pi2000

I don't know, if you're Vegas I'd be asking for a lot more than just a pick for not taking Silfverberg or Manson. There's also the possibility that some 3rd party team joins the fray and incentivizes Vegas to take Manson and trade them Manson for some package of picks/players/etc... Take BUF for example, Kane is a Vegas guy. We give them Kane and a pick or something in exchange for them picking and trading Manson. That's allowed and will probably happen, not necessarily with BUF, but with other suitors.

Or he goes on a tear next season, potting 40 geno's by the deadline... you could cash him in for way more, or keep him for a playoff run and try to sign him mid-season or something something blah blah... i'm tired of Kane talk.

What about Kane for Kovalchuk and a 2nd rnd pick? Great trade? or Greatest trade?

If they come to an agreement with Kulikov, but don't officially sign him, they could pick somebody else in the draft, but they wouldn't be able to announce the Kuli signing until after FA opens on July 1st... and which point Kuli might get a better offer and pull out of Vegas. Yeah, Bieksa everything up with his NMC. If they protect Bieksa, Fowler, Lindholm, Vatanen, that exposes Manson, Cogliano and Silfverberg (and Corey Tropp, hahaha). LIke you said, they probably do something with Bieksa (he's supposed to play on my adult team this summer, ha). Which would allow them to protect Manson, but still would lose Silfverberg. If I'm Vegas I'd be all over Silfverberg.

Montour, Theodore, and Manson won't be RFAs until after next season. They simply can't protected all of them in the expansion draft, and certainly won't be able to resign all of them next offseason when they're already giving $14m to Fowler, Vatanen, and Lindholm.

I don't think the LIndholm and Vatanen situation will impact their decision making... those guys (and Fowler) are staying put as far as I've been told. Theodore, Manson, Montour are in play but they don't plan on losing more than one from that group.

Yeah, if he slips, I don't think he gets any further than 5th or 6th. If he's there at 8, I might try to trade out of that spot to somebody desperate for a center.

If Patrick slips to 8, do you bite?

I heard this from a friend that works in the Ducks organization. I'm not sure how he knows this, but anyway, it's what it is. But yeah, it doesn't really mean anything unless Kulikov is also interested... which is an uknown. Personally, I think it would be a good fit and place for him to regain his footing possibly.

Kane... fo sho

I have a source that says Vegas will attempt to sign Dmitri Kulikov during the FA negotiation window before the draft.... he would then become their pick from BUF.

we need something to talk about

fixtures? how's that?

Moulson had a worse +/- that ROR. What's your point? OK. Let's see those stats you speak of for Jake Muzzin 2016-17.

If your team has a positive goal differential, but one or two players are in the minus teens or worse, you don't think that means anything? Or vice-versa, where the team is -40 goal differential, but a few players are positive +/-... you don't think that reflects well on their play? The stat on it's own doesn't mean much, but when taking team goal differential into context it starts to shed some light on who your better players are.

Ladd is not valid comparison. BUF hasn't sniffed the playoffs in years... now is not the time to trade away talent because you're afraid they won't fit under your cap 5 years down the road. BUF is not yet in a position where they need to make these types of decisions on players. In CHI's case, Ladd was the odd man out. In BUFs case, they could easily afford to sign Kane to an extension.

I've said it many times, +/- is a useful stat when looking for outliers. In Muzzin's case, his +/- is comparitively much worse than the rest of his teammates (and -4 team goal differential) that it's a reflection of his poor play, not anybody else on the ice that he's either playing with or defending against. Kane, on the other hand, has a +/- that's somewhat more in line with what you would expect from an individual on team with a -36 goal differential. I'm not sure.... his first years with the Kings he was extremely confident, made crisp passes, was agressive, physical. You expect there to be ups and down throughout the season, but this year was just one big downer... lacked confidence, very very poor decision making, turnovers in his own end, poor positional play, no physicality. It was like two different players.... I don't know what the reason for it was. Can he fix it next season? I don't know him personally, so I can't say if he's willing to do the little things to get back to his game, or if he's simply content with raking in his $4m/yr salary for the next two seasons. Either way, if he's the guy JBOT is targeting, then he better be damn sure he's getting the Jake Muzzin of 13-16, not last years' version.

Muzzin's plus/minus dropped a net -30 from the previous season to a -21, on a team with a -4 goal differential. That's a -17 Pi/Minus®. He's a top 3 defender who should be sound defensively,but when you log a -21 on a team with just a -4 goal differential, you're an outlier for the wrong reason. Kane on the other hand was a -17 on a team with a -36 goal differential. That's a +19 Pi/Minus®. Risto improved his defensive game over that time span, which is what you want from your young players. Muzzin took a nosedive, he was bad last year... now, was that an expection? or is he just not that good and it's finally catching up to him. http://www.ocregister.com/2017/02/20/kings-struggling-jake-muzzin-trying-to-get-back-to-basics/

I live in the LA area, my kid is a huge Kings fan, I watch plenty of their games. Muzzin was terrible last season, no matter how you slice it... and he'd be the first to admit he struggled mightily. That's a major concern if you're entertaining thoughts of acquiring him via trade.

Kane is fast, aggressive and can score. That's a player that fits in any scheme. It's not standard stuff when you're trying to build a playoff contender. Keep your best players. It signals a rebuild because we don't have a guy on the roster who can fill in for Kane's offensive output. It's a step backwards in the goal scoring department... and then trade away your starting goalie with nobody in place to take his spot? How is that not taking a step back?

Buyer beware... Muzzin was one of the reasons the Kings failed to make the playoffs this eason... he was a -21, and put up only 28 points... vs 40 points and a +7 the previous season. He also was fined by the NHL for embellishment. That's not what you want for $4mil/yr... let alone trade away your top scoring winger.

exactly

But I thought J-BOT was a cap wizard! The Sabres have $38m in space after next season, and only $24m committed in 2019-20. That's a ton of room to maneuver... signing Kane to a $5.5-6m/yr isn't going to put this team in cap jail... even with Eichel getting paid. I'd make an effort to trade Reinhart before I'd look to move Kane.

I, for one, hope they keep him. He's fast, big, a relentless forechecker and can score. How does that not fit in the "long term vision" of any team? He'd leave a huge void.

If Lehner and Kane go, I'll be disappointed because that signals another rebuild. I'd keep them and try to launch guys like Girgensons, Foligno, Larsson, Bogo, for whatever I can get. Replace them internally or with UFA's like Matt Cullen, Kunitz, etc... guys J-BOT is familiar with who are still servicable and would actually provide an upgrade (IMO) for a year or two while guys like Bailey, Baptiste, etc.. develop in Roch. It's true that Lehner probably isn't very well like in the locker room, but winning changes that immediately.