WildCard Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 because it is the only thing anyone seems to be able to criticize. Well that's not true at all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 Well that's not true at all I know, it was an overstatement. But effort is something Kane brings - maybe even a little too much - to which you astutely pointed out, after the rib incident, he seemed to play a little more carefully. If you have to point to a winger's effort in the d-zone to illustrate their overall "lack of effort," you're grasping at straws Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheAud Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 I know, it was an overstatement. But effort is something Kane brings - maybe even a little too much - to which you astutely pointed out, after the rib incident, he seemed to play a little more carefully. If you have to point to a winger's effort in the d-zone to illustrate their overall "lack of effort," you're grasping at straws I also agree winger's effort, or rather effectiveness, on D is important. That said, I don't really have a strong opinion on Kane's defensive effectiveness. Seems about average to me. He's not good at setting up teammates. This is easy to see in watching his style of offensive game over a period of time. His career high in assists is 27, back in his best season in 2011-2012. I don't think it's unfair to say that 15 assists per year (i.e. both seasons in Buffalo) is an argument against a long term, big buck extension. Maybe there are mitigating factors such as missing some games, playing with weaker linemates, etc., but still, it's not like Kane is a 40 goal scorer, or even 35. He hit exactly 30 once, that same magical 2011-2012 season. I like the guy as a power forward/scorer type and wish he could be signed to an extension that aligned with his production and value. (I voted 5 years at 6.5/year) But I just don't see that happening as Kane can probably get that or better as an UFA and get to have some say in where he plays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 Kane skates hard in the dzone but the number of goals scored against us while he's on the ice relative to his teammates might make one lean towards the conclusion that he's not very effective at helping to defend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffismagic Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 Put me down in the sign Kane camp. I like what he brings to the table. We need guys that can intimidate in our top 9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 Put me down in the sign Kane camp. I like what he brings to the table. We need guys that can intimidate in our top 9. This isn't the 1980s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 This isn't the 1980s All the more reason 28 goals is increasingly important. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 All the more reason 28 goals is increasingly important. I mean in general I don't care about 'intimidation'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorny Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 I mean in general I don't care about 'intimidation'. And you have several problems with "Imitation" as well, judging from the movie thread. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 And you have several problems with "Imitation" as well, judging from the movie thread. Ah I see what you did there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 I was calling someone out who said Kane doesn't give a consistent effort. I think that is patently incorrect and a sign of bias. All other points are valid (effectiveness in d zone, play-making abilities [or lack thereof]), but to Wildcard- we don't have to play 80s style hockey for it to be a factor that Kane is a physical presence that makes him harder to play against. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nfreeman Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 I was calling someone out who said Kane doesn't give a consistent effort. I think that is patently incorrect and a sign of bias. All other points are valid (effectiveness in d zone, play-making abilities [or lack thereof]), but to Wildcard- we don't have to play 80s style hockey for it to be a factor that Kane is a physical presence that makes him harder to play against. What kind of "bias," exactly? Having an opinion on something that differs from someone else's opinion doesn't mean you have a "bias." It just means you have a different opinion. Kane has certainly created enough issues during his career to earn some skepticism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 nfreeman, throwing down the law left and right. I like it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pokey Jones Posted September 13, 2017 Report Share Posted September 13, 2017 nothing. trade him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 What kind of "bias," exactly? I think a majority of people here who watch Kane play would agree that, despite his flaws on the ice, he gives a 100% effort every night, throws his body around, skates hard, etc. It is my opinion that a bias could lead someone to think his effort is inconsistent. Could be any kind of bias ;) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 On one hand, I want him gone because I think he'll cost too much, is injury prone, etc. On the other hand, the dude can play, adds a different dimension, and, well, if we trade him, that means we're out of the playoff picture by January. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 Nobody here dislikes Kane's play because of implicit racial bias You should hear us talk about Nic Deslauriers, Josh Gorges, and Zach Bogosian Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 (edited) Nobody here dislikes Kane's play because of implicit racial bias You should hear us talk about Nic Deslauriers, Josh Gorges, and Zach Bogosian That's your view, and I respect that. There are many, many people here who seem to have somehow forgot that Kane led the team in goals. There are people who have said "he's a cancer in the locker room," when there are absolutely no reports during his time on the Sabres that validate that. And the comment about him not giving consistent effort- ? At a certain point, I begin to wonder. I thought he was the type of player Buffalo would love- fast, physical, scores goals... but everyone wants to trade him. And somehow they think his production is easily replaceable, the way the talk about it... Some things just don't add up... Edited September 14, 2017 by ericcomposer72 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 Nobody here dislikes Kane's play because of implicit racial bias You should hear us talk about Nic Deslauriers, Josh Gorges, and Zach Bogosian Wait, what? That's your view, and I respect that. There are many, many people here who seem to have somehow forgot that Kane led the team in goals. There are people who have said "he's a cancer in the locker room," when there are absolutely no reports during his time on the Sabres that validate that. And the comment about him not giving consistent effort- ? At a certain point, I begin to wonder. I thought he was the type of player Buffalo would love- fast, physical, scores goals... but everyone wants to trade him. And somehow they think his production is easily replaceable, the way the talk about it... Some things just don't add up... Well, it's not his race, if that's what you're insinuating. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 That's your view, and I respect that. There are many, many people here who seem to have somehow forgot that Kane led the team in goals. There are people who have said "he's a cancer in the locker room," when there are absolutely no reports during his time on the Sabres that validate that. And the comment about him not giving consistent effort- ? At a certain point, I begin to wonder. I thought he was the type of player Buffalo would love- fast, physical, scores goals... but everyone wants to trade him. And somehow they think his production is easily replaceable, the way the talk about it... Some things just don't add up... I'm positive that if you gave everyone on this board a pop quiz they would know that Kane scored the most goals for us last year, and most could name that number and the number of the guy behind him. I haven't heard the claim that he's a cancer for months, I've heard it about Jack, Sam, and Robin dozens of times this summer. The consistent effort complaint is also one given to Eichel and Nylander. None of this is unique to Kane or even to the magnitude of other players. I really think the only bias in this thread is your counter bias, which is well-intentioned. Trust me, this ain't the bills board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 Wait, what? Well, it's not his race, if that's what you're insinuating. I'm glad it's not, for you guys. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 I'm glad it's not, for you guys. I don't think it is for anyone Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
erickompositör72 Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 alright, I'm just trying to keep people honest. I'm a pretty fair-minded person, and I've just read some things that made my stomach turn. I'll try to give people the benefit of the doubt, unless it is something blatant. I don't think it is for anyone Not really possible to know. A lot of these things are veiled Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randall Flagg Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 alright, I'm just trying to keep people honest. I'm a pretty fair-minded person, and I've just read some things that made my stomach turn. I'll try to give people the benefit of the doubt, unless it is something blatant. Not really possible to know. A lot of these things are veiled It basically comes down to the fact that we, rightly or wrongly, trust the people that we've read on this forum for a long time. I know how nasty WNY can be in general about stuff like that but I truly believe that this forum is a haven of brilliance and equality and liberty and other Neo words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WildCard Posted September 14, 2017 Report Share Posted September 14, 2017 alright, I'm just trying to keep people honest. I'm a pretty fair-minded person, and I've just read some things that made my stomach turn. I'll try to give people the benefit of the doubt, unless it is something blatant. Not really possible to know. A lot of these things are veiled But they really aren't. Every criticism against him has been validated and expounded upon ad nauseam. It has absolutely nothing to do with his race at all, by any poster on this board. It basically comes down to the fact that we, rightly or wrongly, trust the people that we've read on this forum for a long time. I know how nasty WNY can be in general about stuff like that but I truly believe that this forum is a haven of brilliance and equality and liberty and other Neo words. Right. Those type of posters don't last long on here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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