Way too early opening night line-up

[GoPuckYourself]

24 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Let's see how Levi does in the playoffs.  If he dominates , there is no need for him to spend another year down there.  What vet could you bring in that would be better than Levi as a backup ?

Again I would say, it's not all about points.   There is something to effort, willingness to battle. Skinner just isn't it. It's more of an indictment of skinner than anything else ... I don't think he should be on the roster any longer 

I'm not sure a dominant playoffs makes up for how shaky he looked for most of the time  up here imo. Rolling it back for the 3rd time in a row is incredibly bad idea. Some names I know are available (could be re-signed) in Chris Driedger (SEA) 2.1 GAA/.917 save%, Cam Talbot (LAK) 2.48 GAA/.915 save%, Laurent Broissot (WPG) 2.1 GAA/.925 save%, Anthony Stolarz (FLA) 2.12 GAA/.922 save% compared to Devin levi's 3.10 GAA/.899 save%. Those guys I mentioned should not require more than a 1-2 year deal aside from maybe Driedger but even he most likely wont get a long term deal.

[Broken Ankles]

45 minutes ago, bunomatic said:

If KA rolls out essentially the same lineup with a couple new rookies thrown into the mix in place of a couple vets there is no hope in hell for this team to make the playoffs next season. They weren’t anywhere near good enough this season throw lipstick on a pig its still a pig. Sorry not sorry. Add to that a clueless coaching staff and well, its going to be a painful year.

If two of the “new faces” are Kulich and Savoie I may just save my time and skip 2024/25. 

1 hour ago, CallawaySabres said:

Tage, not even close to a number one center

Cozen’s not a number 2 center 

obviously they cannot push both of them down a line so find the best #2 center possible and trade any prospects to get cozens to 3rd line. Until then, nothing matters at all because they will never see the playoffs next year without making that happen.

Tage is a number 1.  Maybe not top 10, but top 30 in an injury riddled year.  Cozens isn’t a number two, but he is paid like one and the Mitts trade guarantees the job is his next year and Kev isn’t seeking any blockers. I’ll agree partially, that some need to be moved down but they can still do it with Tage and Cozens.  Maybe Quinn and Brady T on the first line with Tage.  Push JJP and Tuch to the second.  Get a vet  to center #3 with Skinner and Greenway. 
 

 

[Crusader1969]

5 minutes ago, Broken Ankles said:

If two of the “new faces” are Kulich and Savoie I may just save my time and skip 2024/25. 

Tage is a number 1.  Maybe not top 10, but top 30 in an injury riddled year.  Cozens isn’t a number two, but he is paid like one and the Mitts trade guarantees the job is his next year and Kev isn’t seeking any blockers. I’ll agree partially, that some need to be moved down but they can still do it with Tage and Cozens.  Maybe Quinn and Brady T on the first line with Tage.  Push JJP and Tuch to the second.  Get a vet  to center #3 with Skinner and Greenway. 
 

 

Unfortunately, Brady T is a pipe dream. 
s
Why would you want Jeff Skinner in a bottom 6 role? He is the antithesis of a bottom 6 player

11 minutes ago, GoPuckYourself said:

I'm not sure a dominant playoffs makes up for how shaky he looked for most of the time  up here imo. Rolling it back for the 3rd time in a row is incredibly bad idea. Some names I know are available (could be re-signed) in Chris Driedger (SEA) 2.1 GAA/.917 save%, Cam Talbot (LAK) 2.48 GAA/.915 save%, Laurent Broissot (WPG) 2.1 GAA/.925 save%, Anthony Stolarz (FLA) 2.12 GAA/.922 save% compared to Devin levi's 3.10 GAA/.899 save%. Those guys I mentioned should not require more than a 1-2 year deal aside from maybe Driedger but even he most likely wont get a long term deal.

Thanks.  Like the response! 

[PerreaultForever]

47 minutes ago, Thorny said:

Have you counted all the times Benson fell over because he’s 16 years old and the opposing player merely took the puck? I’ve seen him get outmuscled a ton. The dude is not without faults 

I never harp on them because he’s a rookie and he’s been above expectations. That would be dumb. But if the comparison is a genuine nhl goal scorer in skinner we are getting out of hand. Skinner aids more in the pursuit of winning a game today than Benson 

I don't agree with this. I personally have thought, and continue to think, that removing Skinner is the only major move we need to make aside from getting a new coach. Yes, we could use some other key players, but removing Skinner matters more. Just ask Brind'Amour if you don't believe me. 

As for Benson, we over used him. He's a rookie. I see a ton of upside but he has a lot to learn. We couldn't send him to junior, that was pointless, but I think he should have only played about 2/3 of the games he did and he should have had less ice time and probably more one on one coaching. I'm hoping we get a better coach and in time Benson will become a stud. 

[Crusader1969]

14 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

I don't agree with this. I personally have thought, and continue to think, that removing Skinner is the only major move we need to make aside from getting a new coach. Yes, we could use some other key players, but removing Skinner matters more. Just ask Brind'Amour if you don't believe me. 

As for Benson, we over used him. He's a rookie. I see a ton of upside but he has a lot to learn. We couldn't send him to junior, that was pointless, but I think he should have only played about 2/3 of the games he did and he should have had less ice time and probably more one on one coaching. I'm hoping we get a better coach and in time Benson will become a stud. 

Yep, removing Skinner should be job 1 when it comes to roster construction.  

[Thorny]

8 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Yep, removing Skinner should be job 1 when it comes to roster construction.  

It’s kind of funny that after all these years “job 1” is still, apparently, moving our highest producers off the roster. The eternal cycle.

That’s roster deconstruction.

Still in development mode. Maybe we are. 

Edited April 9 by Thorny

[Crusader1969]

Just now, Thorny said:

It’s kind of funny that after all these years “job 1” is still, apparently, moving our highest producers off the roster. The eternal cycle.

If I had a spot for him on my top 6 , I would keep him. A perfectly fine top 6 player.  
as I said above -he is  the antithesis of what you want from a bottom 6 winger.  

[Thorny]

27 minutes ago, PerreaultForever said:

I don't agree with this. I personally have thought, and continue to think, that removing Skinner is the only major move we need to make aside from getting a new coach. Yes, we could use some other key players, but removing Skinner matters more. Just ask Brind'Amour if you don't believe me. 

As for Benson, we over used him. He's a rookie. I see a ton of upside but he has a lot to learn. We couldn't send him to junior, that was pointless, but I think he should have only played about 2/3 of the games he did and he should have had less ice time and probably more one on one coaching. I'm hoping we get a better coach and in time Benson will become a stud. 

Lol I’ll be sure to ask him next time we meet up for a beer 

it’s surprising to me that, being among the 2 or 3 most vocal posters in every game day thread about how disappointing this franchise is, that you are among the biggest proponents of the “run it back” strategy. Change the coach, and 1 fixes the output of 20.

Maybe.

Edited April 9 by Thorny

[Thorny]

4 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

If I had a spot for him on my top 6 , I would keep him. A perfectly fine top 6 player.  
as I said above -he is  the antithesis of what you want from a bottom 6 winger.  

I’m honestly not so set on hardcore line designations. A “third liner” doesn’t have to be in a specific mold. What makes Savoie a better fit in the top 12 than Skinner? 

You actually think a rookie Savoie will provide more for the team than Jeff Skinner? 

The dude was the toast of the town 12 months ago. He’s still 3rd in goals and the entire team has a down year and now we want to replace him with a child 

And then have the gall to scream “youngest team in da league!” When we miss. Come on now 

Edited April 9 by Thorny

[Crusader1969]

23 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I’m honestly not so set on hardcore line designations. A “third liner” doesn’t have to be in a specific mold. What makes Savoie a better fit in the top 12 than Skinner? 

You actually think a rookie Savoie will provide more for the team than Jeff Skinner? 

The dude was the toast of the town 12 months ago. He’s still 3rd in goals and the entire team has a down year and now we want to replace him with a child 

And then have the gall to scream “youngest team in da league!” When we miss. Come on now 

I saw a 18 year old Benson outplay him this year, I think a 21 year old Savoie would be able to do the same 

I would love to see Skinners production off of line 1 this year   I'll see if I can find it tomorrow    I'll admit I'm wrong if he's even half decent away from Thompson 

 

[Crusader1969]

43 minutes ago, Thorny said:

I’m honestly not so set on hardcore line designations. A “third liner” doesn’t have to be in a specific mold. What makes Savoie a better fit in the top 12 than Skinner? 

You actually think a rookie Savoie will provide more for the team than Jeff Skinner? 

The dude was the toast of the town 12 months ago. He’s still 3rd in goals and the entire team has a down year and now we want to replace him with a child 

And then have the gall to scream “youngest team in da league!” When we miss. Come on now 

Interesting that Skinner played approx 30% of his 5v5 time with Mitts  this season putting up  20 of his 33 even strength points during this time.  
 

seemed him and Mitts had good chemistry and may explain why skinners scoring has nose dived since around the time Mitts was traded 

[Crusader1969]

24 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

I saw a 18 year old Benson outplay him this year, I think a 21 year old Savoie would be able to do the same 

I would love to see Skinners production off of line 1 this year   I'll see if I can find it tomorrow    I'll admit I'm wrong if he's even half decent away from Thompson 

 

Last point is that Skinner plays LW 

my LW depth chart going into next season would be 

JJP
Benson
Greemway   

so Savoie really isn't taking his spot on line 3. - Greenway is 

Savoie is taking Olofssons spot 

[PerreaultForever]

3 hours ago, Thorny said:

It’s kind of funny that after all these years “job 1” is still, apparently, moving our highest producers off the roster. The eternal cycle.

That’s roster deconstruction.

Still in development mode. Maybe we are. 

No, this is different. Again, go ask Brind'Amour. Consider how Carolina got a lot better after ditching him. He "produced" for them too. 

It was the one thing Kreuger was right about. 

[Sabres Fan in NS]

There is no way that Skinner is the 13th forward.

He will be on line 1 or line 2.

30+ goal scorer is not any team's 13th forward.

[#freejame]

I have no idea why some of you are advocating once again starting the year with 4 players with fewer than 100 career games. It hasn’t worked and it won’t work.

[Drag0nDan]

Players I'd probably move, buy out, walk away from... Skinner, jokiharju, Krebs, Robinson, Jost, Comrie

JJP - Tage - Tuch

??? - ??? - Quinn - Need to trade for a real 2C - I assume its costly but someone like eriksson ek, or RNH who don't have NMCs.  Free agency is a possibility, as we likely have money/cap available.  Don't hate the idea of a pat kane buffalo thing on the wing, he's won cups, hes from buffalo, and we can probably pay him what he wants.    

Benson - Cozens - Savoie/Kulich/Rosen combo - Fewer minutes, more juice.  We always bring prospects up and bury them on a line with JAGs, and wonder why they dont/can't produce.  

??? - ??? - Greenway -- Bring in guys who actually are difficult to play against, instead of rolling in a rotation of JAGs who don't really do much of anything particularly well.  

 

Just going with the flow - I could see moving Ryan Johnson as a piece with a prospect to try and find an NHL righty for the top 4.

Power - Dahlin

Samuelsson - Byram

Johnson - Clifton

Bryson

 

UPL - Levi

If there's an available backup who you like, go for it - but most backups want term, or a chance to start.  You get neither here.  

[Broken Ankles]

7 hours ago, PerreaultForever said:

No, this is different. Again, go ask Brind'Amour. Consider how Carolina got a lot better after ditching him. He "produced" for them too. 

It was the one thing Kreuger was right about. 

Pretty sure Rod did not coach Jeff.  He started after they traded him.  Possible he said I don’t want a floater on my team after looking at tape, but the Hurricanes made a lot of moves in an attempt to play a different style of hockey.  Laying their failure at the feet of Skinny is a bit much.  The guy can be a net negative, but his skill set is top three and last year on a poor defensive team was a +15.  
 

@Crusader1969 In answer to your question, placing Skinner on the third line with defensively responsible players who can play a two way game could yield a lot better results than we have seen in years.  In terms of LW, I think Quinn has the highest potential with goal scoring and plays a better defensive game.  Similarly JJP is ascending so I plug him on FL2.  The third line does not have to be a no skill/checking line.  Better match ups and opportunities of possession for Skinner if facing an Islanders “identity line”.  Plus, unless the cost to extricate Jeff is low (2nd round) I would rather use picks and prospects to acquire talent and not to hope “addition by subtraction” works.  Skinner is not Diggs. 

[Night Train]

I hope moves are made. Initial projections above are another 80-90 point no playoff year. The commitment to mediocrity must end. 

[Crusader1969]

2 hours ago, Sabres Fan in NS said:

There is no way that Skinner is the 13th forward.

He will be on line 1 or line 2.

30+ goal scorer is not any team's 13th forward.

Why isn't he on line 1 or 2 during this important stretch of games? Who are you dropping JJP or Benson? 

[Crusader1969]

18 minutes ago, Broken Ankles said:

Pretty sure Rod did not coach Jeff.  He started after they traded him.  Possible he said I don’t want a floater on my team after looking at tape, but the Hurricanes made a lot of moves in an attempt to play a different style of hockey.  Laying their failure at the feet of Skinny is a bit much.  The guy can be a net negative, but his skill set is top three and last year on a poor defensive team was a +15.  
 

@Crusader1969 In answer to your question, placing Skinner on the third line with defensively responsible players who can play a two way game could yield a lot better results than we have seen in years.  In terms of LW, I think Quinn has the highest potential with goal scoring and plays a better defensive game.  Similarly JJP is ascending so I plug him on FL2.  The third line does not have to be a no skill/checking line.  Better match ups and opportunities of possession for Skinner if facing an Islanders “identity line”.  Plus, unless the cost to extricate Jeff is low (2nd round) I would rather use picks and prospects to acquire talent and not to hope “addition by subtraction” works.  Skinner is not Diggs. 

Brind'mour was an assistant coach with the Hurricanes for years before becoming the Head Coach. Just go back and read some of his qoutes about Jeff Skinner and you will see what @Perrualtforver is talking about. If you look what the Hurricanes did that off-season it was basically 2 moves - remove Skinner for nothing, trade Hanifan for Hamilton.   They then become one of the best teams in the league.  I think getting rid of Jeff Skinner was a huge part of their turnaround, along with getting a coach that wont allow players not to give their all shift in and shift out.

 

Im getting a pretty good sample size of Jeff Skinner on the 3rd line this season --- he gives you nothing at all.

[Thorny]

17 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Brind'mour was an assistant coach with the Hurricanes for years before becoming the Head Coach. Just go back and read some of his qoutes about Jeff Skinner and you will see what @Perrualtforver is talking about. If you look what the Hurricanes did that off-season it was basically 2 moves - remove Skinner for nothing, trade Hanifan for Hamilton.   They then become one of the best teams in the league.  I think getting rid of Jeff Skinner was a huge part of their turnaround, along with getting a coach that wont allow players not to give their all shift in and shift out.

 

Im getting a pretty good sample size of Jeff Skinner on the 3rd line this season --- he gives you nothing at all.

So if we had removed Jeff skinner last season, we’d have been better?

a top goal scorer in the league last year and you are claiming him to be a sizeable! net negative. To the tune of almost single handedly turning franchises around for the worse, which we know players in the nhl don’t do (nor for the better).

something doesn’t jive. He either provided a ton of positive value last year or didn’t. There was a magical barrier stopping us from seizing one final point cause Jeff Skinner was here?

none of it makes sense 

Edited April 9 by Thorny

[SabreFinn]

5 minutes ago, Crusader1969 said:

Brind'mour was an assistant coach with the Hurricanes for years before becoming the Head Coach. Just go back and read some of his qoutes about Jeff Skinner and you will see what @Perrualtforver is talking about. If you look what the Hurricanes did that off-season it was basically 2 moves - remove Skinner for nothing, trade Hanifan for Hamilton.   They then become one of the best teams in the league.  I think getting rid of Jeff Skinner was a huge part of their turnaround, along with getting a coach that wont allow players not to give their all shift in and shift out.

 

Im getting a pretty good sample size of Jeff Skinner on the 3rd line this season --- he gives you nothing at all.

So the answer to our problems are a Skinner buyout and getting a big RHD like Hamilton. Easy!!

[Jorcus]

10 hours ago, Crusader1969 said:

Interesting that Skinner played approx 30% of his 5v5 time with Mitts  this season putting up  20 of his 33 even strength points during this time.  
 

seemed him and Mitts had good chemistry and may explain why skinners scoring has nose dived since around the time Mitts was traded 

I agree with the premise that Skinner can only play with certain people. Not everyone can deal with his free lancing play. No matter what people may want I don't see him going anywhere right now. Three years left on that contract plus a no movement clause makes him ours for the time being. This team is not going to buy him out. It will just cost too much. I would not like to go into next year with JJP, Benson and Greenway as my top 3 left wingers. I need more scoring. Man wouldn't Jake Guentzel look great next to Thompson and Tuck? It would take a big number for that to happen.

[Crusader1969]

11 minutes ago, Thorny said:

So if we had removed Jeff skinner last season, we’d have been better? 

I know they weren't good enough with Skinner 

you don't have any concern with the oldest player on your team being one-dimensional and having his effort questioned?   

[Crusader1969]

6 minutes ago, SabreFinn said:

So the answer to our problems are a Skinner buyout and getting a big RHD like Hamilton. Easy!!

And get a coach