterisk" approach (or an "exclamation point" approach) to stats. Keep the stats the same as ever -- a block is a block whether or not it deflects off someone's back who isn't looking. But when a guy sells out, sprawls on the ice, exposes the family jewels and takes a puck off the knee, asterisk that biatch. Same goes for a GLORIOUS scoring opportunity, a Toni Lydman TO special or a major-league hit (including one that leads directly to a scoring chance). It makes so much sense you wonder why it isn't done. Who opposes it? Maybe the players union? It would be so much fun for fans. So useful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted July 28, 2008 Report Share Posted July 28, 2008 My friend, we might be reaching some common ground at last. I wish the league would institute an "asterisk" approach (or an "exclamation point" approach) to stats. Keep the stats the same as ever -- a block is a block whether or not it deflects off someone's back who isn't looking. But when a guy sells out, sprawls on the ice, exposes the family jewels and takes a puck off the knee, asterisk that biatch. Same goes for a GLORIOUS scoring opportunity, a Toni Lydman TO special or a major-league hit (including one that leads directly to a scoring chance). It makes so much sense you wonder why it isn't done. Who opposes it? Maybe the players union? It would be so much fun for fans. So useful. I seem to recall us agreeing on the subjectivity on such stats in the past, specifically the scoring chances (probably in a debate about Miller :thumbsup:). Maybe they need to go with baseball's road map and make a new stat for each category - have "incidental blocked shots" and "clutch blocked shots;" have generic "turnovers" and then categorize ones that result in a scoring-chance as "giveaways", etc etc etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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