Rasmus_ Posted June 24, 2021 Report Share Posted June 24, 2021 (edited) 5 minutes ago, pi2000 said: They went through a similar scenario with Ryan O'Reilly.... they sold low because he wanted out (?) and they felt pressured to move him. I disagree with the bolded. How is it getting uglier? KA and Eichel have been dead silent in the media. That's a good sign IMO. If it was getting worse Eichel's camp would come right out and tell the media that he has no plans to return to Buffalo. That hasn't happened yet.... maybe it does if he's not moved by draft day? Time will tell. If Reinhart and Risto are traded, who cares what Eichel thinks? He can't trade himself and he's under contract for 5 more years. Nobody forced him to sign a 10 year deal, and he's getting paid handsomely. You think he'd be the first star player to disagree with a teammate getting traded? They get over it, they're professionals, it's part of the business. They sold low, because Botterill is an idiot. Anyone with half a brain would have seen that Berglund and Sobotka weren't quality. He was a worse gm at analyzing talent than Jim Benning is. Edited June 24, 2021 by TheCerebral1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted June 24, 2021 Report Share Posted June 24, 2021 (edited) 11 minutes ago, In The Buff said: I wouldnt think so either but i wouldnt have expected how this past season played out either. Jacks not getting the surgery he wants, does that mean the injury wont fully heal? His souring attitude &/or injury concerns aside, but IF he plays for us next year & it doesnt go well, it would absolutely hurt his value more than right now. If 1 season has hurt his value, going 2 seasons removed from being a "generational talent" would do nothing but hurt his value more. Tbh idk how anyone could disagree with that bolded. It'd be 2 seasons lol IMO there's a better than 80% chance he improves and has a much better season than last. I like those odds and if that means I wait one more year to move him so I can sell high, then I'd wait it out. And I'd be upfront with him about too.... "hey Jack... you want out? OK, get after it this season and we'll be happy to move you... because we can't get fair value currently due to your dislocated neck and bitch attitude" Edited June 24, 2021 by pi2000 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kas23 Posted June 24, 2021 Report Share Posted June 24, 2021 Just now, TheCerebral1 said: They sold low, because Botterill is an idiot. They sold low because Terry had 5 million reasons to do so. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 24, 2021 Report Share Posted June 24, 2021 1 hour ago, Buffalonill said: If Buffalo is getting Absolutely crap just keep him and let him play and try again next year . That'll work out well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 9 minutes ago, kas23 said: This is just asking to be placed into another Hall situation. What will likely happen is that Jack will give the team a small list of acceptable teams. We’ll have no clue which teams may be included and it’s likely Jack doesn’t know right now either. They will likely be teams that don’t really need Jack (they’ll be perennial playoff teams) and won’t be desperate. They’ll be smart about it (as the Boston’s and Tampa Bay’s are) and will lowball us knowing we are handcuffed. Supposedly, there were multiple teams Hall would’ve accepted. We still got peanuts. I dunno, I bet Vegas, a perennial playoff staple, would be pretty desperate to acquire a guy like Jack. Desperation can be found in lots of different scenarios 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 2 minutes ago, Doohickie said: Stay or go, I'll get over it. But I don't think it's a given that he gets traded this offseason. The reason is that if the trade turns into anything like the ROR deal, KA won't pull the trigger. If he gets traded the only question in my my mind is do the Sabres get better this year or next.... and that might not even be directly related to the trade. I just think Adams has a pretty good idea at the deadline what the general return was going to be and decided to go ahead. I guess it could be that interest softened, but I think the delays are more about maximizing the return than anything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, pi2000 said: IMO there's a better than 80% chance he improves and has a much better season than last. I like those odds and if that means I wait one more year to move him so I can sell high, then I'd wait it out. And I'd be upfront with him about too.... "hey Jack... you want out? OK, get after it this season and we'll be happy to move you... because we can't get fair value currently due to your dislocated neck and bitch attitude" Or, he could be a total beyotch about it, say his neck hurts, sit out and wait for his NMC to kick in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Just now, PromoTheRobot said: Or, he could be a total beyotch about it, say his neck hurts, sit out and wait for his NMC to kick in. He can't fake the injury, a scan will show if it's healed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 1 minute ago, PromoTheRobot said: Or, he could be a total beyotch about it, say his neck hurts, sit out and wait for his NMC to kick in. The fact he played through a ton of injuries just months ago, by choice, suggests he’d do otherwise Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Just now, pi2000 said: He can't fake the injury, a scan will show if it's healed. It involves nerves. It can look fine and he can say it hurts. Prove he's lying. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Just now, PromoTheRobot said: It involves nerves. It can look fine and he can say it hurts. Prove he's lying. Just because something hurts doesn't mean you can go on LTIR. The Sabres would likely suspend him instead of put him on LTIR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Thorny said: The fact he played through a ton of injuries just months ago, by choice, suggests he’d do otherwise Sure, this could happen again. But he might decide he's not risking further injury for a team he's blowing off. I don't know what Jack is thinking or how petty he wants to get. If things do get ugly do you want this hanging over the team? Adams has time for now. But wait too long and things can get messy. 3 minutes ago, pi2000 said: Just because something hurts doesn't mean you can go on LTIR. The Sabres would likely suspend him instead of put him on LTIR. And then what? Edited June 25, 2021 by PromoTheRobot 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 28 minutes ago, Thorny said: Id rather have Krebs and Tuch than 8 and Turcotte by quite a bit. The rest is totally interchangeable between the teams imo Those are the two big pieces. The rest is easy to make work it was a reasonable prospect and medium salary player Agree with the first sentence, however: I like Krebs more than Turcotte as well, but that's a personal preference; their, size, skill, age, attitudes, defence and their production is all on a similar level. I think LA might take Tuch over pick 8, but that doesn't mean Buffalo should. Can't remember a top 10 pick ever being traded for a player like Tuch. I guess what I'm saying is the packages are close enough that the adds matter. Also, 3OA is head and shoulders above anything above, and anything else we believe to be on the table. And Comtois is no slouch. There is a reason why Anaheim is believed to be the current focus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: Sure, this could happen again. But also he might decide he's not risking further injury for a team he's blowing off. I don't know what Jack is thinking or how petty he wants to get. If things do get ugly do you want this hanging over the team? Adams has time for now. But wait too long and things can get messy. I guess I just have a bit of a different read on Jack “the guy” than some others. I always see him give it his all. On and off the ice. I do see a Captain. The most “scandalous” player interview we’ve seen in ages was the first note in a one note salvo from Jack and overall wouldn’t qualify as a blip controversy in many other major sports. We are trading him, but, I still think it’s Adams motivated, and I still like Jack Eichel. I sure hope we don’t tar and feather the dude on his way out. Dude played really well here and by all accounts we never surrounded him with enough. 5 minutes ago, dudacek said: Agree with the first sentence, however: I like Krebs more than Turcotte as well, but that's a personal preference; their, size, skill, age, attitudes, defence and their production is all on a similar level. I think LA might take Tuch over pick 8, but that doesn't mean Buffalo should. Can't remember a top 10 pick ever being traded for a player like Tuch. I guess what I'm saying is the packages are close enough that the adds matter. Also, 3OA is head and shoulders above anything above, and anything else we believe to be on the table. And Comtois is no slouch. There is a reason why Anaheim is believed to be the current focus. I don’t value the 3rd overall like in a normal draft, and like you do though. Krebs is more valuable to me. He projects as well as Beniers for me and he’s ahead in timeline Edited June 25, 2021 by Thorny 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) Beniers is a 2-6 guy in a draft where the 2-6 guys are 7-11 guys in a regular draft. Krebs was 17 and shouldn’t have been close to that low. And he’s ahead in timeline. He definitely has a higher offensive ceiling, for one. What if Beniers isn’t on the board at 3 and we want a centre? I like the idea of adding an A centre prospect more than at any position given our system depth Edited June 25, 2021 by Thorny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi2000 Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 10 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: And then what? Suspend him indefinitely. He can sit out the remaining 5 years if he wants and his career is basically over. But I'm not trading him at a diminished value. If he wants out then prove to the league you're healthy so I can get fair value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 5 minutes ago, Thorny said: I guess I just have a bit of a different read on Jack “the guy” than some others. I always see him give it his all. On and off the ice. I do see a Captain. The most “scandalous” player interview we’ve seen in ages was the first note in a one note salvo from Jack and overall wouldn’t qualify as a blip controversy in many other major sports. We are trading him, but, I still think it’s Adams motivated, and I still like Jack Eichel. I sure hope we don’t tar and feather the dude on his way out. Dude played really well here and by all accounts we never surrounded him with enough. I admit I don't know Jack's mindset. He always played hard. But he also chose to drop a bomb at that "disconnect" press conference. The Sabres and Adams have to play this right. But we'll never really know what the best outcome is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PromoTheRobot Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 3 minutes ago, pi2000 said: Suspend him indefinitely. He can sit out the remaining 5 years if he wants and his career is basically over. But I'm not trading him at a diminished value. If he wants out then prove to the league you're healthy so I can get fair value. That should enhance the Sabres reputation. Maybe the NHLPA can file a grievance too. Meanwhile the young team has to play with that over their heads. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 Packers are playing hardball with a significantly bigger piece right now And a piece with significantly more sway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGR4GM Posted June 25, 2021 Author Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 16 minutes ago, dudacek said: Agree with the first sentence, however: I like Krebs more than Turcotte as well, but that's a personal preference; their, size, skill, age, attitudes, defence and their production is all on a similar level. I think LA might take Tuch over pick 8, but that doesn't mean Buffalo should. Can't remember a top 10 pick ever being traded for a player like Tuch. I guess what I'm saying is the packages are close enough that the adds matter. Also, 3OA is head and shoulders above anything above, and anything else we believe to be on the table. And Comtois is no slouch. There is a reason why Anaheim is believed to be the current focus. Unless Rossi is on the table. 3 minutes ago, PromoTheRobot said: That should enhance the Sabres reputation. Maybe the NHLPA can file a grievance too. Meanwhile the young team has to play with that over their heads. They don't care. They didn't care when eichel was gone for the last 30 games. The young guys don't have time to worry about eichel being potentially suspended. Also, he's getting traded so this is a moot convo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 30 minutes ago, Thorny said: Beniers is a 2-6 guy in a draft where the 2-6 guys are 7-11 guys in a regular draft. Krebs was 17 and shouldn’t have been close to that low. And he’s ahead in timeline. He definitely has a higher offensive ceiling, for one. What if Beniers isn’t on the board at 3 and we want a centre? I like the idea of adding an A centre prospect more than at any position given our system depth Where are you getting the higher offensive ceiling? Beniers draft year: 24 points in 24 games NHLe 27 Krebs draft year: 64 points in 68 games. NHLe 23 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 6 minutes ago, dudacek said: Where are you getting the higher offensive ceiling? Beniers draft year: 24 points in 24 games NHLe 27 Krebs draft year: 64 points in 68 games. NHLe 23 I guess from some of the latest talk from those in the know about Beniers ceiling being ~55 points He has a more dynamic game from the stuff I’ve watched. See a lot of Barzal Edited June 25, 2021 by Thorny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dudacek Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Thorny said: I guess from some of the latest talk from those in the know about Beniers ceiling being ~55 points I think that's closer his floor than his ceiling. He's a 50-70 player. Krebs' ceiling is probably 60-65 unless he ends up on the wing of a star, and his floor is lower than Beniers. Did you know that Krebs' production in his D+1 year that got everyone excited is slightly less than what Jack Quinn put up in his draft year? Edited June 25, 2021 by dudacek Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flashsabre Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 4 minutes ago, dudacek said: I think that's closer his floor than his ceiling. He's a 50-70 player. Krebs' is probably 60-65 unless he ends up on the wing of a star, and his floor is lower than Beniers. Did you know that Krebs' production in his D+1 year that got everyone excited is slightly less than what Jack Quinn put up in his draft year? 😁 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted June 25, 2021 Report Share Posted June 25, 2021 6 minutes ago, dudacek said: I think that's closer his floor than his ceiling. He's a 50-70 player. Krebs' is probably 60-65 unless he ends up on the wing of a star, and his floor is lower than Beniers. Did you know that Krebs' production in his D+1 year that got everyone excited is slightly less than what Jack Quinn put up in his draft year? Yes I did know that! My issue with Jack Quinn however, as numerously stated is that his encouraging junior production consisted of a grand total of 1 season, betting on a sample size of 1 season. There’s no way Beniers has a floor of 55 points imo. think it was Hoss earlier arguing Liger about that and I agree, except it was about an Anthony Cirelli floor: he’d be a slam dunk 1 overall in this draft if his basement floor was 55 points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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