Sabres Training Camp 2025

[dudacek]

1 hour ago, PerreaultForever said:

No, he's supposed to have a truly competitive camp and mix things up to give the roster a chance to form itself. If you are a championship team sure, you might have a predetermined roster, but if you were a bag of crap you should be looking to do things differently. This lacks imagination to me and looks like a roster that will play basically the same way. 

What would you have done for your first day lines?

[PerreaultForever]

2 hours ago, dudacek said:

What would you have done for your first day lines?

There's nothing to be done, because his claim that we have depth now is false. There's virtually no internal competition at all. There's a couple guys who could swap spots in the bottom 6 and that's it. Everything is set before camp begins. Where's the competition for jobs? 

[Eleven]

4 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

There's nothing to be done, because his claim that we have depth now is false. There's virtually no internal competition at all. There's a couple guys who could swap spots in the bottom 6 and that's it. Everything is set before camp begins. Where's the competition for jobs? 

So would you have had the 30 forwards who show up to camp all skate together as a giant mega-line?  Would you have drawn names from a hat?  Or put vets with non-vets so that you can see if there might be true chemistry between Tage Thompson and Tyler Kopff?  What would you propose for the first practice?  

[LGR4GM]

4 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

There's nothing to be done, because his claim that we have depth now is false. There's virtually no internal competition at all. There's a couple guys who could swap spots in the bottom 6 and that's it. Everything is set before camp begins. Where's the competition for jobs? 

I actually agree with you here. There's no real depth. 

[LGR4GM]

Ftr, I don't have a problem with Geertsen but if he's playing more than 20 games as a 4th line plug, you've got problems. 

[Brawndo]

 

[Archie Lee]

4 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

There's nothing to be done, because his claim that we have depth now is false. There's virtually no internal competition at all. There's a couple guys who could swap spots in the bottom 6 and that's it. Everything is set before camp begins. Where's the competition for jobs? 

Respectfully and honestly, can you provide some examples from Bruin camps in the last 5-6 years of multiple players who were competing for a job or two?  Because, the idea of camp competition seems mostly a myth to me. I think most years, most NHL teams go to camp knowing who will be in their line-up on opening day, barring injury. Some years there are openings in spots 19-23 for the kid or AHL vet who shows the best in camp, or a team is up against the cap and they have a spot or two open for the player on an ELC or a league minimum deal to prove they belong in the NHL. But these aren’t the players or roles that typically make or break a season.

Top 6 centre talent, youth and inexperience, coaching deficiencies, inconsistent to bad goaltending, ineffectual management. These are the Sabres’s issues, I think. I just don’t see camp competition or bottom of the line-up depth, as being big factors. 

[JohnC]

50 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

I actually agree with you here. There's no real depth. 

Most people would agree with you that this is not a deep roster. But the difference between now and looking back a couple to few years ago is that we now mostly have players who genuinely can play the role they are assigned, at least starting the season. There are fewer situations where a lower line caliber of player is required to play on a higher line or pairing than his talent should indicate. As an example, Samuelsson playing a third pairing role makes sense compared to him being on the top pairing. I like how Krebs plays as a third or lower-line player, but he is a not a top two-line player. 

But as you noted with your post, there is little depth on this roster to cushion against injuries. A good example of that is when Dahlin, our best player, got hurt last year and the team spiraled into the abyss. 

I really wished that KA would have added another second-line caliber of player this offseason. It not only would have added depth but also created more flexibility as to how the lines could be formed. It's not a surprise that this cautious GM fell short. 

 

[LGR4GM]

 

 

[dudacek]

Depth as defined as “who replaces Dahlin?” doesn’t exist anywhere in the NHL.

The Sabres appear to lack depth in terms of high-end forward talent; if Tage or Tuch is out, the drop-off to the next guy is pretty steep.

They seem deep in terms of the middle of the roster though

McLeod/Kulich, Zucker/Quinn, Benson, Greenway/Doan, Danforth/Krebs that’s 9 bodies capable of middle-six minutes.

Every one of those guys has a guy behind him gunning for his minutes and capable of stepping into his role.

Malenstyn is a legit 4th line grinder who keeps the rest honest and Geertsen brings a very specific and limited skill set as the first men up. 

In terms of callups, Kozak and Dunne are viable role players on the farm, and Östlund and Helenius skill guys. That seems pretty par for the course in the NHL.

Overall, they seem to have numbers, competition and a variety of skill sets.

To me the biggest depth question is will whoever wins the 2nd line minutes be good enough to justify them.

Basically, the biggest depth question is the roster needs another Norris level player

Edited 7 hours ago by dudacek

[DarthEbriate]

2 hours ago, LGR4GM said:

I actually agree with you here. There's no real depth. 

The depth certainly looks worse with Tuch, Greenway, and Luukkonen already missing from the lineup. This overall roster is missing a 1C and a #1 goalie (ha!... no problems there, those are the easiest things to acquire), but as far as lineups go---this one has depth by recent Sabres standards.

Here's the 10/18/22 lineup that won 4-2 at Edmonton and Comrie was excellent in 3rd period Alamo Death Star mode. (the 91-point team)

Skinner - Thompson - Tuch
Asplund - Mittelstadt - Olofsson
Peterka - Cozens - Hinostroza
Girgensons - Krebs - Okposo 
(Quinn, Sheahan)
22-23 Call-ups: Rousek debut end of season, Jost was claimed off waivers

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - Jokiharju
Bryson - Lyubushkin
(Fitzgerald)
22-23 Call-ups: Pilut, Clague

Comrie
(Anderson)
22-23 Call-ups: Luukkonen,  Levi made debut end of season

To today:

Bryson isn't a 5 anymore, he's fighting for 7/8/9. And if Jones is "ok" he can be 7 and Bryson is the 8. Johnson could (should?) displace them both.
For call-ups, Johnson has played in the NHL in each of the last two seasons.

At forward, they now have 13 skaters who were in the NHL last season (JJP/Quinn who entered 22-23 with a combined 4 games of NHL experience). +Geertsen who doesn't count if he's just an enforcer as #14. And your initial call-ups all have NHL GP: Kozak, Östlund, Rosén.

And at goalie, they are 5 deep with NHL games played -- it's the quality that is worrying.

Edited 7 hours ago by DarthEbriate

[LGR4GM]

41 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

The depth certainly looks worse with Tuch, Greenway, and Luukkonen already missing from the lineup. This overall roster is missing a 1C and a #1 goalie (ha!... no problems there, those are the easiest things to acquire), but as far as lineups go---this one has depth by recent Sabres standards.

Here's the 10/18/22 lineup that won 4-2 at Edmonton and Comrie was excellent in 3rd period Alamo Death Star mode. (the 91-point team)

Skinner - Thompson - Tuch
Asplund - Mittelstadt - Olofsson
Peterka - Cozens - Hinostroza
Girgensons - Krebs - Okposo 
(Quinn, Sheahan)
22-23 Call-ups: Rousek debut end of season, Jost was claimed off waivers

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - Jokiharju
Bryson - Lyubushkin
(Fitzgerald)
22-23 Call-ups: Pilut, Clague

Comrie
(Anderson)
22-23 Call-ups: Luukkonen,  Levi made debut end of season

To today:

Bryson isn't a 5 anymore, he's fighting for 7/8/9. And if Jones is "ok" he can be 7 and Bryson is the 8. Johnson could (should?) displace them both.
For call-ups, Johnson has played in the NHL in each of the last two seasons.

At forward, they now have 13 skaters who were in the NHL last season (JJP/Quinn who entered 22-23 with a combined 4 games of NHL experience). +Geertsen who doesn't count if he's just an enforcer as #14. And your initial call-ups all have NHL GP: Kozak, Östlund, Rosén.

And at goalie, they are 5 deep with NHL games played -- it's the quality that is worrying.

This isn't depth. 

43 minutes ago, dudacek said:

Depth as defined as “who replaces Dahlin?” doesn’t exist anywhere in the NHL.

The Sabres appear to lack depth in terms of high-end forward talent; if Tage or Tuch is out, the drop-off to the next guy is pretty steep.

They seem deep in terms of the middle of the roster though

McLeod/Kulich, Zucker/Quinn, Benson, Greenway/Doan, Danforth/Krebs that’s 9 bodies capable of middle-six minutes.

Every one of those guys has a guy behind him gunning for his minutes and capable of stepping into his role.

Malenstyn is a legit 4th line grinder who keeps the rest honest and Geertsen brings a very specific and limited skill set as the first men up. 

In terms of callups, Kozak and Dunne are viable role players on the farm, and Östlund and Helenius skill guys. That seems pretty par for the course in the NHL.

Overall, they seem to have numbers, competition and a variety of skill sets.

To me the biggest depth question is will whoever wins the 2nd line minutes be good enough to justify them.

Basically, the biggest depth question is the roster needs another Norris level player

There's no competition. None. Roster is set and we've known that since July. 

[French Collection]

Benson’s playmaking could shine this year playing with TNT & Norris, two shooters. His defensive game is already at a great level so this part of his game can take a step forward.

Tuch and Greenway will push Geertsen to the fringe, where he should be until the Sabres get bullied. Lindy saying he can play wing or D and be an enforcer means he will be a press box hero until muscle is needed.

[dudacek]

27 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

This isn't depth. 

There's no competition. None. Roster is set and we've known that since July. 

None in terms of making the roster.

There is plenty within the roster.

Tage, Tuch and Norris are the only players with defined roles on the depth chart.

All kinds of variations after that.

[DarthEbriate]

32 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

This isn't depth. 

There's no competition. None. Roster is set and we've known that since July. 

First statement: Then, what is depth? And how many teams in the NHL have it -- eight?

As an example, Colorado had no depth last year. They rode two elite players (MacKinnon/Makar -- who missed a combined 5 games all year) through a mass of injuries and the shoddiest of goaltending early on. They were a period from going 13-13 to start the season until Dahlin got injured (which sent the Sabres - also no depth last season) spiraling out of control. Colorado also then fixed their goaltending which we know is an impossibility here except for Levi ascending.

Second statement: This is a fact. All summer our only debate was which combinations would be among the forwards. But how many non-tanking teams have more than 1 spot "open" after the first surge of UFA? 

[LGR4GM]

12 minutes ago, dudacek said:

None in terms of making the roster.

There is plenty within the roster.

Tage, Tuch and Norris are the only players with defined roles on the depth chart.

All kinds of variations after that.

I don't believe that. 

2 minutes ago, DarthEbriate said:

First statement: Then, what is depth? And how many teams in the NHL have it -- eight?

As an example, Colorado had no depth last year. They rode two elite players (MacKinnon/Makar -- who missed a combined 5 games all year) through a mass of injuries and the shoddiest of goaltending early on. They were a period from going 13-13 to start the season until Dahlin got injured (which sent the Sabres - also no depth last season) spiraling out of control. Colorado also then fixed their goaltending which we know is an impossibility here except for Levi ascending.

Second statement: This is a fact. All summer our only debate was which combinations would be among the forwards. But how many non-tanking teams have more than 1 spot "open" after the first surge of UFA? 

Second: probably none

[shrader]

What is Tuch’s issue right now?

[LGR4GM]

6 minutes ago, shrader said:

What is Tuch’s issue right now?

They haven't said other than minor and day to day. He stood up and did an interview yesterday so my guess is maybe soreness or something?

[TRIP65]

On 9/17/2025 at 3:04 AM, PerreaultForever said:

Zucker-Norris-Tage. That's my top line season opener guess. 

I'm curious to what you said though. If you see McLeod as a center for a checking line who is that line? Who are the other two "checkers"? and then if you build that line what's line 2? Benson and Quinn? Tuch? 

As I type this I can't think of an arrangement I'd feel comfortable with. 

Paying McLeod like a 2C but Kulich's to lose.

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, Eleven said:

So would you have had the 30 forwards who show up to camp all skate together as a giant mega-line?  Would you have drawn names from a hat?  Or put vets with non-vets so that you can see if there might be true chemistry between Tage Thompson and Tyler Kopff?  What would you propose for the first practice?  

2 teams. mix of vets and younger players. Not the combo you stated for your humorous effect but you do mix in the top Rochester guys to see how they interact with vets and yes, you do juggle lines to look for unexpected chemistry. 

I'd be one of those coaches looking at pairs more than lines. 

I just don't think the team was good enough to go with the set line up. If your argument is that everyone else in camp is garbage not worth looking at, well then that's a huge failure on the GM and the organization as a whole. That may be reality, but it's not a good reality if that's the case.

[PerreaultForever]

6 hours ago, Archie Lee said:

Respectfully and honestly, can you provide some examples from Bruin camps in the last 5-6 years of multiple players who were competing for a job or two?  Because, the idea of camp competition seems mostly a myth to me. I think most years, most NHL teams go to camp knowing who will be in their line-up on opening day, barring injury. Some years there are openings in spots 19-23 for the kid or AHL vet who shows the best in camp, or a team is up against the cap and they have a spot or two open for the player on an ELC or a league minimum deal to prove they belong in the NHL. But these aren’t the players or roles that typically make or break a season.

Top 6 centre talent, youth and inexperience, coaching deficiencies, inconsistent to bad goaltending, ineffectual management. These are the Sabres’s issues, I think. I just don’t see camp competition or bottom of the line-up depth, as being big factors. 

I don't want to talk much about Bruins because this is a Sabres site and people don't want that but since you asked the contrast is massive.

Now, as I said, if your team is a top team and a cup contender your line up is pretty close to set. So when you look back on the Bergeron era top rated Bruins teams rookies were in camp but on the margins for sure. But the Sabres aren't a top team. You don't have a set line up (pretty much the same as the year before) when you sucked. 

So this year, Bruins now suck like the Sabres, camp is loaded with people fighting for jobs. It's near impossible to know who will play where outside of maybe Geekie Lindholm Pasta.   They are moving people around all over. They really have too many bodies. Way too many. Will any young guys make it? No idea, but the idea that fans don't know the final lines and roster at all is the contrast. 

By all rights Bruins should suck and bottom feed for the next several years. If they finish this year ahead of the Sabres you as a Sabres fan might as well just give up watching hockey. 

[PerreaultForever]

1 hour ago, TRIP65 said:

Paying McLeod like a 2C but Kulich's to lose.

If Kulich is your 2C you are asking too much too soon imo and you are asking Tuch to basically carry the line. Kulich as 2C is the Cozens mistake all over again. Not saying Kulich is the same as Cozens, it's just the same failed development model. 

[dudacek]

50 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

2 teams. mix of vets and younger players. Not the combo you stated for your humorous effect but you do mix in the top Rochester guys to see how they interact with vets and yes, you do juggle lines to look for unexpected chemistry. 

I'd be one of those coaches looking at pairs more than lines. 

I just don't think the team was good enough to go with the set line up. If your argument is that everyone else in camp is garbage not worth looking at, well then that's a huge failure on the GM and the organization as a whole. That may be reality, but it's not a good reality if that's the case.

What would you say to Lindy when he tells reporters he wants to maximize the implementation of structural changes in the way the team plays defence?

He said wants those systems absorbed together by the players most likely to be playing together and tested against the best possible opponents, rather than minor-leaguers and prospects.

38 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

If Kulich is your 2C you are asking too much too soon imo and you are asking Tuch to basically carry the line. Kulich as 2C is the Cozens mistake all over again. Not saying Kulich is the same as Cozens, it's just the same failed development model. 

You say Kulich is not ready for 2nd line minutes, and Benson is not ready for 1st line minutes, and you've said none of the Sabres minor leaguers are NHL ready.

And you've also said they're not giving players chances to prove themselves and find chemistry.

Explain to me how that isn't arguing against yourself.

Edited 2 hours ago by dudacek

[Porous Five Hole]

Serious question.  Should we be preparing for Devon Levi to be G1 on opening night?

UPL is hurt and not much info is available for a timeline. Lyon is an NHL backup who can get hot. Georgiev is a lotto ticket who was signed as a just in case. 
 

Are we here with a just in case mentality? Who owns the crease on Oct 9? It is only 2.5 weeks away. Is Devon the plan?

[dudacek]

1 minute ago, Porous Five Hole said:

Serious question.  Should we be preparing for Devon Levi to be G1 on opening night?

UPL is hurt and not much info is available for a timeline. Lyon is an NHL backup who can get hot. Georgiev is a lotto ticket who was signed as a just in case. 
 

Are we here with a just in case mentality? Who owns the crease on Oct 9? It is only 2.5 weeks away. Is Devon the plan?

I think UPL remains the plan for now.

The fact the Levi is with the Amerks, not the Sabres emphasizes that he is not currently the plan.

But like a noted intellect once observed, everyone has a plan until they get punched in the face.