WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Risto isn't cheap depth. He's paid to be a top pair defender. How many teams have 2-3 defensemen making more than him? He ranks 35th in the league at a $5.4M hit through 2022. He's 29th in the league for points among d-men. He's remarkably consistent and healthy. He's perfectly paid to be a 2-3 d-man. If he was on any other team we'd be screaming to trade for him. He'd be the center piece in all of our RoR talks. Slavin gets $5.3M a year and scores 30 points consistently. Risto scores 40+ consistently Edited June 6, 2018 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 He ranks 35th in the league, at a $5.4M hit through 2022. He's 29th in the league for points among d-men. He's remarkably consistent and healthy. He's perfectly paid to be a 2-3 d-man. If he was on any other team we'd be screaming to trade for him. He'd be the center piece in all of our RoR talks. Slavin gets $5.3M a year and scores 30 points consistently. Risto scores 40+ consistently Slavin is great defensively, very good in transition, and gets little PP time - he has 10 more even strength points than Risto this year. Risto racks up points like any competent point man would passing to Jack on the PP, and is mediocre at the other two things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Assuming Botterill doesn’t give a what we think, has decided to trade ROR and is angling for a Richards style package, what are some possibilities? Edited June 6, 2018 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7+6=13 Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 IF O'Reilly gets traded, I think it'll tell us a lot about where Botterill thinks the team is at. Given there's no compelling reason to move him (such as entering the last year of his contract), if Botterill trades him for futures, to me that means he thinks the team won't compete for 3 years. I'm not sure how you're defining compete. We've got to be 2-3 years away from being a playoff team. I think it'll tell us more of what he thinks of a 29-30 year old O'Reilly if he moves him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Assuming Botterill doesn’t give ###### what we think, has decided to trade ROR and is angling for Richards style package, what are some possibilities? Can you refresh us on what the Richards package is, and what those players were viewed as at the time? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Slavin is great defensively, very good in transition, and gets little PP time - he has 10 more even strength points than Risto this year. Risto racks up points like any competent point man would passing to Jack on the PP, and is mediocre at the other two things. While also playing on a much better even strength team though And why isn't he on the powerplay? Edited June 6, 2018 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 I'm not sure how you're defining compete. We've got to be 2-3 years away from being a playoff team. I think it'll tell us more of what he thinks of a 29-30 year old O'Reilly if he moves him. I think any O’Reilly trade would come from two things: Changing the chemistry Cost-benefit analysis of which piece being moved gets us closer to the cup. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 I'm not sure how you're defining compete. We've got to be 2-3 years away from being a playoff team. I think it'll tell us more of what he thinks of a 29-30 year old O'Reilly if he moves him. No way. Over half the damn teams in this league make the playoffs every year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrueBlueGED Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 I'm not sure how you're defining compete. We've got to be 2-3 years away from being a playoff team. I think it'll tell us more of what he thinks of a 29-30 year old O'Reilly if he moves him. We're not 2-3 years away from a playoff team. At least, we don't have to be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 While also playing on a much better even strength team though But it's better in part because he gets fed hard minutes, whereas using Ristolainen against top lines is a reason why we get caved in. Risto makes whatever he makes, which is worth it for how we use him and for how he is likely perceived around the league, but isn't worth how he actually performs. So I think we could get better with the type of swap you want to avoid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7+6=13 Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 No way. Over half the damn teams in this league make the playoffs every year. So. You think what then, we make the playoffs next season? Or the next? Then we disagree by 1-2 years vs 2-3. We've got a lot of work to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 So. You think what then, we make the playoffs next season? Or the next? Then we disagree by 1-2 years vs 2-3. We've got a lot of work to do. I think we make the playoffs next year Then again, I'm a sucker for optimism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Can you refresh us on what the Richards package is, and what those players were viewed as at the time? Brayden Schenn was 20 and about to start his first pro season after ripping up the WHL in both his post-draft years.He was considered a centre, was a fifth overall pick, and was generally considered one of the best prospects outside the NHL. Wayne Simmonds was 23 with three NHL seasons under his belt of 23, 40 and 30 points. A proven young middle six winger with upside. Schenn translates to Mittelstadt, Simmonds to...I don’t know, Boone Jenner maybe? Edited June 6, 2018 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Need an awful lot more goals to make that a reality.We need about 50 less goals against too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 @lets go, it was Richards for Simmonds, Schenn and a second. The Couterier pick was acquired in the Carter trade Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7+6=13 Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 I think we make the playoffs next year Then again, I'm a sucker for optimism. I appreciate that but you've got to agree the odds of it being next year vs 2-3 years are in my favor. I think there's not just reason for optimism but it's likely we are going to be a very good team. When you have Eichel, Mittelstadt and Dahlin - you're going to be very good but it doesn't happen quickly. Not when there's a void at goaltending and no veteran leadership of any kind. It's going to take time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Simmonds was seen as more physical than Jenner is. Philly fans loved him immediately. I think he was more like a younger version of Scott Hartnell.Young Hartnell had more draft pedigree, but good call on early career performance.I’m trying to find a guy rated similarly now to what Simmonds was then. Tom Wilson? Edited June 6, 2018 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Young Hartnell had more draft pedigree, but good call on early career performance. I’m trying to find a guy rated similarly now to what Simmonds was then. Matthew Tkachuk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Thanks Let's Go B-Lo and duda. with the 1st that might be something I'm cool with, with a 2nd there the way it was, I'm not so sure I'm interested. Tkachuk could be the perfect Simmonds comp, but then I don't think they have a Schenn there in Calgary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) We need about 50 less goals against too. 2nd year system, new goalie, Dahlin, and Pilut will go a long way to helping that. Edited June 6, 2018 by WildCard Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Matthew Tkachuk. No way. Tkachuk got 48 points at 19 and 49 at 20. Simmonds hadn’t even played an NHL game at Tkachuk’s age. He was 23 when he was traded and was coming off a 30-point year, though he did score 40 the year before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 No way. Tkachuk got 48 points at 19 and 49 at 20. Simmonds hadn’t even played an NHL game at Tkachuk’s age. He was 23 when he was traded and was coming off a 30-point year, though he did score 40 the year before. Then I don't wanna trade ROR! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Thanks Let's Go B-Lo and duda. with the 1st that might be something I'm cool with, with a 2nd there the way it was, I'm not so sure I'm interested. Tkachuk could be the perfect Simmonds comp, but then I don't think they have a Schenn there in Calgary. Tkachuk has more value than Simmonds or Schenn did iMO. Maybe with a Bennett or a Valimaki? Edited June 6, 2018 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 Tkachuk has more value than Simmonds or Schenn did iMO. Maybe a Bennett or a Valimaki? I want absolutely no part of Bennett Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 6, 2018 Report Share Posted June 6, 2018 (edited) Even if you get fair value, it always comes back to the huge hole O’Reilly leaves in our roster. Nothing short of JT would fix it. I want absolutely no part of BennettAt the risk of Blue’s scorn:Schenn D3 18 points, D4 26 Bennett 26 and 26. I certainly wouldn’t be paying a ton for him, but he’s still 21. He’s very interesting as a buy-low throw-in. Edited June 6, 2018 by dudacek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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