LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 For those who don't read the Buffalo News online or don't live here anymore, the powers that be are still trying to figure out if the Aud can be converted into a Bass Pro store. Here is the latest report from an engineering firm... http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060804/1065552.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elcrusho Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 ok easy way to solve this... Go to the Erie County Correctional Facility.... Have the prison guards ask who is a Sabres fan, then if they say yes, let them go and clean up the Hazardous material.... And <clears throat> I wouldn't mind a row of 3 or 4 Upper Gold Seats, and yes they would go RIGHT in my Living Room Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 ok easy way to solve this... Go to the Erie County Correctional Facility.... Have the prison guards ask who is a Sabres fan, then if they say yes, let them go and clean up the Hazardous material.... And <clears throat> I wouldn't mind a row of 3 or 4 Upper Gold Seats, and yes they would go RIGHT in my Living Room Do you want those upper golds with or without the mold and mildew? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Cracks me up that the piece of "bloody gauze" found in the locker room will cost $500 to properly dispose of .... It is a shame such a great place was left to basically rot like that, but certainly the city has had more important things to spend money on .... Am I the only one who has dreamed of winning the Powerball and trying to do something to save the place? just gotta wait for it to get to a couple hundred million and pick the right numbers ... needless to say, it's an ongoing process ... I'll keep you guys posted on my progress. ;) Man I miss that place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 It is a shame such a great place was left to basically rot like that, but certainly the city has had more important things to spend money on .... Am I the only one who has dreamed of winning the Powerball and trying to do something to save the place? Man I miss that place. All good points, and no, you're not the only one who dreams of someone riding in to save the day on that great old building. The photo in that article is a disgrace, seeing the Sabres' emblem surrounded by such disregard and disrepair makes me more than a little sad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I remember a big spread in the Buffalo News two or three years ago about how this time waterfront development was for real. Now, Bass Pro is no closer to reality than then, and it seems like there are doubts it will ever happen. The casino, meanwhile, looks like it's going to be scaled back because of a dispute with the city. It's really sad to see this great American city can't get its waterfront act together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 It's really sad to see this great American city can't get its waterfront act together. Fixed that for ya. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Dance Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I remember a big spread in the Buffalo News two or three years ago about how this time waterfront development was for real. Now, Bass Pro is no closer to reality than then, and it seems like there are doubts it will ever happen. The casino, meanwhile, looks like it's going to be scaled back because of a dispute with the city. It's really sad to see this great American city can't get its waterfront act together. I used to be a huge Buffalo booster. While I still love the area and the people who live here, the word "progress" is a foreign word. Although I am not a big gambling proponent, I rejoiced when the Senecas actually moved forward on building the casino if only to see ONE downtown project come to fruition. Now that looks like it will be minimized, as so many other projects have been. Although I have many fond memories of the Aud, it is not historic in any long-term sense. It should have been demolished the day that Marine Midland Arena opened. (Boston Garden, Chicago Stadium and the Olympia in Detroit had far more historic value than the Aud, and those buildings were knocked down when their replacement arenas opened). Think of how fast BassPro would have jumped on that piece of property had it been shovel-ready. I still have no clue as to the constant need to re-use vacant, worn down buildings in this area. I think my sense of history is as strong as or stronger than anyone in the Buffalo area, but weeping over grain elevators like they were lost children confounds me (especially when there are a number of working grain elevators just blocks away). As you can tell, this subject has hit a nerve. I stop now for brevity (and sanity's) sake... -Ed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Actually, there is a more serious issue here. Our local and state governments are about to spend tens of millions of dollars to encourage a retail store to come to the waterfront. Job creation is the motto, but what jobs? $7/hr-$10/hr retail jobs. It was one thing when the money was earmarked for a corporate HQ of a major cable company. It would be another thing if we were spending the money on a factory with good manufacturing jobs. But this is a waste of good money on jobs that do not provide a living wage. The Bass Pro position is that the store will be a magnet and will draw visitors to the community. Yet, there's already another Bass Pro within a four hour drive in every cardinal direction. So, one would have to live less than a two hour drive from Buffalo to go to this Bass Pro instead of a closer one. Not exactly a magnet; most folks within a two hour drive already come to Buffalo frequently enough. A little more perspective: Two weeks ago, I was travelling through Tulsa. Front page of the Tulsa World: A debate about whether to spend $20M+ of county money to encourage a Bass Pro there. Most folks there seem to realize that's not a good expenditure (and that's in a county with more disposable money). Hey, if there's a Bass Pro here, great. But why use our dollars on it? They should build it themselves or not build it at all. Their contribution to the local economy will be minimal. Let's encourage a higher-wage employer (a factory or an HQ) instead. Sorry if I made this thread "OT." It's important, though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BetweenThePipes00 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Although I have many fond memories of the Aud, it is not historic in any long-term sense. It should have been demolished the day that Marine Midland Arena opened. (Boston Garden, Chicago Stadium and the Olympia in Detroit had far more historic value than the Aud, and those buildings were knocked down when their replacement arenas opened). Think of how fast BassPro would have jumped on that piece of property had it been shovel-ready. I still have no clue as to the constant need to re-use vacant, worn down buildings in this area. I think my sense of history is as strong as or stronger than anyone in the Buffalo area, but weeping over grain elevators like they were lost children confounds me (especially when there are a number of working grain elevators just blocks away). Oh I totally agree. I am certainly not suggesting they should have preserved it. Just that for totally selfish reasons if I had $200 million I would buy it and move in or something ;) Easy to say when it ain't happening. I also tend to agree with Eleven ... I have never understood how this thing was supposed to be such a huge attraction (granted I am a city slicker to the bone, but still ... ) and even if it WAS the only one for hundreds of miles around and people flocked to it, why should taxpayers help foot the bill to build it or clean up the space for it? If it is such a great location Bass Pro should be begging to get in ASAP so they can start making all this money it is supposed to bring in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 The could easily pay off the hazardous material removal costs by auctioning off the Sabres memoribilia. Even parts of the score board could be auctioned, having winners sign waiver forms, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I remember a big spread in the Buffalo News two or three years ago about how this time waterfront development was for real. Now, Bass Pro is no closer to reality than then, and it seems like there are doubts it will ever happen. The casino, meanwhile, looks like it's going to be scaled back because of a dispute with the city. It's really sad to see this great American city can't get its waterfront act together. They are making some progress in this area. The inner harbor area(behind the Aud) is under construction and there is a walkway/bike path/park area that should be started soon along the outer harbor. I believe it is 1-2 miles long. I will find some links later. You are correct about one thing...all these projects take way too long to get off the ground. The remainder of the outer harbor can't be developed until an environmental impact study is completed. The problem with this...THE FREAKIN' STUDY IS GOING TO TAKE 18 MONTHS TO COMPLETE. The other problem with the outer harbor...the NFTA refuses to give up the land and feels that a transportation authority should be in the waterfront development business. :angry: The Casino is just the city being petty. The Seneca's were going to pay 600k+ for a useless piece of property to the city, but that's not good enough. Byron Brown and the city clowns(I mean city councilmen) are going to play hardball with the Senecas and demand that 1/2 of the casino employees must be city residents and 1/3 must be minorities or females. We'll see who wins that battle. <_< Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I used to be a huge Buffalo booster. While I still love the area and the people who live here, the word "progress" is a foreign word. Although I am not a big gambling proponent, I rejoiced when the Senecas actually moved forward on building the casino if only to see ONE downtown project come to fruition. Now that looks like it will be minimized, as so many other projects have been. -Ed I thought I heard on the news this morning that the casino will be only about 5000 sq. ft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrjsbu96 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 For those who don't read the Buffalo News online or don't live here anymore, the powers that be are still trying to figure out if the Aud can be converted into a Bass Pro store. Here is the latest report from an engineering firm... http://www.buffalonews.com/editorial/20060804/1065552.asp thanks for posting the article - i try and stay up on the buff news as much as possible but i missed that one. as said in prior post, i get so sad just reading that article, yet i still want an hour to run around inside that building just like back when i was a kid and we would 'chase' the zamboni down in to the basement after it finished the ice! i really can not believe it got left like this. here's a big amen that somehow this new administration starts acting rather than posturing for too much public opinion on every single project otherwise nothing gets done. btw - part of the allure of Bass Pro is the projects that will accompany it. i thought there was a Great Lakes museum that was supposed to come along with it, although I could be wrong in associating Bass Pro with that museum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 btw - part of the allure of Bass Pro is the projects that will accompany it. i thought there was a Great Lakes museum that was supposed to come along with it, although I could be wrong in associating Bass Pro with that museum. You are correct on the museum. This is what has been talked about, but we will see what the final plan looks like if they can ever come to an agreement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Claude_Verret Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 thanks for posting the article - i try and stay up on the buff news as much as possible but i missed that one. as said in prior post, i get so sad just reading that article, yet i still want an hour to run around inside that building just like back when i was a kid and we would 'chase' the zamboni down in to the basement after it finished the ice! i really can not believe it got left like this. I had the opportunity to run around in the Aud about seven years ago. I was in the Sabres locker room and I too was amazed by the condition it was left in. Smelly old socks and towels everywhere. I remember there was a large pile of papers in a corner. I looked through them and they were players physicals and off season conditioning program reports. I thought it odd that files of that nature would be left behind. In the main entrance the NHL standings and leading scorers were still on display from the day it shut down. They literally shut the lights off and left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Although I have many fond memories of the Aud, it is not historic in any long-term sense. It should have been demolished the day that Marine Midland Arena opened. (Boston Garden, Chicago Stadium and the Olympia in Detroit had far more historic value than the Aud, and those buildings were knocked down when their replacement arenas opened). Think of how fast BassPro would have jumped on that piece of property had it been shovel-ready. I still have no clue as to the constant need to re-use vacant, worn down buildings in this area. I think my sense of history is as strong as or stronger than anyone in the Buffalo area, but weeping over grain elevators like they were lost children confounds me (especially when there are a number of working grain elevators just blocks away). As you can tell, this subject has hit a nerve. I stop now for brevity (and sanity's) sake... -Ed Great point on knocking down old arenas that have a much greater history than the Aud. Here's the problem...as soon as the powers that be announce that it will be cheaper to knock the Aud down and build from scratch(instead of trying to renovate/retrofit it), the preservationists will start screaming and yelling that this beautiful old building :blink: :blink: can't be torn down. This in turn will delay the project to the point where Bass Pro will say FU and will never be heard from again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Great point on knocking down old arenas that have a much greater history than the Aud. Here's the problem...as soon as the powers that be announce that it will be cheaper to knock the Aud down and build from scratch(instead of trying to renovate/retrofit it), the preservationists will start screaming and yelling that this beautiful old building :blink: :blink: can't be torn down. This in turn will delay the project to the point where Bass Pro will say FU and will never be heard from again. I hope I don't cause too much trouble with this comment, but that sounds exactly like the uniform process we're going through right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sabre Dance Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Great point on knocking down old arenas that have a much greater history than the Aud. Here's the problem...as soon as the powers that be announce that it will be cheaper to knock the Aud down and build from scratch(instead of trying to renovate/retrofit it), the preservationists will start screaming and yelling that this beautiful old building :blink: :blink: can't be torn down. This in turn will delay the project to the point where Bass Pro will say FU and will never be heard from again. I fear that we may have already reached that point, but the announcement just hasn't been made yet. November will be the second anniversary of the announcement of the Bass Pro project. I'm not seeing any digging going on.... I wonder what it would be like to live in a community that embraces progress and growth rather than to stomp on it like it was a weed? I think unless I move, I may never know the answer to that..... -Ed :( I hope I don't cause too much trouble with this comment, but that sounds exactly like the uniform process we're going through right now. I agree 100%. -Ed :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffalOhio Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I wonder what it would be like to live in a community that embraces progress and growth rather than to stomp on it like it was a weed? I think unless I move, I may never know the answer to that..... It's pretty easy to see how Buffalo is so stuck in the past when you have lived elsewhere, I can assure you. It's a shame that our beautiful waterfront has never been taken advantage of in a positive way. Just a big, barren wasteland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted August 8, 2006 Author Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I hope I don't cause too much trouble with this comment, but that sounds exactly like the uniform process we're going through right now. Are you trying to compare me to a preservationist? :lol: :lol: Actually this is a pretty funny analogy. Nice job. They are making some progress in this area. The inner harbor area(behind the Aud) is under construction and there is a walkway/bike path/park area that should be started soon along the outer harbor. I believe it is 1-2 miles long. I will find some links later. Below is a link to the outer harbor waterfront pathway(it is a pdf at the top of the page). At the bottom of the page are links to the rest of the outer harbor project, but at this point, some of the proposal maybe a pipe dream(a new convention center??). http://nfta.com/outer_harbor_development.asp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I fear that we may have already reached that point, but the announcement just hasn't been made yet. November will be the second anniversary of the announcement of the Bass Pro project. I'm not seeing any digging going on.... I wonder what it would be like to live in a community that embraces progress and growth rather than to stomp on it like it was a weed? I think unless I move, I may never know the answer to that..... I think the trick is to figure out how to balance preserving the city's great history and traditions, while moving forward to keep up with the rest of the country. A modern Buffalo would be a great, healthy city with lots of jobs and things to do, and population increases. If they could do that while maintaining the traditions, cultural diversity, and uniqueness of Buffalo, it would be a sight to see. Instead, we get squabbling over Twin Span vs. Signature (I honestly don't even understand the debate there); fighting over what to do with vacant factories and unused parcels of land; and where to (or whether or not to) put the next casino. Sad, really. It's pretty easy to see how Buffalo is so stuck in the past when you have lived elsewhere, I can assure you. It's a shame that our beautiful waterfront has never been taken advantage of in a positive way. Just a big, barren wasteland. No arguements here. Its sad driving in through downtown Buffalo and seeing the corpses of the past lining the current waterfront. I hope I don't cause too much trouble with this comment, but that sounds exactly like the uniform process we're going through right now. I won't turn this into another uniform thread, but the uniform sqaubble is exactly what I mentioned above - finding the line between tradition and progress. Its ironic that the uniform debate, coupled with Slabyk's Celsius Design uniforms, has become a metaphor for the city & region - too much indecision, too much bad leadership, including an inability of our leaders to listen to their constituents; and ultimately, the proposed logo is like the Bass Pro Shops idea - too gimmicky, not enough substance. Someday, our elected leaders will get it right, and the city will start to turn it around - I only hope I am here to see it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Isn't the answer obvious? Elect people who will do what you all want. I too live in a much smaller version of Buffalo where people just complain about the lack of leadership, yet don't turn out at the polls. We the people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 I think it runs deeper than that sometimes - its finding the right people to run. Doesn't matter who shows up at the polls if all you're doing is voting for the lesser of two evils... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted August 8, 2006 Report Share Posted August 8, 2006 Isn't the answer obvious? Elect people who will do what you all want. I too live in a much smaller version of Buffalo where people just complain about the lack of leadership, yet don't turn out at the polls. We the people... In NY State, the people don't get to choose the candidates--the party bosses do. So our election day choice comes down to one hack versus another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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