Byram has packed up his house and will be moved: After the Whistle

[JohnC]

46 minutes ago, Weave said:

Byram played a better game last season, and displayed much more dynamic play.  Right now, betting on potential upside is hope.  Hope isn’t a plan.

Disregarding potential when making player decisions is foolish. Acting out of frustration is a way to become even more frustrated. If you want Power to be more effective, then find him a more suitable partner. 

[LGR4GM]

10 minutes ago, JohnC said:

Disregarding potential when making player decisions is foolish. Acting out of frustration is a way to become even more frustrated. If you want Power to be more effective, then find him a more suitable partner. 

How many more years are you willing to give him? 1? 2? 5? 

[JohnC]

20 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

How many more years are you willing to give him? 1? 2? 5? 

One to two. And considering his inexperience his play has been reasonable. I’m not declaring him an all-star but I’m baffled at the negativity directed toward him. 

[LGR4GM]

9 minutes ago, JohnC said:

One to two. And considering his inexperience his play has been reasonable. I’m not declaring him an all-star but I’m baffled at the negativity directed toward him. 

This was always what would happen. He was never gonna be pronger and this board was going to turn on him. He hastened that with an abysmal year under Ruff and Wilford. 

[OverPowerYou]

Where does Byram win the Stanley cup next year ? 

Edited 16 hours ago by OverPowerYou

[JohnC]

1 hour ago, GASabresIUFAN said:

Wasn’t this Byram situation entirely predictable?

He was a redundant asset when acquired.  Adams had already given huge contracts to Dahlin (deserved) and Power (undeserved).  Regardless of performance, the Sabres weren’t going to be able to afford a 3rd huge contract on D. We were never going to invest 1/3 of the cap on 3 D, all LH offensive D, 2 of which can’t actually play defense.  

Adams even admitted the other day that they didn’t know what to do with Byram when they acquired him.  Shocking!  

So now here we are 1 and 1/4 seasons since acquired and guess what, we are planning to trade Byram.  He must be so happy to going elsewhere.  

I guess the good news is that this will open a roster spot for a defenseman who can actually play defense.  Now whether Adams can execute and acquire such a player remains to be seen. 

 

The Byram acquisition is a perfect illustration of our GM's ineptitude when it comes to roster construction. (As you clearly note.) It's hard to move forward and build on what you have done when you constantly have to undo and redo and then again undo what you have done. While other teams move forward, you do the outdated cha cha dance and stand in place. 

If this shallow GM would have systematically addressed areas of need, then this team would be more complete instead of having an incomplete roster that is made up of redundant and missing pieces. In a cap system, you can't afford to misspend your cap allowance, especially when you don't spend up to the cap max. 

[JohnC]

8 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

This was always what would happen. He was never gonna be pronger and this board was going to turn on him. He hastened that with an abysmal year under Ruff and Wilford. 

You make a keen observation that much of the jaundiced view of him can be attributed to the wrong expectation of him. The problem isn't the player as much as it is the excessive expectation and assessment of him. I'm confident he is going to be a good player. And for many that is not good enough. 

[JohnC]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

I know you are (and I said ages ago one of Power or Byram should be traded as we have enough offensive D men with 2 we don't need 3) so if you think Power has the greater ceiling you keep him. Adams paid him so that doubles down on it for him to stand by his decision. The issue is why trade for Byram at all? It's clearly a plan to avoid paying people. 

I'm throwing the 15 years out there because I can no longer treat this team as a normal team. I can't discuss in good faith how next year it'll be better or this time we draft the right guy or Adams will finally make good deals and all the normal stuff with sports. It's clear the franchise isn't normal They are seriously broken and there is no fix in sight. There is no faith and there is no room for belief. Believing in this team running it back and it somehow working would be an indicator that you should seek therapy and/or medication because you are clearly insane if you do that. I will not be fooled again. 

I mean look at this pathetic franchise. Posted up top from sabres.com, season in review Josh Norris. What f'n season? Just ridiculous. 

You ask a good question as to why was Byram traded for? The reason is not too difficult to understand. Our GM is a shallow operative who looks to add pieces whether they fit or not. From his perch, he should be making decisions based on constructing a well-balanced roster. It's apparent for all to see that he is ill-equipped to handle that essential aspect of his job. 

It's not a challenge to find the primary cause as to why this franchise has been so dismal for so long. When your owner is a hockey dope, you don't stand a chance.

Drink up and don't drive. 

[LGR4GM]

11 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You make a keen observation that much of the jaundiced view of him can be attributed to the wrong expectation of him. The problem isn't the player as much as it is the excessive expectation and assessment of him. I'm confident he is going to be a good player. And for many that is not good enough. 

No the player was a problem last season. He wasn't good. 

[JohnC]

6 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

No the player was a problem last season. He wasn't good. 

A lot of players had problems last year. No question, that his play was inconsistent. Young players, especially defensemen, are not instantly good. It takes time. If you consider dealing him away as a solution to his at times substandard play, then I'm not on board. My recommendation is to find a better partner for him. Tage wasn't instantly good when first acquired. Now he is a goal scoring dynamo. Follow that more patient model and you will be rewarded. I'm confident of that although many here are not. 

[Weave]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Disregarding potential when making player decisions is foolish. Acting out of frustration is a way to become even more frustrated. If you want Power to be more effective, then find him a more suitable partner. 

Byram is young and also has further potential.  And his game is currently stronger than Power’s.  Frankly, I think it comes down more to style of play than ceiling as I think their ceilings aren’t terribly different. I also think there is more risk in Power’s ceiling simply because he is further from it.  I like Byrams game better.  Why not find him the more suitable partner instead?

 

Regardless, whoever is kept needs to be properly supported, or we are missing the playoffs for a 15th straight season.

[Drag0nDan]

14 minutes ago, JohnC said:

The Byram acquisition is a perfect illustration of our GM's ineptitude when it comes to roster construction. (As you clearly note.) It's hard to move forward and build on what you have done when you constantly have to undo and redo and then again undo what you have done. While other teams move forward, you do the outdated cha cha dance and stand in place. 

If this shallow GM would have systematically addressed areas of need, then this team would be more complete instead of having an incomplete roster that is made up of redundant and missing pieces. In a cap system, you can't afford to misspend your cap allowance, especially when you don't spend up to the cap max. 

Flipped an asset for another who had an extra year prior to RFA.  Having seen what the Av's got for Mittelstadt 1 year later (Charlie Coyle) after he signed his extension, Adams was probably right to pull the trigger when he did.  

Mittelstadt was an RFA after the year, and while he's an alright middle six forward... He wasn't a good skater, or shooter, while his play between the blue lines was solid, as was his playmaking.  Essentially he was no longer an ascending player, and this is kinda who he is.  With cozens there it was looking like an expensive proposition for a center who probably never scores 20 goals in a season.  

Looks worse having moved cozens now, and with some question marks up the middle i feel like we'd probably like to have him back for 25-26.  However I do think McLeod settled in nicely to replace him as the 2/3C, and they still have Byram as at the very least a similar level asset to what they had or would have head in MIttelstadt.  There's lots to complain about with Adams from a roster construction standpoint, but I didn't hate this from an asset management perspective.  

[Drag0nDan]

Just now, Weave said:

Byram is young and also has further potential.  And his game is currently stronger than Power’s.  Frankly, I think it comes down more to style of play than ceiling as I think their ceilings aren’t terribly different. I also think there is more risk in Power’s ceiling simply because he is further from it.  I like Byrams game better.  Why not find him the more suitable partner instead?

 

Regardless, whoever is kept needs to be properly supported, or we are missing the playoffs for a 15th straight season.

I appreciate the aggressiveness in Byram's game vs. the relative passive control version you see with Powers.  If Power is staying, and is the guy - he needs to be more aggressive in both zones.  I don't think he'll ever develop a pronger level mean streak, but you have to move people in front of the net.  I don't think he'll ever score 20 goals, but he needs to shoot more often, and less tentatively.  Passive and in control is great, tentative is not.  

But in the same tone - Byrams aggressiveness can occaisionally border on recklessness - which leads to odd man rushes, turnovers, mistakes, etc.  Both need to find more of a balance in their games.  

Edited 16 hours ago by Drag0nDan

[Mango]

14 hours ago, jad1 said:

Not surprising.  Adams admitted that he didn't know where Byram fit in when he traded for him.  Kev has no plan to build a competitve roster aside from gathering shiny nickels.  

Almost everybody was saying that they didn't know where he fit when they traded for him.

The issue with Bryam was never that he wasn't a skilled defensemen. It's that the move, at the time, didn't make the team better. It was just the a different version of a the same player we already had.

[Mango]

12 hours ago, Taro T said:

Good point.

Thinking about it a bit.  Why would he (a guy who is an RFA this summer) already be packing his house up to move to a different city AT THIS POINT IN TIME.  The draft is still more than a month away and FA doesn't begin until July 1.  Personally can't believe that Adams will trade Byram at ALL costs especially if Byram is proclaiming he wants to be here (unlike a certain injured at the time C). 

Fully believe could be and to a large extent do expect he'll be traded.  But the timing of this "announcement" seems to be amiss and more for clickbait on the day they've said that Adams is staying put in his current role.

Totally just a guess, but maybe rent something smaller with the anticipation of a trade so he doesn't have to worry about moving so much in season.

 

[Jorcus]

My thoughts on Byram.

As far as the moving goes he was a player with 1 year left on a contract who now is waiting to find out where he will play next season. I doubt he owned wherever he was staying so if the lease is up you pack up and wait to find out where to go next. It still could be here but cost wise someone else has to go to keep him so he is probably the easiest player to deal.

As far as his play. I think he is developing into a great mobile defenseman. He is fast, he is a very good passer and he has a high level of compete in his game. He may not have as accurate a shot as Power but he does disguise his shot at times. Having played 246 NHL games he is coming into the peak of his development curve as a player. I am sure he wants the chance as the primary D man on a power play unit which he will not get here and will not even be the primary player on the second unit with Power around. No skater on this team had more ice time overall than Byram. I think overall the organization really likes him as does many other teams in the NHL.

As far as the trade to bring him here, I do think they wanted to move on from Mitts and much like a draft pick they took the best player available. At the end of the day if we have to move on from Byram I think we are going to do pretty well with the demand that is out there for him. I don't see how we keep Power and Byram because of the cost so it will come down to the deal we can get for one or the other. I would rather keep Byram but my guess is he will be traded.   

[triumph_communes]

The Byram trade was great. Mittelstadt is a bust. If we picked a guy with too much of an ego to skill ratio then trade him. Things to be mad about but this isn’t one 

[...]

45 minutes ago, JohnC said:

You make a keen observation that much of the jaundiced view of him can be attributed to the wrong expectation of him. The problem isn't the player as much as it is the excessive expectation and assessment of him. I'm confident he is going to be a good player. And for many that is not good enough. 

This is a heroic attempt at gaslighting. 😕 He was the first pick in his draft. He has a 7x$8.35 contract. And our expectations are too high?.

[Mango]

1 hour ago, JohnC said:

Disregarding potential when making player decisions is foolish. Acting out of frustration is a way to become even more frustrated. If you want Power to be more effective, then find him a more suitable partner. 

Really difficult to find him a more effective partner when he is a gigantic reason why we have the most expensive blue line in the NHL while also being wildly ineffective.

People keep saying "go find him a partner". The dude gets paid the kind of money that he should be making his partner look good.

His contract is hampering our ability to go find him the partner that people are clamoring for.

[Pimlach]

2 hours ago, JohnC said:

He’s going to get stronger as he gets older. Just as Tage filled out and got stronger, so will he. 

Other than height, the two players are totally different people.  

Tage did not just get older and naturally “fill out”, he actually worked out like a maniac.  He was seriously weight training for several years before he broke out as a player.   The 2019-20 season he was unfortunately injured in the season opener, but prior to that season he really put the work in.   His payoff finally came the year after Covid.  He is known to be very dedicated to his craft.   

Power is a more natural talent,  but he has a lot of work to do to become a top NHL defenseman.    Waiting to “fill out” is not the answer.  He needs to work a lot harder in the off season and play a more emotional and physical game.  He needs to get invested in winning.  Right now he is miles away from becoming even a top twenty-five defensemen in the NHL.  His game is not anywhere close to the promise of a 1OA.  That may be unfair, but it’s the reality of it.  He is a 1OA with a huge contract.  

Power is young but he is not inexperienced.  He was already played 242 games at 22 years old.  It is time for him to take a step up.  We can’t wait 4 more years to “fill out”.   Any player his age can get stronger in the off-season, and he really needs to do that.  The time is now, parts of his game simply have to improve, he is a liability on defense and he stinks on the PK.  

When Dahlin was hurt neither Power or Byram stepped up.   Everyone but Adams realized when that trade was made that there is not enough ice time or cap money to keep them both along with Dahlin.  

If we believe the rumor, it looks like Power is the choice for Adams.  Ok, now Power better prove himself worthy.  And Adams better get a good player back for Byram.  

This team is just so poorly managed.   
 

 

Edited 14 hours ago by Pimlach

[Pimlach]

57 minutes ago, triumph_communes said:

The Byram trade was great. Mittelstadt is a bust. If we picked a guy with too much of an ego to skill ratio then trade him. Things to be mad about but this isn’t one 

This has nothing to do with Byram's ego to skill ratio.   He wants to play a big role, and he wants to lead a PP.   I want a guy like that.    The problem the Sabres have right now is the money tied up on defense already due to the foolish contracts given to Muel and Power.   

This was talked about after the trade was made.  We traded our best two way center at the time (Mitts) for a rental.  One year after the trade it is clear we got the better player, but in typical Sabres fashion they can't or won't fit him in. 

[Pimlach]

@7+6=13

Please stop with your eyerolls.   You recently said you would ignore me but I am seeing more negative emoji's the past few days.  

When you do this it comes off as antagonistic and next will be the insults.  

If you disagree with my comments try instead to make a viable and compelling counterpoint.   If you do not have anything substantial to offer then go back to ignoring me.   

[Pimlach]

1 hour ago, Mango said:

Really difficult to find him a more effective partner when he is a gigantic reason why we have the most expensive blue line in the NHL while also being wildly ineffective.

People keep saying "go find him a partner". The dude gets paid the kind of money that he should be making his partner look good.

His contract is hampering our ability to go find him the partner that people are clamoring for.

Good point Mango, and according to Adams even Power said words to this effect in his exit interview.  So maybe the kid gets it and will dedicate the off season to getting better?   

As the cap dollars get spent the window to finding him a vet RHD is closing.  I still do think we can bring in a reasonable cost vet that can help him, the teams problem is that the better ones want to play on contending teams.   

I know the game has changed over time but do you remember when the Sabres drafted Schoenfeld?  They smartly brought in Tim Horton to play with him on day one. This helped to settle him down and teach him how to be a pro in the NHL.  

 

[LGR4GM]

4 minutes ago, Pimlach said:

Good point Mango, and according to Adams even Power said words to this effect in his exit interview.  So maybe the kid gets it and will dedicate the off season to getting better?   

As the cap dollars get spent the window to finding him a vet RHD is closing.  I still do think we can bring in a reasonable cost vet that can help him, the teams problem is that the better ones want to play on contending teams.   

I know the game has changed over time but do you remember when the Sabres drafted Schoenfeld?  They smartly brought in Tim Horton to play with him on day one. This helped to settle him down and teach him how to be a pro in the NHL.  

 

How? His knee is ***** up. 

[Pimlach]

50 minutes ago, LGR4GM said:

How? His knee is ***** up. 

Opps.  That is correct, he has an injury that does not require surgery but he has to recover and then get into game shape.  

This puts a big constraint in there.  

Edited 13 hours ago by Pimlach