Samson's Flow Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I was one of those guys who had reservations on gerbe (ennis not so much - he's awesome) because I just couldn't picture how he could succeed in the nhl. While he's been great lately, can we afford to have so many little guys on one team - if we do aren't we destined to be the same soft team for years and years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I was one of those guys who had reservations on gerbe (ennis not so much - he's awesome) because I just couldn't picture how he could succeed in the nhl. While he's been great lately, can we afford to have so many little guys on one team - if we do aren't we destined to be the same soft team for years and years? I've been labeled as a traitor by some BU friends due to my positive comments about Gerbe in the past month. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I've been labeled as a traitor by some BU friends due to my positive comments about Gerbe in the past month. Well they would know something about turncoats in that part of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I've been labeled as a traitor by some BU friends due to my positive comments about Gerbe in the past month. Mike Eruzione forgives you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Mike Eruzione forgives you. Looking at him now, I'd be scared of him putting a hit out on me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Looking at him now, I'd be scared of him putting a hit out on me. :lol: He is starting to look like Paul Sorvino, isn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dumb_dumb88 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Not to mention his AHL numbers this year as a rookie are pretty great. He's averaging more than a point per game. I'm wondering how much more he has to learn or prove at the AHL level before he needs to continue his development in the NHL. Maybe dumb_dumb can fill us in as I think he actually sees the Pirates play. Luke Adam has a very good set of hands and he combines it with good vision of developing plays on the ice. I wish I could save the streams and show you what I mean. I'm just not good with a computer. But the next game I watch, if it's allowed, I'd like to post the game stream for others to see. Adam's vision on the ice allows him to position himself for some great rebound collection and open passing lanes. But he doesn't do so alot of times on the fly. He tends to hover down low, around the face off circles or in the slot. I will say he has good body size that allows him to maintain control of the puck along the corners and behind the net alot of times. But he has very little speed. And it shows. He's often the 3rd trailer on rush plays. This can be corrected I would imagine, not so much by having him do wind sprints in Portland, but by giving him the opportunity to learn to use what he has to further his production. I'm not advocating he is a bad player by any stretch of the imagination, but he would get back checked heavily in the NHL given the difference in the speed of the game from the AHL. Again, this is merely my opinion based on watching him. His defensive game is very good though. He uses his arm length to clog up the nuetral zone an aweful lot. He reminds me a great deal of a larger version of Guy Carbonneau. He has all the earmarks of a very good shutdown center. The way he covers the point on the PK and how he clogs passing lanes with his size and hands is definitely reminiscent of Carbonneau's abilities. I honestly believe Luke Adam will be a Frank J. Selke Trophy candidate at some time in his career, and I hope it's a majority of it. He is exciting to watch though and if given just another year down in the AHL, we could really have a solid Center, I'd also like him to improve his faceoff abilities, this is where working with a guy like Goose over the Summer could really bring this kid along. Just my opinion though, and in no way is it set in stone that this kid will only be a 25 goal line 3 shutdown center. He could bust out and become a 40 goal guy a la Lecavalier. It's hard to say while he is this young, but like I said, I'd rather have him gaining that experience and confidence in the AHL, to me in any event, I want him up here when he is ready, not when everyone thinks he's ready. It took me almost a 1/2 hour to type this post. :death: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 Luke Adam has a very good set of hands and he combines it with good vision of developing plays on the ice. I wish I could save the streams and show you what I mean. I'm just not good with a computer. But the next game I watch, if it's allowed, I'd like to post the game stream for others to see. Adam's vision on the ice allows him to position himself for some great rebound collection and open passing lanes. But he doesn't do so alot of times on the fly. He tends to hover down low, around the face off circles or in the slot. I will say he has good body size that allows him to maintain control of the puck along the corners and behind the net alot of times. But he has very little speed. And it shows. He's often the 3rd trailer on rush plays. This can be corrected I would imagine, not so much by having him do wind sprints in Portland, but by giving him the opportunity to learn to use what he has to further his production. I'm not advocating he is a bad player by any stretch of the imagination, but he would get back checked heavily in the NHL given the difference in the speed of the game from the AHL. Again, this is merely my opinion based on watching him. His defensive game is very good though. He uses his arm length to clog up the nuetral zone an aweful lot. He reminds me a great deal of a larger version of Guy Carbonneau. He has all the earmarks of a very good shutdown center. The way he covers the point on the PK and how he clogs passing lanes with his size and hands is definitely reminiscent of Carbonneau's abilities. I honestly believe Luke Adam will be a Frank J. Selke Trophy candidate at some time in his career, and I hope it's a majority of it. He is exciting to watch though and if given just another year down in the AHL, we could really have a solid Center, I'd also like him to improve his faceoff abilities, this is where working with a guy like Goose over the Summer could really bring this kid along. Just my opinion though, and in no way is it set in stone that this kid will only be a 25 goal line 3 shutdown center. He could bust out and become a 40 goal guy a la Lecavalier. It's hard to say while he is this young, but like I said, I'd rather have him gaining that experience and confidence in the AHL, to me in any event, I want him up here when he is ready, not when everyone thinks he's ready. It took me almost a 1/2 hour to type this post. :death: AHL post of the year. :thumbsup: Appreciate the opinion even while recognizing the exuberance. If he's ever as half as good as Guy Carbonneau, he'll be pretty darn good. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 All of a sudden, Gerbe is having a pretty nice rookie year. I'm at the point where Ennis is absolutely in my top 6 next year and Gerbe is absolutely in my top 9. If fans are to trust that the way Gerbe is playing right now is the way Gerbe will play going forward beyond this year, does that make Kaleta expendable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 If fans are to trust that the way Gerbe is playing right now is the way Gerbe will play going forward beyond this year, does that make Kaleta expendable? Interesting. Until I see a larger sample from the Gerbil, I can't say whether the play we see right now is the norm or just a good stretch. He clearly has picked up his game the last 30 days or so just as others were cooling off. My suspicion is he will cool, down as someone else heats up (Pominville, Vanek or Stafford).. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted March 24, 2011 Report Share Posted March 24, 2011 I was one of those guys who had reservations on gerbe (ennis not so much - he's awesome) because I just couldn't picture how he could succeed in the nhl. While he's been great lately, can we afford to have so many little guys on one team - if we do aren't we destined to be the same soft team for years and years? Small and soft are not necessarily the same things. You do not have to run around crushing people to be effective. Briere has always been the poster boy of this and has had several successful seasons. Gerbe is strong enough to push people off the puck or at least slow them down and I think that is a strength, his tenacity i mean. Ennis is different he has such good hands that he can maneuver around people and through them and all sorts of things. When pressured on the wall he isnt getting crushed. So both of them have different skills sets that make them valuable even when we discuss size. And if we have two guys at 5'9" and 1 at 5'6"ish who cares as long as they play well which they are. Nik Antropov is 6'6" and has 34pts this season which means Ennis is smaller but better. Why? Because Ennis has had to deal with being small forever and knows how to play to his strengths. It will be interesting to see these two develop but tall doesnt equal tougher and short does not equal softer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 If fans are to trust that the way Gerbe is playing right now is the way Gerbe will play going forward beyond this year, does that make Kaleta expendable? They're in competition for 4-5 roster spots, so I'm not sure if I see much of a connection between the two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nrod424 Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 They're in competition for 4-5 roster spots, so I'm not sure if I see much of a connection between the two. What if we go back to 3 scoring lines? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjag Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 What if we go back to 3 scoring lines? Lindy says we have four. Looking like Richard Lewis won't be sent down. Going to get interesting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 They're in competition for 4-5 roster spots, so I'm not sure if I see much of a connection between the two. They are both agitators. Will the Sabres keep two agitators especially if one has a poor reputation and may be a target of officials. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 They are both agitators. Will the Sabres keep two agitators especially if one has a poor reputation and may be a target of officials. If they decide to replace Kaleta on the roster, it'll have a lot to do with his inability to stay healthy. I love that he doesn't shy away from finishing checks and causing problems for the other team, but at this point I think it would take a miracle for him to play 82 games. Or maybe he just ends up on the 4th line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 If they decide to replace Kaleta on the roster, it'll have a lot to do with his inability to stay healthy. I love that he doesn't shy away from finishing checks and causing problems for the other team, but at this point I think it would take a miracle for him to play 82 games. Or maybe he just ends up on the 4th line. To my initial question, Gerbe has had recent success playing the role of agitator, does that make any decision on Kaleta easier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 To my initial question, Gerbe has had recent success playing the role of agitator, does that make any decision on Kaleta easier? Not necessarily. If I were building a team, I'd want a lot of guys that agitated the other team. I would want the Sabres to be the team that everyone else in the NHL didn't want to deal with. I'd always be greedy about having as many players who play hard, finish checks, and piss off the other team as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 25, 2011 Report Share Posted March 25, 2011 To my initial question, Gerbe has had recent success playing the role of agitator, does that make any decision on Kaleta easier? IMO, yes. With a qualifier. They fill different roles. Gerbe is going to end up on a scoring line if we ever collect enough centers to actually have another scoring line. Kaleta is destined for the checking/energy line role for however long his career lasts. Kaleta's spot on the roster is going to be pushed by other energy/checking line players. But this is all long term, as in next season and onward. Short term, as in the rest of the season, I don't think there is room for both. But not because they are both agitators. It is simply a numbers game. I think when Kaleta is ready to come back he is going to have to wait until an injury or poor performance gives him a crack at the lineup. Gerbe is more versatile. He has a scoring touch and is trusted enough now to play in the closing minutes of a game. He is forcing his way onto the lineup as a regular. His other abilities make it hard to justify putting Kaleta in the lineup right now. Or are you trying to discuss whether it is appropriate to have this many agitators? *waits for the two is enough but three is too many argument* :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 IMO, yes. With a qualifier. They fill different roles. Gerbe is going to end up on a scoring line if we ever collect enough centers to actually have another scoring line. Kaleta is destined for the checking/energy line role for however long his career lasts. Kaleta's spot on the roster is going to be pushed by other energy/checking line players. But this is all long term, as in next season and onward. Short term, as in the rest of the season, I don't think there is room for both. But not because they are both agitators. It is simply a numbers game. I think when Kaleta is ready to come back he is going to have to wait until an injury or poor performance gives him a crack at the lineup. Gerbe is more versatile. He has a scoring touch and is trusted enough now to play in the closing minutes of a game. He is forcing his way onto the lineup as a regular. His other abilities make it hard to justify putting Kaleta in the lineup right now. Or are you trying to discuss whether it is appropriate to have this many agitators? *waits for the two is enough but three is too many argument* :D Not at all. I wish a few others on this roster would play with that edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robviously Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 *waits for the two is enough but three is too many argument* :D NOOOOOOO! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 Not at all. I wish a few others on this roster would play with that edge. Agreed. It would be damned nice to have a couple of skilled players with an edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 Agreed. It would be damned nice to have a couple of skilled players with an edge. Vanek would be a HOF player if he had that type of edge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 If fans are to trust that the way Gerbe is playing right now is the way Gerbe will play going forward beyond this year, does that make Kaleta expendable? They are both agitators. Will the Sabres keep two agitators especially if one has a poor reputation and may be a target of officials. I would not consider Gerbe to be an 'agitator' in the classic sense. Kaleta fits that description to a tee. I'd agree that Gerbe was playing w/ a bit of an edge when he was 1st given a chance to get back into the lineup and that 4th line was playing like an 'energy line.' Now that that line has been remade into more of an '06-'07 vintage 4th line since Mancari was placed on it, I wouldn't say that he's playing like an agitator at all. He is a forechecking machine, which is agitator-like, but he is completely focused on getting the puck IMHO. I'm not seeing the gratuitous follow through after the opponent no longer has the puck, which is a staple of the agitator's playbook. If he would throw the occassional cheap shot to go with the tenacity, I could see him getting compared to Keith Acton, I don't ever see his game getting compared to Linesman's. Gerbe and Ennis are the 2 most entertaining players to watch on this team at this time. Gerbe's playing so well that even Mancari seems to be getting it. As Gerbe isn't a true agitator, I don't see him as a threat to Kaleta's overall place on the team. I see McCormick or whatever kid is trying to crack the lineup from Portland as Kaleta's competition. Gerbe's only a threat to Kaleta as Vanek, Roy, Ennis, Stafford, Boyes, Hecht, etc. are threats because they are better hockey players than Pat. I don't see him making Kaleta expendable because he's a better jackwagon. I see Kaleta on this team next year. Regardless of what moves are made, I see Kaleta as the 13th forward in an absolute worst case (my guess is he ends up the 12th) as there are going to be games where you want that type of player on the ice. And while Gerbe can play with an edge, (as can McCormick and on very limited occassions a couple of others can as well) he isn't that 'agitator.' I actually see Pat as a 40 game fixture on the 4th line for the next 2-4 years which is probably when the career threatening injury takes place. You just can't throw your body around that recklessly without it taking a tremendous toll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weave Posted March 26, 2011 Report Share Posted March 26, 2011 Is anyone else starting to think that with Ennis around we don't need 3 traditional centers? He is turning into such a great playmaker that I think I'd be OK with keeping Boyes at center next year. NOTE- I'm not suggesting that we don't need to get a C in the offseason. But I am starting to think that Ennis can be the primary playmaker on whatever line he populates and that a traditional center isn't needed for him. We still need a center for Vanek. And Roy will be around next year. But if we keep Roy and Ennis on separate lines we'd still have a 3rd playmaker. Vanek - C - Pomminstein Ennis - Boyes - Stafford Gerbe - Roy - Mancari (has he earned it this 2nd half?) McCormick - Gaustad - Kaleta Wow. No room for Hecht? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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