nfreeman Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 The Sabres have gone WAY overboard with retiring numbers, to the point of making the honor nearly meaningless. If Danny Gare, why not Don Luce, Craig Ramsay, Mike Ramsey, Larry Playfair, heck -- Miro Satan. Where does it end? Horton and Perreault. The rest are team HOF players. Hasek is tricky. In an ideal world, he'd be almost a slam dunk to have his number retired, but with the tremendous animosity against the guy, which probably won't subside much even with the passage of time, wouldn't such a ceremony be a disaster for all involved? Would Dom even agree to do it? Whose numbers are retired? To my knowledge the list is: 2 -- Horton 7 -- Rico 11 -- Bert 14 -- Robert 16 -- LaFontaine 18 -- Gare Anyone else? Of the above list, Gare is the only questionable selection, although I suppose one could argue that Robert is borderline too. I'm certainly OK with retiring the entire french connection. As for Gare, he was a team captain and multiple-occasion 50-goal scorer who played with an unbelievable fire in the belly -- throw a guy like him onto our roster right now and we wouldn't be having so much angst about not playing with enough passion. So I'm OK with retiring #18. I'd probably leave Laffy off the list since he only played the equivalent of 3 seasons here. However, he was a great player and a great guy and everybody loved him, so it's not a big deal. I'd also be OK with retiring #10 for Craig Ramsay and #6 for Jim Schoenfeld. I think I would draw the line after that though -- Mike Ramsey was a great defenseman but not quite the transcendent, memorable type of player that I think one should be to get one's number retired. As for Dominik, as I said above I think #39 should absolutely be retired. He was an amazing player, a charitable person, and the way he left doesn't bother me as much as it bothers some others. I would wait for about 3-4 years after he retires for good. Time tends to make people appreciate the good and forgive the bad. I'd guess he would come to the ceremony. For a Sabres hall of fame, I'd include: Roger Crozier Jerry Korab Don Luce Mike Ramsey Rick Dudley Bill Hajt Mike Robitaille Don Edwards Bob Sauve Tom Barrasso Phil Housley Mike Foligno Alexander Mogilny Dale Hawerchuk Mike Peca Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 Whose numbers are retired? To my knowledge the list is: 2 -- Horton 7 -- Rico 11 -- Bert 14 -- Robert 16 -- LaFontaine 18 -- Gare Anyone else? Of the above list, Gare is the only questionable selection, although I suppose one could argue that Robert is borderline too. I'm certainly OK with retiring the entire french connection. As for Gare, he was a team captain and multiple-occasion 50-goal scorer who played with an unbelievable fire in the belly -- throw a guy like him onto our roster right now and we wouldn't be having so much angst about not playing with enough passion. So I'm OK with retiring #18. I'd probably leave Laffy off the list since he only played the equivalent of 3 seasons here. However, he was a great player and a great guy and everybody loved him, so it's not a big deal. I'd also be OK with retiring #10 for Craig Ramsay and #6 for Jim Schoenfeld. I think I would draw the line after that though -- Mike Ramsey was a great defenseman but not quite the transcendent, memorable type of player that I think one should be to get one's number retired. As for Dominik, as I said above I think #39 should absolutely be retired. He was an amazing player, a charitable person, and the way he left doesn't bother me as much as it bothers some others. I would wait for about 3-4 years after he retires for good. Time tends to make people appreciate the good and forgive the bad. I'd guess he would come to the ceremony. For a Sabres hall of fame, I'd include: Roger Crozier Jerry Korab Don Luce Mike Ramsey Rick Dudley Bill Hajt Mike Robitaille Don Edwards Bob Sauve Tom Barrasso Phil Housley Mike Foligno Alexander Mogilny Dale Hawerchuk Mike Peca Sorry, I don't have time to find the complete list and I know the full list is somewhere in an archived thread, but the list of Sabres HoF members as of when the team moved to the Mmarena was: Perreault, Martin, Robert, Imlach, Hunt, Christie, Horton, Crozier, Luce, Ramsay, Forman, Darling, Gare, Schoenfeld, and Swados. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 Sorry, I don't have time to find the complete list and I know the full list is somewhere in an archived thread, but the list of Sabres HoF members as of when the team moved to the Mmarena was: Perreault, Martin, Robert, Imlach, Hunt, Christie, Horton, Crozier, Luce, Ramsay, Forman, Darling, Gare, Schoenfeld, and Swados. I hadn't seen this before, but TSN has a story up right now saying that Phil Housley will be inducted on wednesday. Had this been mentioned at any point earlier in the season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TM8-PL16 Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 if Hasek doesn't deserve it... someone needs to explain why Horton does. he played for us for two years at the end of his career (even if he hadn't died I mean)... I don't mean any disrespect to the guy... but he played two years for the Rangers, I don't see his number at the Garden... not like the two years he was here he put up record numbers or led us to the Cup... I respect the guy, but if you are going to have an argument about who really belongs and who doesn't, someone needed to ask this question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LabattBlue Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 if Hasek doesn't deserve it... someone needs to explain why Horton does. he played for us for two years at the end of his career (even if he hadn't died I mean)... I don't mean any disrespect to the guy... but he played two years for the Rangers, I don't see his number at the Garden... not like the two years he was here he put up record numbers or led us to the Cup... I respect the guy, but if you are going to have an argument about who really belongs and who doesn't, someone needed to ask this question. First of all, I am all in favor of Hasek's number being retired(once he does that is). On Horton, I think it is as simple as honoring a player who died a tragic death while he was a part of the organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IKnowPhysics Posted February 6, 2007 Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 Has the whole world gone crazy? There's no discussion here. Dominik Hasek's number will absolutely be retired. He was the world's best goaltender during his Buffalo years. As a Sabre, he won the Vezina Trophy SIX freakin' times (second only to Plante), the Hart Memorial Trophy TWICE (no other Sabre has won it, and only two other goalies have won it), the Lester B. Pearson TWICE (no other Sabre has won it), and the William Jennings Trophy TWICE. He won the Olympic Gold Medal in Nagano in '98 during his Sabres tenure. In the community, he made very generous charitable donations and founded Hasek's Heroes. He also enabled the team to do something they hadn't done since 1975- reach the Stanley Cup Finals. Did he feud with Ted Nolan? Yes. But seriously, put things in perspective. His jersey will hang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodfella25 Posted February 6, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2007 First of all, I am all in favor of Hasek's number being retired(once he does that is). On Horton, I think it is as simple as honoring a player who died a tragic death while he was a part of the organization. I don't know much about Horton, that was a bit before my time, but just curious why he's retired. Is it out of respect because of his passing? Also, anyone know if the Atlanta Thrashers retired Dan Snyder's #37 after his death? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taro T Posted February 7, 2007 Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 I don't know much about Horton, that was a bit before my time, but just curious why he's retired. Is it out of respect because of his passing? Also, anyone know if the Atlanta Thrashers retired Dan Snyder's #37 after his death? Horton is retired because he was a veteran leader on a very young team and died a very tragic death while he was still on the team. If he plays 1-2 more years and then retires, he probably makes the Sabres HoF. But there is NO WAY the Sabres would have retired his number under those circumstances. I would put him very much in the Roger Crozier category of former Sabres but for the circumstances of how he left the team. I would never un-retire his number and can see a case for it to be retired but probably wouldn't have done it myself. I also don't have a problem with him having a retired number whereas I don't think Robert or Gare should have been retired (even though Gare is one of my all time favorite Sabres). And I don't think Martin quite deserves it either. No data on Snyder's #, but I'd be very surprised if any Thresher ever wears it again whether they retire it or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted February 7, 2007 Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 I would never un-retire his number and can see a case for it to be retired but probably wouldn't have done it myself. I also don't have a problem with him having a retired number whereas I don't think Robert or Gare should have been retired (even though Gare is one of my all time favorite Sabres). And I don't think Martin quite deserves it either. I really wish the Sabres would have done something similar to what the Leafs do - "honor" player numbers for the really good but not legendary players, and retire numbers for the great ones. Or maybe borrow from the Bills and do a Wall-type honoring, or stick the HoF for some but reserve the retired numbers for those special players. Also saw something strange when I was looking online: Some teams (especially after franchise shifts) have revoked or suspended retired numbers. The Carolina Hurricanes revoked the retirement of numbers #2 (Rick Ley), #9 (Gordie Howe) and #19 (John McKenzie) which were retired by its previous Hartford Whalers incarnation, although Carolina has not issued #9 so far. By contrast, Dallas, Phoenix and Colorado all honor numbers retired in their original cities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shrader Posted February 7, 2007 Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 There's 98 numbers for give or take, a 30 player roster. Retiring a few is no big deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apuszczalowski Posted February 7, 2007 Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 There's 98 numbers for give or take, a 30 player roster. Retiring a few is no big deal. exactly as for the Snyder comment comparing his situation to Horton, Horton was a more established player that died in a tragic death. Snyder was a relatively unknown player who died in a tragic death. If Heatley was the one that died, Atlanta would retire his number, but Snyder wasn't a name player so retiring the number won't happen Calgary just retired Mike Vernons number tonight, if he gets his number retired, Hasek deserves a statue infront of the arena Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goodfella25 Posted February 7, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2007 There's 98 numbers for give or take, a 30 player roster. Retiring a few is no big deal. Yep, but you gotta wonder in like the year 3,000 (if, by some miracle, there is still a world) some team is probably going to have to move into the triple digits. Just food for thought :blink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drnkirishone Posted February 8, 2007 Report Share Posted February 8, 2007 Maybe I am mistaken but wasn't Hasek's Hero's started cause of a DUI that Hasek got and he was court ordered to do community service? But as for Hasek he was a unlikeable egomanic that I truly believe not a single teammate has liked since back before the 2000 season and that is including the red wings and the sens players. But you can not argue with what he accomplished in a Sabres jersey on the ice. He was the most dominate player when here (and in net) and should get his jersey retired or into a sabres hall of fame for thous accomplishments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bmwolf21 Posted February 8, 2007 Report Share Posted February 8, 2007 There's 98 numbers for give or take, a 30 player roster. Retiring a few is no big deal. I don't have a problem with retiring as many numbers as we have great players, but I just think it should be reserved for the legendary-type players, the very best of the best. The Sabres HoF should be enough for the "pretty good for a short period" or the guys who were very good for a long career, or great ambassadors for the team and city, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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