Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 Wait - now we're talking politics? That is fully Golisano's space. :) All I know is lately the interviews with players have indicated that players around the league are noticing the change that is occurring in Buffalo. That is a huge positive first step for the Sabres organization that seems to have rated near the bottom in player's minds based on those past surveys. So you heard Marty Turco lobbying for a job either playing goalie or as a broadcaster too? :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nobody Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 So you heard Marty Turco lobbying for a job either playing goalie or as a broadcaster too? :) That plus the Stafford interview on GR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 Can someone put together a list from the Rigas era? 1) Builds state of the art arena 2) $5 tickets 3) Trip to Stanley Cup 4) Free Internet at arena 5) Went to jail to keep team in Buffalo Rigas wins Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 1) Builds state of the art arena 2) $5 tickets 3) Trip to Stanley Cup 4) Free Internet at arena 5) Went to jail to keep team in Buffalo Rigas wins And Weiner sent some pics to get a head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 Ummm - 1, 2 and 3 also put money in OSP's pocket - He cleared about 100 million dollars on his Sabres investment. The whole point of the ribbon board was the ability to sell additional advertising. As for the party in the plaza - did you have any of those drafts they were selling? I can't remember how much they were - $4.00 comes to mind - but they sure weren't selling them at cost! I bolded #1, that was the biggest of them all and 85% of the reason OSP got involved in the first place (15% political aspirations). I totally missed the ribbon board. Good Catch. I have not been to a party in the Plaza. I live 500 miles away, work a 12hrs/day 7days/week job, have a young child and one on the way, and as I type this am realizing that I am a failure as a fan. :cry: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of Dwight Drane Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 And Weiner sent some pics to get a head. I don't know why, but for some reason every time one of these internet scandals comes about.....I somehow feel you will be on the receiving end of the scandal at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Braedon Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 If I play against the Buffalo Sabres, NOBODY SCARES ME!!! That I can get behind. Here's hoping that guy is right around the bend. If not, another few years without hummers, as you say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 I actually got a couple of projects completed quicker than I expected, so I've got a couple of minutes, so here goes I think the difference between you and DeLuca is more a difference in perspective than anything else. And I guess I can relate to both sides. What you see as noticeable changes in operation are seen by DeLuca (and myself to some extent) as the type of changes someone makes when they buy a house. Alot of the items on your list amount to a refreshening of the environment. Sure, it costs money that the previous owner wasn't willing to spend, but the real issues are the ones that the home inspector drummed up. And those haven't been addressed yet. If you've ever had a new neighbor move in that planted flowers and installed a new rug but didn't repair the gutters or fix the crumbling foundation you'll know where DeLuca and Dwight are coming from. I like very much that the new owner thought that a refreshening was a good idea. But I'm waiting until I see a contractor's van before I get excited. Damn, I think I just channeled Dwight there. :blink: The bolded is a very fair opinion. I will agree that several of the items that the new crew have implemented / are implementing ARE of a changing the drapes (or rugs as the case may be) variety. I've also agreed several times that any single item they've worked on taken by itself is not impressive. (Though I might pull the modifications to the scouting staff out of that and say that IS impressive.) But they have done well w/ scouting in the "video scouting" era, adding additional scouts to follow up on the leads they generate through the video scouting can only make that better (at worst, it stays where it's at, which does SEEM pretty good). I do believe that some of the proposed changes, such as the additions to the scouting staff, additions to the developmental coaching staff, improvements to the ice surface itself, and improved training facilities are more than just slapping on a new coat of paint. To me those are shoring up the foundation (to get back to your home buying analogy). Whether those are being done well enough to keep the house from caving in remains to be seen; but they are being done, and it's been a long time since they were. Whether they (along w/ the other items underway) are enough to move things at a rapid pace in the right direction remains to be seen. And those who are certain that DR &/or LR should be gone may be proven right. Time will tell, but coming in here on what seems to be a daily basis by some (present company is NOT included in that group) simply to say "see, he STILL hasn't done anything" gets real blanking old, real blanking quick. Taro...you make good points. I freely admit the franchise is in much better feng shui. It can only help the end results become more efficient. The question becomes, if the team was reaching 85% of their potential, and now they have the ability to hit 98%, is that good enough to beat a Vancouver, Boston, Philly, Detroit, etc.? It is possible that the current structure hits on all cylinders but that still isn't near enough to pass the true class. In reality....we are all stuck waiting on election night for the results to come in. I think they ran the wrong candidate and if we lose...it will be 4 years before you get a shot at it again. That's all. The money is in the coffers....the plane has hit all the campaign stops.....now the votes will come in on the ice. I don't have the energy to be here and complain for the next 4 years. Pegula and his family are awesome. Ted Black is refreshing. I think Darcy and Lindy are good people and just because I feel they lack in certain areas when running a team, doesn't mean they are lacking as humans. I think Pegula sees that as well and that is why they were given some more rope. Maybe they will surprise me and bring in a real man on the ice with some talent. I just have seen too much of the Darcy/Lindy philosophy for me to believe the right guy will come here. Once they finally admit that there may be a shortcoming, they sort of dip their toes in. We have no forwards on the team who can score and play physical?....well we will draft a bunch of guys that may end up here in 4 years. We have no leaders that have been through the war and know what winning a Cup is about?......well we will sign a guy off the bottom of the street who is thinking about retirement 50 weeks out of the year and tries a bit for 2 weeks. We have a towering Calder winner who has the potential to become an all-around force someday......maybe in 2015 we will bring in a guy who can teach him how to use his body and show no fear. The team is slowly shifting in balance from All-flamers, to some flamers and some guys who try hard and won't back down. We still don't have 1 guy that has both the talent and desire to take the game to the opposition knowing they are the better man and forcing the other guy to prove otherwise. You get a little of that from Gaustad and Weber and Gerbe have that trait in them but still need to develop their game. If I play against the Buffalo Sabres, NOBODY SCARES ME!!! Someday my prince will come. To the bolded: you may be right, it may not be. As you state, we won't know until it plays out. I think they are going to head in the right direction, and honestly, even if it turns out the wrong guy (DR) is in there to get all the way, they do have A right guy to move in the right direction. (Not saying DR is the wrong guy. Just saying I don't KNOW that he IS the right guy.) This team is NOT going to become a TO Make Us Laughs under Darcy's purview. I fully expect them to be at worst, a consistent playoff team and have seen enough to believe they may be more than that in the near future. If Darcy (&/or Lindy) can't get them over the top, there is plenty of time to bring someone else in that can get them there. I don't see keeping DR/LR in place as setting this team back by years. (If it in fact does set them back at all, I expect it to be more of a matter of months.) I do believe they've got the opportunity to head in the right direction and if it becomes obvious that they can't get it done, they (meaning TP & crew, not DR & crew) will have the resources to make the tweak necessary to "get the job done" (going back to the felon's days). I have to run very soon, so I don't have the time to fully flesh this out, hopefully it isn't too incoherent nor too rambly. I'll try to return tonight to finish the thoughts. 1) Builds state of the art arena 2) $5 tickets 3) Trip to Stanley Cup 4) Free Internet at arena 5) Went to jail to keep team in Buffalo Rigas wins 1. That was SHK3 & (gag) LQ. (Though I know for a fact that most of the cheaping out on the arena were LQ, which gives some consolation.) 2. That should read FREE tix. (A few thou per game) 3. That they did. Too bad the league hasn't seen fit to finish that series yet. 4. Did not know that. 5. A true man of the people. ;) Don't know how to argue w/ the conclusion, so I guess the felon does. B-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 All valid points Taro. IMO it comes down to what does one percieve as significant positive change? Some (like you) are already convinced that significant positive change has happened. Others are going to wait until the roster shows significant improvement on the ice (or at least on paper this summer :D ). Both sides have a logical, well thought out basis for their position. Time will tell, but coming in here on what seems to be a daily basis by some (present company is NOT included in that group) simply to say "see, everything is Roses in Hockey Heaven" gets real blanking old, real blanking quick. Just thought I'd fix that to show what the other side sees. :blush: It really does come down to point of view and perspective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 Funny how you criticize Pegs for doing nothing except off the ice stuff, then list your top 5 for sugar packets as off the ice stuff. That was kind of the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 The world juniors and frozen four were money making opportunities that any owner would take up. I wouldn't be surprised to see the frozen four or some other money making opportunity hockey competition/tourney make it's way back to Buffalo, as TP and TB are trying to sell this city as Hockey Heaven. The uniform changes, well, now that we have our original logo back (which "fans ate up"), so I wouldn't expect another uni change for a while (except maybe the third jerseys, although, I liked last seasons throwbacks). Yet they raised ticket prices to qualify for revenue sharing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted June 7, 2011 Report Share Posted June 7, 2011 All valid points Taro. IMO it comes down to what does one percieve as significant positive change? Some (like you) are already convinced that significant positive change has happened. Others are going to wait until the roster shows significant improvement on the ice (or at least on paper this summer :D ). Both sides have a logical, well thought out basis for their position. Just thought I'd fix that to show what the other side sees. :blush: It really does come down to point of view and perspective. There is going to be that portion of this board that will promote any "change" as significant. If a new rug and a free program are indicators of "change" I can only imagine the impact of another Steve Montador or Craig Rivet type of trade or signing. It wouldn't be a bad idea to put a definition of "significant" on the record. For me it will a player brought in that would be considered at least one the top three players on the roster. When talking top three it should Myers, Vanek and new acquisition. That player also needs to be the center piece. Not the only piece of the off-season. This shouldn't be a problem for a owner willing to spend and a "quality" GM like Regier. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BuffaloSoldier2010 Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 I bolded #1, that was the biggest of them all and 85% of the reason OSP got involved in the first place (15% political aspirations). I totally missed the ribbon board. Good Catch. I have not been to a party in the Plaza. I live 500 miles away, work a 12hrs/day 7days/week job, have a young child and one on the way, and as I type this am realizing that I am a failure as a fan. :cry: Not a failure at all! I went to all the P.I.P's this year but game three was my first ever. And i live in Rochester. The only reason i went to the plaza was because i was still living at UB at the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 There is going to be that portion of this board that will promote any "change" as significant. If a new rug and a free program are indicators of "change" I can only imagine the impact of another Steve Montador or Craig Rivet type of trade or signing. It wouldn't be a bad idea to put a definition of "significant" on the record. For me it will a player brought in that would be considered at least one the top three players on the roster. When talking top three it should Myers, Vanek and new acquisition. That player also needs to be the center piece. Not the only piece of the off-season. This shouldn't be a problem for a owner willing to spend and a "quality" GM like Regier. I don't need a definition for "significant". And as much as we may agree on the current situation, I doubt that our def of "significant" would be entirely the same. I'll group it with porn, I can't really define it but I know what it is when I see it. And I wanna see it soon. :w00t: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 What does/did this team have that makes them never fall to the bottom? I've often wondered this when thinking about the recent banners in pittsburgh and chicago. Clearly falling to the cellar for a while has it's rewards. But we never seem to be able to finish worse than a couple of games out of the playoffs. I'm not trying to get a judgement on whether they can win the cup or not. What I am trying to ask is, what is it about this coach and this team that seems to never fall off the cliff? You have to admit they rebuild faster than almost any other franchise? This leads to the question, are these qualities something about the status quo that we should try and keep? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 What does/did this team have that makes them never fall to the bottom? I've often wondered this when thinking about the recent banners in pittsburgh and chicago. Clearly falling to the cellar for a while has it's rewards. But we never seem to be able to finish worse than a couple of games out of the playoffs. I'm not trying to get a judgement on whether they can win the cup or not. What I am trying to ask is, what is it about this coach and this team that seems to never fall off the cliff? You have to admit they rebuild faster than almost any other franchise? This leads to the question, are these qualities something about the status quo that we should try and keep? I think it's Lindy. The guy might not be able to get over the hump, but he has only finished more than 3 wins out of the playoffs once in the eternity that he has been the coach, and that season the team was being run by the NHL. I think he has an amazing ability to adapt. I'm just not sure that ability extends far enough up the NHL food chain to bring home the cup. Not saying he can't, just that I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 All valid points Taro. IMO it comes down to what does one percieve as significant positive change? Some (like you) are already convinced that significant positive change has happened. Others are going to wait until the roster shows significant improvement on the ice (or at least on paper this summer :D ). Both sides have a logical, well thought out basis for their position. Just thought I'd fix that to show what the other side sees. :blush: It really does come down to point of view and perspective. I'd guess that we are closer to agreement than not about where the Sabres are right now. I believe that they are in the process of making 'significant positive change' to their processes right now. Will those changes be enough to let their existing team (DR, LR, KD, current scouts, JP, JC, KA, etc) and new members brought in get to where we want them to go? I don't know, and neither does anybody else posting here. But I have seen businesses significantly turn around their operations while keeping the same rank & file in place by improving their processes. (I've also seen businesses change their processes and get nothing to show for it because they didn't understand why they were changing &/or what they hoped/expected to accomplish. And I agree that sometimes those "middle managers" need to go just as much as the guys at the top that can't see the forest for the trees; though I'd agree w/ TP that DR & LR have shown enough in the past to believe that the issues were higher up and that they should get the chance to show what they can do on a level playing field (or, if Buffalo really does become "hockey heaven," one tilted in THEIR favor).) I do believe they're about to be headed in the right direction (if they aren't currently). And I am planning on enjoying the ride. It's been a real damn long time since either the Sabres or Bills have had an owner that put WINNING at the top of the goals. I fully expect there to be missteps along the way, but when the goal is winning, the missteps won't have to be as crushing as when the goal is to break even. I'll wait to see what transpires this summer to decide whether I'm hopeful, excited, or just looking to get through this next year so we can get on to '12-'13; but it is a real nice feeling to be actually EXPECTING the Sabres to do something positive this offseason. (And to think, they should actually be active at the trade deadline next year as well. :thumbsup: ) Maybe I'll be disappointed come end of training camp, but either way I'm pretty damn certain that I'm going to enjoy the ride a hell of a lot more than an Eeyore will. (And I agree that the terminally rosy can be nearly as annoying as the Eeyores of the world.) Sorry 'bout rambling. It's late and I'm shot. Probably won't have time to join the discussion tomorrow as I've still got a ton of real work to get done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kristian Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 I'm not trying to get a judgement on whether they can win the cup or not. What I am trying to ask is, what is it about this coach and this team that seems to never fall off the cliff? You have to admit they rebuild faster than almost any other franchise? They never seem to fall off the cliff, but they're never consistently good for more than perhaps two seasons straight either, before going back to being a 7th to 10th team. To me, rebuilding is something teams like Pittsburgh do. Fall off the map completely for 6-7 years, make a complete overhaul, then come back and be consistently good for a prolonged period. Buffalo makes minor tweaks which perhaps puts them in a good spot for a few seasons, then go back to being very middle of the pack again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LastPommerFan Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 They never seem to fall off the cliff, but they're never consistently good for more than perhaps two seasons straight either, before going back to being a 7th to 10th team. To me, rebuilding is something teams like Pittsburgh do. Fall off the map completely for 6-7 years, make a complete overhaul, then come back and be consistently good for a prolonged period. Buffalo makes minor tweaks which perhaps puts them in a good spot for a few seasons, then go back to being very middle of the pack again. I like this point, and it's a lot of minor tweaks, the 10-11 playoff roster had only 8 players that played on the 06-07 playoff roster. 16 new guys. But there was never a wholesale change, it was always between 3 and 5 players a year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Yet they raised ticket prices to qualify for revenue sharing? we're still near the bottom of the league if I'm not mistaken for avg ticket prices, no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Walk or trade his rights. They have just tied up $4 mil on a 15-20 goal scorer when that money should have been used elsewhere to actually improve the team. So, is this your final word on the Stafford contract? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Now we've got the same people who told me for 5 years how great the Sabres were, that they really weren't great...but how great they are now because of the new ownership. Who are you talking about that are making "great" claims? The people here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spndnchz Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Walk or trade his rights. They have just tied up $4 mil on a 15-20 goal scorer when that money should have been used elsewhere to actually improve the team. The team is not better today because Stafford is signed and they are no closer to being a Cup contender because Stafford has been signed. Stafford, assuming a full year of play has averaged 25 goals a year over the past 4 years. But I guess we'll take ur word as gospel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Don't go using that old math. To get the real answer you must eliminate any goals scored in 5 consecutive games, multiply by 2 any stretches of games were he doesn't score and credit only one half for a goal scored more then 5 feet away from goalie. Oh, also calculate his age in dog years in order to lose patience with the speed of his development. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dEnnis the Menace Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Don't go using that old math. To get the real answer you must eliminate any goals scored in 5 consecutive games, multiply by 2 any stretches of games were he doesn't score and credit only one half for a goal scored more then 5 feet away from goalie. Oh, also calculate his age in dog years in order to lose patience with the speed of his development. :o :lol: :lol: :lol: This definitely just made my morning better haha Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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