NHL Season Start Date: January 13, 2021

[dudacek]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

Jack and Dahlin will adapt and get their points anyways. You make it sound like only olofsson had a good shot. 

No, I make it sound like Olofsson has an elite shot on the PP that few in the NHL can match.

Edited December 13, 2020 by dudacek

[Derrico]

So we’re theoretically one month away.

Im assuming there will be a two week quarantine for players arriving plus two weeks of training camp.  Surprised we haven’t heard any official announcement yet.

[Thorny]

9 hours ago, JohnC said:

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't a goal scored on a PP scored the same way as a goal scored at ES? If a player scores 30 goals in a season regardless how it is done it still equates to production. I would rather have a 40 goal scorer who scores 30 on PPs and 10 at ES than have a player score 20 at ES and 5 on the PP. Unless the concept of arithmetic has changed in this unusual world of alternate facts 40 is more than 25. 

I mean yes to an extent but even strength goals are still at a premium relative to PP. 

Maybe not enough to bridge a 40-25 gap so point taken, but it's not 1-to-1

Edited December 14, 2020 by Thorny

[Thorny]

5 hours ago, dudacek said:

No, I make it sound like Olofsson has an elite shot on the PP that few in the NHL can match.

Definitely.

It's totally on the coaching staff they couldn't find a way to balance the PP so as to adjust once teams started taking it away. 

His shot is flat out tough to stop if he has a bit of space and the set-up feed is coming from Dahlin. 

[JohnC]

22 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I mean yes to an extent but even strength goals are still at a premium relative to PP. 

Maybe not enough to bridge a 40-25 gap so point taken, but it's not 1-to-1

There is no qualifying on that issue. More goals are better than less goals. And it is more than probable that Olofsson is going to be at a minimum a third line winger, and maybe a second line winger. And it is not out of the realm of possibility that he start off on the first line or periodically be inserted on the first line on select occasions. So he will be getting plenty of ES time. As you acknowledged he has an exceptional quick trigger shot where he can convert set-ups not only in PP situations but also at ES. I also separate myself from those who believe that he is primarily a PP specialist because I do believe that he has a little more expansion to his game that will allow him to be on a line and get plenty of ES time. 

This is somewhat of an associated issue but I'm hoping that Tage and Olofsson will step up and help to provide some sorely needed secondary scoring. If you ask me whether Tage or Olofsson will earn a second line role I can't say for sure but I won't be surprised if one of the two do. 

[Thorny]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

There is no qualifying on that issue. More goals are better than less goals. And it is more than probable that Olofsson is going to be at a minimum a third line winger, and maybe a second line winger. And it is not out of the realm of possibility that he start off on the first line or periodically be inserted on the first line on select occasions. So he will be getting plenty of ES time. As you acknowledged he has an exceptional quick trigger shot where he can convert set-ups not only in PP situations but also at ES. I also separate myself from those who believe that he is primarily a PP specialist because I do believe that he has a little more expansion to his game that will allow him to be on a line and get plenty of ES time. 

This is somewhat of an associated issue but I'm hoping that Tage and Olofsson will step up and help to provide some sorely needed secondary scoring. If you ask me whether Tage or Olofsson will earn a second line role I can't say for sure but I won't be surprised if one of the two do. 

What I was qualifying was your statements on even strength goals vs PP goals, which almost reads as if you are stating them to be equal in value. 

I'm not really venturing into the current Olofsson debate. Merely stating that if 2 guys both have 30 goals, and one has 20 at ES, and the other 10, the one with more ES goals is more valuable. To your point, it's not to the extreme extent you'll very occasionally see where someone wants to toss out PP goals. They are still quite valuable. 

But the fact of the matter remains that it's harder to score at even strength, therefore it is a more desirable/valuable contribution. Pp goals are more easily replaced. 

Edited December 14, 2020 by Thorny

[Ducky]

5 hours ago, Derrico said:

So we’re theoretically one month away.

Im assuming there will be a two week quarantine for players arriving plus two weeks of training camp.  Surprised we haven’t heard any official announcement yet.

Maybe it won't start on the 13th? Maybe the 23rd or the 30th?

 

[Derrico]

9 hours ago, Ducky said:

Maybe it won't start on the 13th? Maybe the 23rd or the 30th?

 

It's sure looking that way.  They won't be getting the 56 games they had first reported under this scenario.  

[LGR4GM]

18 hours ago, JohnC said:

As I previously stated I don't care what line he is on. I have not argued to put him on the first line with Jack. On the contrary I have argued to put Reinhart on the Jack line along with Hall. When all is said and done what matters are the goal totals whether they come from ES, the PP or even the PK. When you look at the scoreboard it shows the goals scored regardless how they are made. I would value a 30 to 40 goal scorer playing on a lower line over a first or second line defensive role player whose purpose is to balance out the line. 

You are creating a straw man with your extrapolation argument. When I am discussing the issue of Olofsson I'm focusing on the issue of value associated with his goal scoring ability regardless whether it comes from the PP or ES. That's the point. 

Okay let me explain it this way. Olofsson is only going to score 40 if you increase his pp time by enough minutes to score 40. There is a direct correlation to toi and points. 

Now you then state this " I would value a 30 to 40 goal scorer playing on a lower line over a first or second line defensive role player whose purpose is to balance out the line. " which is a problem. If Olofsson scores 40 in your breakdown of 30/10, that means for the rest of his TOI at all strengths the other team has to be at 39 or less for his "value" to be good. You are counting 1 side of the equation. For instance Larsson might have only scored what 7 goals, but if he only allowed 7 against (as an example, I didn't look it up) then it balances out and is fine. If Olofsson is getting 6pp minutes a night and 8es minutes he has to be good enough at es for those pp goals to matter. My concern is that Olofsson hurts a top lines ability to produce goals at 5v5 because he lacks enough tools to compete there well. Hence why I would like to see him on the 3rd line and as a PP specialist so then you are maximizing those 40 goals in the equation. 

17 hours ago, dudacek said:

No, I make it sound like Olofsson has an elite shot on the PP that few in the NHL can match.

A shot teams adjusted to on the pp as the season progressed. Olofsson has to evolve to be successful, let's see if he can. 

[JohnC]

10 hours ago, Thorny said:

What I was qualifying was your statements on even strength goals vs PP goals, which almost reads as if you are stating them to be equal in value. 

I'm not really venturing into the current Olofsson debate. Merely stating that if 2 guys both have 30 goals, and one has 20 at ES, and the other 10, the one with more ES goals is more valuable. To your point, it's not to the extreme extent you'll very occasionally see where someone wants to toss out PP goals. They are still quite valuable. 

[b]But the fact of the matter remains that it's harder to score at even strength,[/b] therefore it is a more desirable/valuable contribution. Pp goals are more easily replaced. 

We are in accord that ES goals are more difficult to accomplish. My hope is that Hall returns near to the form that earned him a MVP trophy a few years back. And a lot is riding on Skinner getting back to his standard sharpshooting form with the addition of Staal who is a legitimate 2C center. Hopefully, with an increase in goals it will take some of the pressure off of our less than sterling goaltending. In other words magnify your assets to minimize your liabilities. 

[JohnC]

11 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Okay let me explain it this way. Olofsson is only going to score 40 if you increase his pp time by enough minutes to score 40. There is a direct correlation to toi and points. 

Now you then state this " I would value a 30 to 40 goal scorer playing on a lower line over a first or second line defensive role player whose purpose is to balance out the line. " which is a problem. If Olofsson scores 40 in your breakdown of 30/10, that means for the rest of his TOI at all strengths the other team has to be at 39 or less for his "value" to be good. You are counting 1 side of the equation. For instance Larsson might have only scored what 7 goals, but if he only allowed 7 against (as an example, I didn't look it up) then it balances out and is fine. If Olofsson is getting 6pp minutes a night and 8es minutes he has to be good enough at es for those pp goals to matter. My concern is that Olofsson hurts a top lines ability to produce goals at 5v5 because he lacks enough tools to compete there well. Hence why I would like to see him on the 3rd line and as a PP specialist so then you are maximizing those 40 goals in the equation. 

 

I have no problem with him on the third line. As I have stated before I would rather have Reinhart on the first line with Jack and Hall. If Olofsson earns a second line assignment then more power to him. You compete for your ice time and role. That's how it works. So in general we are dancing to the same music. Where I somewhat disagree with your position is that I believe that Olofsson has more potential to expand his game than you do. I'm not wedded to a player's role. Let's just see how it plays out. 

[Brawndo]

As a sign we are getting closer, The Return of the Rasmuses Has Begun

 

[LGR4GM]

The Return of the Rasmi. 

[Brawndo]

47 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

The Return of the Rasmi. 

The Great Rasmi Migration 

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, Brawndo said:

As a sign we are getting closer, The Return of the Rasmuses Has Begun

 

Is there a required quarantine for players coming into town from outside the country? And if so will players such as Cozens and Quinn miss training camp because of the travel and quarantine requirements take away from the training camp period. 

[Eleven]

18 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Is there a required quarantine for players coming into town from outside the country? And if so will players such as Cozens and Quinn miss training camp because of the travel and quarantine requirements take away from the training camp period. 

Just the NYS requirements.

[Brawndo]

15 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Is there a required quarantine for players coming into town from outside the country? And if so will players such as Cozens and Quinn miss training camp because of the travel and quarantine requirements take away from the training camp period. 

From what I understand it’s 8 days for players taking commercial flights from Canada to the US for Cozens and Quinn so if Canada Makes the WJC Gold Medal Game on January 5th they would miss all of TC and possibly part of the regular season.  This was from a Darren Dreger Interview. On Friday. If the OHL is going to Start on February 1 as scheduled it doesn’t make any sense for Quinn to come to Buffalo. If the OHL It’s not going to start on time it makes sense for him to come to Buffalo and be part of the taxi squad not get any game action unless he is ready. 
 

International Players from Europe are subject to NYS Regulations as Eleven mentioned. 

[LGR4GM]

28 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

The Great Rasmi Migration 

Back to the Rasmi

[JohnC]

5 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

From what I understand it’s 8 days for players taking commercial flights from Canada to the US for Cozens and Quinn so if Canada Makes the WJC Gold Medal Game on January 5th they would miss all of TC and possibly part of the regular season.  This was from a Darren Dreger Interview. On Friday. If the OHL is going to Start on February 1 as scheduled it doesn’t make any sense for Quinn to come to Buffalo. If the OHL It’s not going to start on time it makes sense for him to come to Buffalo and be part of the taxi squad not get any game action unless he is ready. 
 

International Players from Europe are subject to NYS Regulations as Eleven mentioned. 

Thanks for the response. It clarifies the issue for me. My concern about the situation dealt primarily how it affects Cozens. Overall, I'm glad that Cozens had the opportunity to play in the Junior games and hopefully grow from the experience. But for the short term it sets him back a little with his roster positioning. He not being available for our camp and the early part of the season should open up an opportunity for some other players. The player who I will be watching is Arttu who has been playing in Europe. So he might be a little more advanced coming into camp than some of the players that he will be competing with for a roster spot and role. 

[Brawndo]

28 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

Back to the Rasmi

The Revenge of the Rasmi

[DarthEbriate]

10 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

The Revenge of the Rasmi

This is getting out of hand. Now there are two of them (who have documented their travel back to Buffalo)!

[Brawndo]

41 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Thanks for the response. It clarifies the issue for me. My concern about the situation dealt primarily how it affects Cozens. Overall, I'm glad that Cozens had the opportunity to play in the Junior games and hopefully grow from the experience. But for the short term it sets him back a little with his roster positioning. He not being available for our camp and the early part of the season should open up an opportunity for some other players. The player who I will be watching is Arttu who has been playing in Europe. So he might be a little more advanced coming into camp than some of the players that he will be competing with for a roster spot and role. 

I do wonder what the rules are for non commercial air travel and if they were to send a private jet for them, would the quarantine period be shorter allowing Cozens some TC Time. You are right though, Arttu should have the biggest benefit from Cozens not being there. 

[LGR4GM]

49 minutes ago, Brawndo said:

The Revenge of the Rasmi

For a Few Rasmi More

 

[I-90 W]

When should we realistically expect to see the schedule released? 

[dudacek]

17 minutes ago, I-90 W said:

When should we realistically expect to see the schedule released? 

Both sides worked on the plan through the weekend. Hope is for the union and the owners to vote on the plan before the end of the week.

So, I'm thinking we might see something as soon as Friday.