blugold43 Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/story/641042.html?imw=Y if the sabres take this clown's advice, they are officially the stupidest effing franchise in the history of sports, and considering they'd have to surpass Ralph Wilson's bills to achieve that honor, that is quite an accomplishment. actually he doesn't even have the balls to come out and say it, but you can tell it's what he thinks should happen. is he really insinuating that Lindy should have snapped his fingers and turned the 05 Amerks into this years Stanley cup champs? who in the hell does he think polished the turds he has been handed every year into four conference finalists? for crying out loud, does anyone disagree that if Jay Mckee had been smart enough to keep the cut on his leg clean, we'd have won the cup? If golisano and/or quinn and/or regier make Lindy the fall guy for the 100% predictable travesty the Sabres have become, they will officially lose me as a fan. Or rather, I should say the NHL will lose me, because I could never root for another team...but the "axis of evil" are working very hard to drive me away from this one. and vogl you're an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/story/641042.html?imw=Y if the sabres take this clown's advice, they are officially the stupidest effing franchise in the history of sports, and considering they'd have to surpass Ralph Wilson's bills to achieve that honor, that is quite an accomplishment. actually he doesn't even have the balls to come out and say it, but you can tell it's what he thinks should happen. is he really insinuating that Lindy should have snapped his fingers and turned the 05 Amerks into this years Stanley cup champs? who in the hell does he think polished the turds he has been handed every year into four conference finalists? for crying out loud, does anyone disagree that if Jay Mckee had been smart enough to keep the cut on his leg clean, we'd have won the cup? If golisano and/or quinn and/or regier make Lindy the fall guy for the 100% predictable travesty the Sabres have become, they will officially lose me as a fan. Or rather, I should say the NHL will lose me, because I could never root for another team...but the "axis of evil" are working very hard to drive me away from this one. and vogl you're an idiot. I take it as more of an analysis than anything else. I don't think he's calling for Ruff to be fired. He's just making the case, which seems obvious. You can't miss the playoffs five times in seven seasons (and within a whisker of his mustache of being six in nine) and expect your job to be safe. Maybe John isn't a local who remembers Ruff as a Sabre. Maybe he can be objective about the situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VansTheMans Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I actually liked Bucky's article regarding Ruff. I know, I like a Bucky article (a cardinal sin here). But he points the finger more at management than Ruff, something we can all agree on. Check out the article: http://www.buffalonews.com/opinions/column...ory/641028.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deluca67 Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I have one question. Who is John Vogl? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thesportsbuff Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I have one question. Who is John Vogl? " . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I take it as more of an analysis than anything else. I don't think he's calling for Ruff to be fired. He's just making the case, which seems obvious. You can't miss the playoffs five times in seven seasons (and within a whisker of his mustache of being six in nine) and expect your job to be safe. Maybe John isn't a local who remembers Ruff as a Sabre. Maybe he can be objective about the situation. Didn't read the article, but if you are going to give Ruff flack for nearly missing the playoffs one year, I would not be surprised to see people rally round him because he missed the playoffs by 6 points or less in 4 of those 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blugold43 Posted April 17, 2009 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I actually liked Bucky's article regarding Ruff. I know, I like a Bucky article (a cardinal sin here). not in my book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BamBam Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Bucky Said it best... Ruff has been given the tools to build a garage and been asked to construct an oceanfront estate. Thats the cold hard truth. The team doesn't deserve Ruff. TG, LQ, and DR don't deserve Ruff as their coach. If fired, he'd have another job 1 day later. Then tell me who does our Front Office bring in.... James Patrick? Brian McCutcheon? Randy Cunnyworth? You know they don't think outside of the box, so don't expect them to make a splash in the coaching department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom webster Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Sometimes you guys really disappoint me. It was a "devil's advocate piece." Each writer took the opposite view and made their case. I thought both writers made good points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I have no problem with Ruff being shown the door as long as Regier goes too. I don't want to hear this team doesn't have enough talent to be in the top 16 teams in the NHL. I don't like the job Regier has done with the makeup of the team, but they should have been good enough to make the playoffs the last two years. They didn't and therefore IMO Regier and Ruff should both go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realist Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I don't want Ruff to go, I think the problem is higher than that, but you can't tell me you'd be shocked if he was let go. Not many teams keep a coach around that can't get his team to the playoffs consistently. The problem is Quinn, I can guarantee he's not going anywhere. One of four things will happen: 1. Ruff is shown the door 2. Regier is axed 3. Both Ruff and Regier are canned 4. Nothing happens and everything is blamed on injuries I see number four as most likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eleven Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I take it as more of an analysis than anything else. I don't think he's calling for Ruff to be fired. He's just making the case, which seems obvious. You can't miss the playoffs five times in seven seasons (and within a whisker of his mustache of being six in nine) and expect your job to be safe. Maybe John isn't a local who remembers Ruff as a Sabre. Maybe he can be objective about the situation. I love the "five times in seven seasons" trope that has sprung up on this site and in this community (this is generally, and not at you, PA). We should remember that the team was in bankruptcy during those seven years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VansTheMans Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Sometimes you guys really disappoint me. It was a "devil's advocate piece." Each writer took the opposite view and made their case. I thought both writers made good points. That's what I figured. Vogl presented the numerical evidence that makes it appear Ruff should get the axe, while Bucky went in deeper and looked beyond the numbers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I love the "five times in seven seasons" trope that has sprung up on this site and in this community (this is generally, and not at you, PA). We should remember that the team was in bankruptcy during those seven years. So we're looking at 2 of 4 instead. Still pretty crappy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carpandean Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I liked the idea that was thrown out by, I believe, Paul Hamilton: replace Darcy, preferably with a GM that has some history of turning teams around (like Burke, but obviously not Burke), give him a budget to work with and all decision rights for players and coaches. If he chooses to keep Ruff, then Lindy stays; otherwise, he goes. The keys to this are (1) choosing the right GM, not a puppet; and (2) after setting the budget Larry is "hands off" on personnel decisions, instead focusing on the parts that he's good at (e.g., promoting Buffalo and the Sabres with things like the Winter Classic, World Juniors, etc.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I love the "five times in seven seasons" trope that has sprung up on this site and in this community (this is generally, and not at you, PA). We should remember that the team was in bankruptcy during those seven years. I don't want to hear the bankruptcy excuse. They missed the playoffs by 5, 6 and 11 points in the 3 years preceding the lockout. It's not like they were the worst team in the NHL each of those seasons because the roster was gutted. Just 3 more seasons where a little more effort and a few more wins would have got them in the playoffs. I fully understand Quinn is part of the problem band we all know he is not going anywhere, but that doesn't mean replacing Regier and Ruff wouldn't improve things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RayFinkle Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I love Ruff and think he should remain as the Sabres coach. But to say he has never been given the tools to win the cup is just plain false. He has had more than a few stacked teams that were capable of winning the cup, but just couldn't get over the hump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 So we're looking at 2 of 4 instead. Still pretty crappy. I'm not sure where these numbers are coming from. The Sabres weren't in bankruptcy for three seasons before the lockout! I continue to be astounded at how many excuses people will make for Ruff, whom they consider an elite coach. Bankruptcy is a new twist. Memo to Ruff's supporters: when you say Ruff could win a Cup if only he had the players, you are slapping him in the face. A lot of guys could coach a stacked team to the Cup, and have done so in the past. A coach becomes elite when he gets by all the obstacles -- bankrupty, ownership changes, injuries, the inevitable loss of top players, rule and style changes in the game, systems that aren't working and so on -- and still wins. The indisputable fact remains that in a league where slightly more than half the teams make the playoffs, Ruff has not done that, let alone win a Cup, five times in seven years. Unless he is truly elite -- and I still want to be educated as to why he is -- he should be on thin ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I'm not sure where these numbers are coming from. The Sabres weren't in bankruptcy for three seasons before the lockout! I continue to be astounded at how many excuses people will make for Ruff, whom they consider an elite coach. Bankruptcy is a new twist. Memo to Ruff's supporters: when you say Ruff could win a Cup if only he had the players, you are slapping him in the face. A lot of guys could coach a stacked team to the Cup, and have done so in the past. A coach becomes elite when he gets by all the obstacles -- bankrupty, ownership changes, injuries, the inevitable loss of top players, rule and style changes in the game, systems that aren't working and so on -- and still wins. The indisputable fact remains that in a league where slightly more than half the teams make the playoffs, Ruff has not done that, let alone win a Cup, five times in seven years. Unless he is truly elite -- and I still want to be educated as to why he is -- he should be on thin ice. From my perspective.....just like any player, when you get rid of someone, you need to upgrade. Quineville replacing Savard in Chicago was a major upgrade. Hitchcock replacing 6 guys in Columbus was a major upgrade. Maurice replacing Laviolette in Carolina was a minor upgrade. Melrose replacing Torteralla in Tampa was a major downgrade. Actually Murray replacing Muckler in Ottawa (as GM) has been a disaster. Now Ruff has some responsibility for missing the playoffs. But in my opinion.... You have to finish this sentence.... __________ replacing Ruff in Buffalo is a major upgrade. I think that's a tough one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Now Ruff has some responsibility for missing the playoffs. But in my opinion....You have to finish this sentence.... __________ replacing Ruff in Buffalo is a major upgrade. I think that's a tough one. Was Mike Babcock considered an upgrade as a coach when he was hired by Detroit? What about Todd McLellan over Ron Wilson in SJ? If the Sabres don't hire a proven head coach does that mean it wont be an upgrade? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Was Mike Babcock considered an upgrade as a coach when he was hired by Detroit? What about over Ron Wilson in SJ? If the Sabres don't hire a proven head coach does that mean it wont be an upgrade? I see your point, but I think Babcock was, and Mclellan wasn't. (I think Babcock was a major upgrade. He nearly stole a cup with a very mediocre Ducks team). Do I think Lindy is a better coach than any potential rookie coach? Absolutely. I'm trying to think if a rookie coach has won a cup in my lifetime. No names come to mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 I see your point, but I think Babcock was, and Mclellan wasn't. (I think Babcock was a major upgrade. He nearly stole a cup with a very mediocre Ducks team). Do I think Lindy is a better coach than any potential rookie coach? Absolutely. I'm trying to think if a rookie coach has won a cup in my lifetime. No names come to mind. You're younger than I expected. ;) The heavily rookie laden '86 squad from Mo-ray-all wasn't just lead by a rookie goalie. Jean Perron was in his 1st year. The Habs also did it in '69 w/ Claude Ruel and in '71 w/ Al MacNeil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VansTheMans Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 Here's a question: If Larry Quinn took a more hands off approach, and let Darcy freely go about, do you think it would be worth keeping Darcy around? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PASabreFan Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 From my perspective.....just like any player, when you get rid of someone, you need to upgrade. Quineville replacing Savard in Chicago was a major upgrade. Hitchcock replacing 6 guys in Columbus was a major upgrade. Maurice replacing Laviolette in Carolina was a minor upgrade. Melrose replacing Torteralla in Tampa was a major downgrade. Actually Murray replacing Muckler in Ottawa (as GM) has been a disaster. Now Ruff has some responsibility for missing the playoffs. But in my opinion.... You have to finish this sentence.... __________ replacing Ruff in Buffalo is a major upgrade. I think that's a tough one. LB has it right. It's a crap shoot. Lindy as a rookie coach took the Sabres to the ECF. And the finals in his second year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
X. Benedict Posted April 17, 2009 Report Share Posted April 17, 2009 You're younger than I expected. ;) The heavily rookie laden '86 squad from Mo-ray-all wasn't just lead by a rookie goalie. was in his 1st year. The Habs also did it in '69 w/ Claude Ruel and in '71 w/ Al MacNeil. :lol: Not that young :) Well done. I remember that team almost as well as I remember Paul Cyr hitting slappers from the blue line 30 rows up on breakaways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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